we got several Jewish Holidays off and certainly teachers knew to respect Hanukkah - and that t hey had to plan the semester accordingly (many of my teachers were also Jewish.

I think schools need to be responsive to their kids. If the population were Muslim, for instance, then those holidays should be offered as vacation days.

It is kind of silly to call it anything but Christmas break. Hanukkah is going on right now and schools are still in session. They definitely won't be on December 25.

"It is kind of silly to call it anything but Christmas break..."

And the pagan origins of New Years makes its state state sanctioned holiday just as discriminatory. Yet I'd imagine anyone implying it dismisses the Jewish faith, or the Christian faith, or the Rastafarian faith a rather great fool...


Dust off, or get from the library the Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and take a weekend to read it. All of your most sincere and highly genuine arguments have already been made, addressed, countered, re-countered and summed up in that law.

... YOU need to dust it off.

Edit: especially if you think students are employees.

However, unlike Christmas (which is always on December 25), Hanukkah's dates change every year.

not so much. actually, the complete lack of recognition of jewish holidays didn't bother me much because we actually celebrated very few of them.

what bothered me more was the rotten things kids (mostly) would do and say, out of complete ignorance and religious brainwashing.

such as throwing pennies at me.
or being baffled by my judaism as they honestly thought judaism died 2,000 years ago.
or asking where were my horns.
or wondering what it must be like to go through life knowing i'm going to hell in the end.

mini-unblock has it much better, being in a town that's about 50% jewish. there's nowhere near that level of ignorance.

A bad translation of the description of Moses descending from Mt Sinai. "Rays of light" shining from his countenance became "horns". And then that was immortalized by Michalangelo in his sculpture of Moses.

the grand-daddy of them all is hatred of jews for killing their savior.

that always makes my head spin.

a jew is killed by romans, but somehow that's an excuse to hate on jews.

two millenia later, no less, and this by a religion built on forgiveness and turning the other cheek.

not all christians, of course, just enough to keep it a problem.

And i didn't grow up Jewish. Grew up catholic and never got how the romans crucify a guy, 4 books (or more) are written about that event, and someone else gets blamed.

I couldn't have been but 9 or 10 years old when i knew that didn't make sense.

sculpture of Moses. The "rays of light" look like horns. Can't figure out how to post the pic but here's a link to the sculpture:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moses_(Michelangelo)#/media/File:Moses_Michaelangelo_September_2015-1.jpg

Now the strange thing is, who the hell would have translated it to mean "horns" when it should be obvious that rays of light were shining from his countenance? And then, who the hell would have believed that translation? THAT is the real mystery.

It was the Latin translation of the Bible used at that time. Moses is described as having “rays of the skin of his face.” Jerome translated it to horns from the word keren, which means either radiated or grew horns. ... Michelangelo was not the only artist to put horns on Moses.

Context, Jerome, context.

During Ramadan. Any Muslims in here to confirm?

The high holidays (Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kipput) are deeply important and the Jewish kids should get consideration for those.

Hanukkah is really just a thing that was made more commercial so Jewish kids don't feel so deprived every year watching everyone else have fun. It's for little ones mainly, college kids are not missing out so much. There's no huge deal with observing it.

So I disagree with the article.

What is the point in calling it "holiday break" or "winter break" if it really is entirely centered around allowing students who celebrate Christmas to spend Christmas with their families (and not allowing Jews to celebrate Hanukkah with their families)?

I would also add that in the US, Hannukah has become a holiday of importance, especially for secular Jews - a time to spend with family, exchange presents, light candles, etc.

There are countless non-religious and secular students who celebrate Christmas as a similar spend-time-with-family sort of experience.

The holiday of Hanukkah is fun. It's cute. Latkes are delicious and candles are pretty. But there's no religious significance and I doubt college kids (my own included) are crying because they have to celebrate it a few days later after finals.

This detracts from a much bigger and more important question about the real holidays I mentioned before. That's harder for kids because those are really family-centered and important. I would also add Passover to the list, that one makes you really wish you could celebrate with family. Hanukkah? No.

Christ wasn't even born on christmas. Christmas didn't become a thing, like we know it until the 1900's. It was actually not even celebrated in the US for a good long while.

Easter is supposed to be the big ta-do in Christianity not christmas.

And the whole crucifixion thing is just depressing.

The Church absorbed all the cool holidays and just found some way to make it Christian. Even faking Jesus' birth date.

