He made his bed. Maybe he ought to rethink that new law where the cops can shoot demonstrators for any reason or none at all?

government of Venezuela will stop enabling the OIL oilgarchs to get away with what they've been doing. A lot like this thread:

Krugman on Putin: defending a kleptocracy, not the downtrodden masses

Putin’s thrashing, his evident decision to reject advice from economists who tell him anything he doesn’t want to hear, feel very familiar to me and I’m sure many others who’ve followed Latin America over the decades. Basically, it sounds a lot like good old-fashioned economic populism.

There is, however, one interesting difference. The stories Dornbusch and Edwards analyzed, the issues of Latin America today, involved governments that really were trying to help the poor and workers with low wages. That is, they really were populist regimes, even if they didn’t end up serving the interests of their constituency. But nobody would call the Putin regime populist; he’s rejecting economics as we know it to defend a kleptocracy, not the downtrodden masses.

Have there been comparable examples? I’m sure there must have been, but I can’t think of them. Malaysia’s imposition of capital controls in 1998 was in part about rescuing its version of oligarchs, but it was actually a reasonable policy given the circumstances, and worked OK. And otherwise I’m coming up blank.

So Putin seems to have brought something new, or at least formerly rare, into the world of economic policy: economic cronyism, an effort to suspend the laws on economics on behalf, not of the broad populace, but a tiny group of well connected malefactors of great wealth. Innovation!

http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/02/03/macroeconomic-cronyism/?_r=0

to pampango:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026178084

Lot more at the blog linked. It's as if he read your post that day on what is going in Venezuela. The ideology has been for the masses, the wealth is still going to the top with government complicity. We've been naive about what these leaders are doing.

I'm sure you have read the link about how Putin's net worth is now $40B. Not bad, but being PM or President doesn't pay that well. It's from selling Russians out along with some blatant gangsterism.

Yet he's being sold to the left as one of them. You can't really separate the words from the deeds. The old myths and dreams die hard, this is a time when we are going to learn an awful lot about how the world is really run, not as we want.

What I wanna know, is why they're always so nasty after a few posts that they don't like?

I mean, they are UGLASS as bravenak says in her blog.

They are nice if they think they made a convert, act all suave as if they are doing us a favor by enlightening us. They pat us on the head so happily.

But if things are said that go against the Cult, out comes the vile insults, name calling and accusations. They have very short fuses!

And they can never say one good thing about the USA or Obama. It's as if they're being watched, huh?

Has to be one of those people we read about that is a paid poster. I dont think any of his posts would be allowed here.

allowed here". Have you seen some of the stuff that gets posted & recc'd up? I've been wondering when might the Admins step in, because most of it is just pure anti-US crap, lifted directly from the pages of RT.com.

And they post here regularly
I know I miss a lot because I usually just look at the news feed and dont jump around to different rooms.

It America, it seems to be just sort of a "policy", except you don't need to be demonstrating, just black.

in the Constitution. Now, if they don't like the cut of your jib, they'll shoot ya. If you are a high school or college student involved in a demonstration, you're fair game.

Police shootings at demonstrations are disgraceful anywhere, and should not be tolerated, but VZ beats us by a mile. Our police would have to take training from Cuba's errr.... Venezuela's police force to get to the level at which they are operating.

You can see the assaults/murders on YOUTUBE--they're posted.

See money can buy anything including traitors and scoundrels to destroy their own country.

Next up, any South American country who dares to have a real democratic economic system. You know, one of those countries who don't let the uber rich and capital rule them. Those countries where Money does NOT buy everything. Oh wait they are called socialist countries and we in the US really can't allow our dysfunctional capitalism to be throw off by people in South America.

be because of stupidity in the venezuelan government. It has to be some kind of nefarious CIA plot, right?
Couldn't be because of Maduro's heavy handed tactics like sending soldiers into electronics stores scares away business to check prices.

Give me a break. The anti-socialists have been salivating over Venezuela ever since Chavez died. The uber rich oligarchy just don't like it that money doesn't rule the government. Dysfunctional capitalism US style is what the uber rich have the hots for and they are NOT going to let off disrupting Venezuela until they have it back in their cold dead hands.

Toilet paper. Cooking oil. Diapers. Dish soap. These are things that the people of Venezuela need. But no one is willing to risk their business by selling down there. People fear their stuff will be nationalized, or Maduro won't pay them. The airlines have cut flights in and out of the country. Their currency is worthless. That WILL topple a government.

He's going to have to make some changes. No one is going to lend him any more money. China is going to end up owning them.

Uber rich capitalist buying up all the democratic governments because they are so afraid of the unwashed poor they have created.

