Where's Carville???

because of his wife, and while that might not be fair, it makes me question the principles of either one

Otherwise, I don't care.

Especially since eventually it will strike a Democrat where there is a Republican governor and then the press and GOP will have a field day calling out Dem hypocrisy.

Republican hypocrisy is the problem and they do not fucking care. Not one bit.

Although I think being the 'sexual assault' police is the dumbest move the Democrats could make

We should be busy winning every election for the next four years.

Instead, we're cutting our own throats.

Me

On the other hand, some of us care greatly about acts that aren't consented to. Whether it's Roy Moore going after underage teenagers or Franken and Trump groping women or Louie CK masturbating in front of women. If you touch people without their consent that isn't sex, it's sexual assault.

It's incredibly frustrating how repeatedly the pro-Franken side intentionally diminishes what Franken has been accused of simply because they like Franken. It makes it hard to take any of the arguments on that side seriously when so often the actual basic facts of what Franken is accused of are replaced with some very creative reinterpretations that bear only a vague resemblance to the actual accusations.

charges have any validity? I for one do not want to see people brought down in a witch hunt...allegations are not enough. And touching someones waste during a picture is not sexual harassment either.

Most of the named accusers were Republicans. The one who started it is a hyper partisan Republican who is friends with Sean Hannity.

as they are anonymous, we have no idea who or what they are. The GOP tried with Tweeden who is a Sean buddy and it turns out also is friends with Trump Jr...the second one who claimed while her husband took a picture, Franken groped her voted for Trump. We have no idea who the others were...To destroy a man with flimsy evidence like this is a damned disgrace. I will vote for none who participated in this denial of due process in a presidential primary. I fear this was about presidential politics...and I am really angry about it. The right wing smear machine swung into action and Gillibrand and others caved...not presidential material.

For binkie

many young people had a problem with Al Gore because of Tipper Gore's work on censorship.

and Gore and Bush ended up getting about the same percentage of young voters.

these things wont make much difference among republicans. the fact they voted for trump says a lot about them and their values.

And puts people who conspire with foreign powers or engage in espionage against the US in maximum-security facilities for life

it's a flash in the pan by itself. There needs to be a real message in what we stand for and what we believe.

This is what I don't like about the religious right. Now the Dems are doing it and Im finding myself agreeing with people like Laura Ingraham and Newt Gingrich.

51% of white women voted for Trump their not going to turnaround and vote Democratic just because we throw our own under the bus for being accused of doing much less. We were probably going to get some of those back, but not because of the sex stuff, but because of economic issues and healthcare. In addition we have an opportunity to get some soft republican male voters who are unhappy with the broken promises of Trump and republicans. Going over board with sex stuff may give them a reason to not vote for us.

Culture war issues are usually low on polls about what voters find to be their most important issues. The top issues are usually things like the economy and healthcare. There is a big divide between what the political class (activists, journalists and politicians) see as big issues and what actually gets ordinary people out to vote.

And I hate that "police" is now a euphemism.

I am a survivor of a violent rape attempt. By muddying the water, some make it harder for women to be believed. A touch on the waist or whatever is not sexual abuse. It just isn't. One of the reasons I hate yes hate Tweeden...is liars like her who lie for various reasons make it difficult for women to be believed. This situation might make some feel good about how they are fighting for right ...blah blah...but it is really not true. Taking down Franken won't help any women and if the GOP uses it to steal the seat, it will hurt many women. My attempted rape was prosecutable (never caught the guy), it was a 'good' one as I was beaten and had broken ribs...but my friend who was raped by her date could not obtain justice period. And this will make it only harder for such women...you all think you are doing good and supporting women, but you are not.The self righteous holier than thou stuff will backfire on women...you all are worried about a touch on a thigh when thousands of rape kits languish in all 50 states and few are convicted. This was never worth risking a Blue Senatorial seat in a purple state. never.

I agree that Franken was set up... but conflating sex w sex harassment is an issue.

So who on DU has made that argument? Who within the progressive community has made that argument? Indeed, who has made that argument?

No one? Just a prophecy of what may happen?