Early Christianity was no fun at all. The founders of the faith wanted people to forget all about the religions they'd come from and just be Christians, but the beginnings of Christianity were a little like being in basic training your whole life: if you want to go to Heaven you must pay your dues on Earth, and those dues are a joyless existence. (Which leads to the next question: Why would anyone invent such a thing? Forget "why would they join that church?"; "convert or die" was a common recruiting tactic. But seriously, why create a system that demands no one have any fun at all?) People continued to perform their ancient rituals like Eostre and Yule, and the elders realized they had to do something to keep the flock in line. So, God informed the elders of these great NEW celebrations, Christmas (which celebrates the birth of Jesus) and Easter (which celebrates his ascension into Heaven), and they're celebrated Just Like Eostre and Yule!

Now the date each year is based on the lunar calendar because of Passover.

But the whole foundation of Christianity was Christ defeating death and rising, Easter.

Of course what you described happens later.

After the 1900's corporate America took over and thus many are encouraged to go in debit to try and have that perfect Christmas. Like in that Norman Rockwell painting.

HINT:. It is NOT ascending into Heaven


You obviously have no idea what the hell you are talking about; Why post this shit?

Plus, those high holy days ARE the days that are off in NY (where I grew up - mostly Christian/Catholic and Jewish population).

Last edited Thu Dec 14, 2017, 11:27 AM - Edit history (1)

a minority, and society caters to the majority

And, of course, clustering of most of that 3% in cities and certain neighborhoods is why a couple of people here in the south have innocently (as in wonderingly) told me they've never met a Jew. Probably almost true.

Yet all of the state universities are required to have them.

and growing up as a Jew in the 50's and 60's, I saw things from the worst perspectives of anti-Semitism.

Your example of disabled people being given access is NOT the same thing. Disabilities are independent of someone's religious or cultural beliefs.

The U.S. is a secular country, but the majority of its population are Christian, and that is why the focus is directed toward Christian holidays, and not Jewish Holidays, or Chinese Holidays, or Muslim Holidays etc.

What has changed is how these holidays are referred to. What used to be referred to as Christmas break, is now many times being referred to as Winter break. Easter break is now referred to as Spring break.

Perhaps we should change everything to a lunar calendar while we are at it, since Jews, Chinese, and Muslims all use a lunar calendar to celebrate their important holidays. Unfortunately, their lunar calendars don't agree with the Gregorian calendar, nor do they agree with each other

Sometimes they go out of their way to accommodate a small minority, even if it means inconveniencing the majority (i.e. making everyone pay higher tuition to pay for campus accommodations for students with disabilities).

As I've asked a few times on this thread, what is the point of referring to Christmas break as winter break when it is scheduled deliberately around Christmas? The student who wrote the OP makes a good point in suggesting that the nomenclature suggests something other than what it is.

Either acknowledge that the time off from school is structured around accommodating students who celebrate Christmas, or have the break fall over other winter dates sometimes.

the schools are closed for Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur, which are far more significant holidays in the Jewish calendar. I personally think schools should also be closed for at least the first day of Hanukkah, but the reality is that Hannukah is not as significant in the Jewish calendar as Christmas is in the Christian one. Christmas also happens to fall just one week before New Years, and about right in the middle of the school year, so it does make sense to have a holiday break during that time......

They are both days of prayer for religious, observant Jews.

Hannukah for many secular Jews, like Christmas for many secular Christians, is a day to cook and eat and have get togethers with family and friends.

Also the middle of the school year is actually in early to mid February.

which is why I think that at least the first day of Hanukkah should also be a holiday, as I said in my previous post, even though it is not a Shabbaton holiday. I don't think it is feasible to close the schools for the whole 8 days, though. In fact, not even the Jewish schools in my area are closed for Hanukkah. (They close for "winter break" between Dec. 25 and Jan. 1).

And while you are correct that the precise middle of the school year does indeed fall closer to February, the fact of Christmas being close to New Years and it being roughly the middle of the school year makes it kind of common sense for close to close at that time.

I learned they all celebrate all the holidays. The Muslims celebrate Christmas and the Christians celebrate Eid, etc.

See German calendar https://publicholidays.de/2018-dates/

Capitalism dictates the schedule not religion.....
Many get off early on Christmas Eve.
Most get off Christmas day.
Then " boxing" day one of the biggest shopping/ return days .
Most are back to work.
No employer is going to give anyone 8 days of celebration let alone the month of Ramadan.
It's all about the $$$$$ for employers.

Most schools in the US give students the entire week off for Christmas.

And three months in summer.

bell ringer wishes me a Merry Christmas, I always ask them if they know what Jesus use to say. Happy Hanukkah everyone. I get some strange looks from them.

They do not work for the SalvationArmy. They probably wonder why you want to start a theological discussion when they are simply raising money for the needy. I put money in a kettle the other day and the bell ringer simply said thank you. Some sometimes say god bless you, some say Merry Christmas. I simply smile, respond in kind or just say thank you.

As with Columbus day and every holiday, someone will make a stink about an issue for the sole reason of making a stink about the issue.

If you're going to compare the prayers we had the opportunity to witness last night with Columbus Day..

Yeah, I have concerns about the Christians trying to rush their predicted Armageddon by creating the conditions for the Temple to be rebuilt. But I don't fault the sincere followers of Judaism for that political mess, nor am I going to stomp on a holiday about the Second Temple.

..as say Yom Kippur or Rosh Hashanah. And at least in my state, in districts which have a sizable Jewish population schools are closed on those particular holidays.

And at least since I was in school in the 70's and 80's it was always called Winter Break, at least by me.

In particular for secular Jews - which are the majority in the United States.

Yom Kippur and Rosh Hashanah are not "get together with your family and have a party" type holidays the way that Christmas and Hannukah are.

Both are solemn occasions where religious Jews spend the majority of the day in synagogue praying.

Not in the Torah. I would love to have it off to make latkes but never felt slighted. When I was interviewing for my job, I told my boss I would always need first day of Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kippur and the first day of Passover off and wouldn't use vacation days. He was fine. He's Catholic but married to a Jewish lady. These days off in New York are not uncommon. Even the stock market is very quiet those days.

Christians seem to think they are the only religion. We all have to listen to those crappy songs everywhere we go starting at Thanksgiving. Time to open it up to all beliefs and let people decide what holiday they will recognize. I declare war on Christmas. Sorry if I offend. If you believe in Christ and the bible spend your time reading and practicing the gospel not shopping. Let others practice their religion as they believe.

Have you been made to go to Midnight Mass? Obligated to attend a Nativity scene? Pray for several hours on Good Friday?

I don't think so.

You can choose to observe or not to observe as you see fit.

As for the dumb holiday songs, since I don't listen to commercial radio or watch broadcast TV I'm rarely subject to them. And I don't go to malls all that often. If I do this time of year, I don't find it that hard to ignore them.

Although doing the Stations of the Cross is traditional, but not required

So if even Catholics aren't obligated to pray on Good Friday, I don't know what the fuck everyone else is complaining about.

I was raised Roman Catholic. I can recall even before I made my First Communion having doubts, but of course I wasn't really allowed to express those doubts. I had many fights with my mother when I was in high school about going to mass. Sigh. Once I left home and stopped going to mass my life was much better.

For what it's worth, by the late 1980's not a single one of us (I'm one of six kids) were still going to mass. Not even Mom.

When I married a Jewish man we chose to raise our two sons in Judaism, which was more than fine with me. I kind of wanted to give them something (and to all of you who say that's not necessary, I say, I hear you, but this is what I chose) and doing the Jewish faith worked. Plus, my husband found a temple (in Kansas City) which didn't do Bar or Bat Mitzvahs, but did confirmation, which according to my now ex, was what Reform Judaism originally went with. No matter.

We cheerfully observed all the holidays. I knew other families in similar mixed marriages who were totally convinced you had to do one or the other but not both. Excuse me? Kids can quickly learn that Mom's family does one thing and Dad's family does another. Plus, there's an abundance of holidays (Christmas! Hanukkah! Easter! Passover! Yom Kuppur!) that is truly wonderful.

My point is, that you can observe or not observe what you wish. I do understand that in public schools, especially in certain smaller towns or in certain parts of the country, observation of Christian holidays comes across as obligatory. You need to pick your fights. I'm not where you are, so I can't give generic advice. But I can assure you that no one is obligating you to observe something you don't want to observe. It is simply up to you as to how public you want to go with your stand.

Honest.

Most Jewish holidays fluctuate. Heck, Hanukkah is not even going to be celebrated in 2030 (if my memory serves me). It won't start until the first week of January that season.

Easter is similar, in that it fluctuates. Spring break is typically set based on the school calendar, not when Easter is (though some districts have an explicit Easter break).

Your last, bolded statement is correct. Christianity is mainstreamed, being the vastly majority religion for the entire history of the country. So, while it may not seem fair, what is the solution? Give holidays off for every religion? In some school districts, that would entail over a dozen different calendars to contend with. Where do you draw the line? Would there be any school days left?

Calling it "holiday break" but having it begin when Hannukah is already over is a bit insulting. It's quite obviously scheduled around Christmas and only Christmas.

It is more than a bit disingenuous to call it winter break, but that is the current politically correct compromise.

It must be a war on Hannukah.

I guess it's a joke to some people.

It shouldn't. I had friends who were Jewish when I was a child...and went to their homes during Hanukkah (they were reformed)... some had Hanukkah bushes, and I was so jealous because they got presents for days...I feel there is not enough joy in this world. I don't see that celebrating Christmas, Easter or Hanukkah hurts anyone. I say celebrate every damn holiday and maybe make up a few just for fun.

and Christian enjoy the winter break.

has days off for Yom Kippur and Rosh Hashanah. That said, I think in most areas, there is a smaller Jewish population, so they don't get as much input into holiday policy

With a variety of students from different backgrounds.

"Winter break"

it's because Christmas Day and New Years Day are exactly one week apart. It makes sense to make that entire week a holiday. It's not like we can "schedule" Chanukkah for a specific date as it's different every year.

I don't count it as a real holiday. Come on, a rabbinical holiday is not the same as one that is actually mentioned in Torah. I'd be less curmudgeonly if it weren't tied to xmas.

I think Hannukah has taken on a similar role for many secular Jews in the US.

I am, however, down with eating latkes and doughnuts!

But I do like the families-getting-together-and-cooking-and-eating-and-chatting aspects of both Christmas and Hanukkah.

Some people really enjoy it. I like giving people I love gifts...good at picking out stuff...but the Christmas brunch and dinner is what you remember. I enjoy the Christmas season. I swear the world is now populated with 'fun suckers'.

All of the Christians and others had the Jewish holidays off too.

I very much doubt Hanukkah is one of them.

it was my nephews, and i asked why they were home and they said it was a Jewish Holiday.

...that Jewish students don't receive "equal time to travel back home" for Hanukkah because it's eight days long and at a different time every year?

celebrated Jewish and Christian holidays. When I went away to college in upstate (WAY) upstate NY, the community seemed so dull — not to mention lacking in a great sense of humor!

Wow - ok.

What's wrong with reminding a student he has options if he feels his university is unsympathetic or indifferent to his personal beliefs? I've been telling conservative Christians to go to Regent or Liberty or whatever for ages...

Because right now all I see is a solitary student on a campus of 33,000 saying San Diego State needs to make a two-week shift in their academic calendar just to accommodate him... He hasn't taken the general temperature of other Jewish students/faculty, researched the feasibility of making a change, or even offered any alternate proposals himself... Like most classic Millennials, he just wants the Board of Directors to snap their fingers and instantly make it happen.

I swear I'm not trying to sound overly harsh, I just work at a university and see/hear firsthand how many students want policy changed just for their benefit so I don't have a lot of patience for this... If the author was just writing some navel-gazing fluff to fill out the op-ed page, fine... But if the author is serious about making a change, then there are some very specific steps he'll have to take...

I mean, that's what they would say.

It is far more important to insure that calendars recognize Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kippur, and at least the first night of Passover. Though fun, Hanukkah is a minor holiday.

In terms of importance, Christmas and Easter are more like Yom Kippur and Rosh Hashana.

Little Jewish children do not look forward to Yom Kippur.

Rosh Hashanah is also a day meant to be spent in synagogue, praying.

Neither is remotely similar to Christmas.

In the US, for secular Jews (who are the majority), the closest thing to Christmas is Hanukkah.

Family and friends gather together, gifts are exchanged, delicious food is prepared.

always will be.

We and our children are fortunate when in open-minded, aware places/schools, like my daughters' secondary Catholic school (in DC,) wherein both of their teachers asked them to tell their class about Hanukah.

...sending a note to the Teacher you will be out for "insert important holiday"...get a weird look, ask for class/home work in advance, get told not all of it has been decided and get a couple of days worth, out for the whole week because the parents were strict that way, come back, mountain of class and homework...oh and tests, they were not delayed for you just because you were out.

But I did have fun telling everyone Santa and the Easter Bunny never existed.

Well said.

... and the schools don't close for Hanukkah. They do close for Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kippur and the first day of Passover.

Our December school break is actually called "Winter Break."