Peru is booming as is Colombia. Peru, Chile, Brazil, Ecuador, all have left of center governments and are doing fairly well economically.

You do have the evidence don't you?

VZ has a problem with corruption. It always has.

When you pile incompetence--gross incompetence--and an inability to make even the most basic economic decisions--never mind decisions involving the public welfare--you end up with a failed state.

Maduro made this mess, all by himself.

Last edited Thu Feb 5, 2015, 11:33 PM - Edit history (1)

As well as depth, discussion, conversation...!

I think if you look hard enough, you can find something good in the nastiest person (or system of government, for that matter). And by the same token, even saints and utopias can get on one's nerves!

Hair's footsteps behind him.

literal translation of his name in Spanish to English. Diosdado (God-given) Cabello (hair).

He's also a millionaire many times over (serving as the right hand to the late Hugo worked out well for him) ....that public servant work pays well down in VZ--even as those on the lowest rungs live on crumbs. They don't call 'em "Boligarchs" for nothing!

and Venezuela to get past this Bolivarian revolution romance and bury the hatchet. The Venezualan people deserve peace and a decent standard of living given their resources.

There is no reason Venezuela can't succeed. But the Chavistas need to realize their plan is not sustainable and that they really need to change course.

"You evil imperialists! Could you perhaps float a small loan?"

it'd pretty much be a gift. No way Maduro would ever pay it back.
Everyone hates the west. Until they need something. Lol

It must really hurt his pride to be reaching out to the U.S. Old Hugo must be spinning in his grave.

Raul did.

There are plenty of people who think that Chavez died well before they said he did, and in Cuba, not VZ. I think those people might be right.

If not he may be trying to sell the last bit off to the highest bidder. I think Oil is around 50% of their economy, if not more. He's digging a deep hole for the future recovery of the country by trading it away for half its worth like he's been doing with China.

But according to an article in fortune, oil comprises at least 90% of the Venezuelan economy. So when the price of oil drops of it is Venezuela is sunk.
So the first step is to establish some kind of trust between Venezula and the people that can import products. No one is going to risk millions in establishing industry if they think Maduro is going to steal it. No one is going to sell down there if it's not worth their time.

I thought it was around 65% of their exports and 50% of their economy. They're in a lot worse shape than I thought, and all things taken into consideration it's not going to improve much even as oil goes up with the deal they've worked with China. What a mess they're in!

Any more loans because of all the times that Mataro has reneged on contracts and expropriated things that blunt other people. In short his credit rating is about 400, and he's trying to get a house loan.

The politics there are openly hostile to the American government, so it's not as if he could honestly expect a bailout from the US. He just sees the ship sinking and is sending out distress signals.

The people can't take much more of this, he's in a bad situation that isn't going to improve. Even after he's gone, the country is still going to be a mess for decades now.

Going to have to totally change a lot of policies. But he needs people that are tired of being burned by him. People from the oil industry. The airlines. The importers. They import a huge amount of their food. What he needs to do is get rid of the anti-American rhetoric and start mending some fences. I'm not talking about from a respect level. I don't care about this guy disrespecting the US. I could give a crap. But people aren't willing to help you if you keep calling them Satan. And it makes you look mentally unstable. It might play well to the crowds at home. But to the rest of the world, you're a laughing stock that no one needs.

The US has a bad reputation in the region, which isn't totally undeserved due to historic events. However, if they want to be an independent and thriving country they need to learn the art of diplomacy and mature politically. They're miles from that point at the moment, which leaves them in the current mess. There will be no rapid development of relations between Venezuela and the US, and everyone knows that, especially Maduro. He could begin to try to establish relations with the US, but the process of changing minds of the people is another thing which will take lots of hard work from both countries to fully establish. Which is further complicated by the future regime changes on both sides who will want to exploit the rift again and toss a wrench into any progress. I don't expect to see much progress in that area if you can't tell.

What they need to focus on right now is channeling as much of their resources as possible into becoming a more diverse economy and more self sufficient. They need industry, which they need to support so it grows and encourages others to invest in their future. They're operating right now on an economic policy which isn't sustainable, which is painfully obvious. I wish them the best with that, it won't be an easy process at this point. Hopefully they won't get all oil money drunk again and will focus on the long game and the good of the people.

... But if you want help from us, you had better at least tone down the rhetoric. Obama isn't perfect, but he's not looking to raid South America ala the United Fruit debacle.

I'm perfectly willing to help the Venezuelan people.... But not if they are going to insult my country every time they turn around.

The oil-richest country in the world is struggling. Commodity prices are plunging, while the economy is weakening. But instead of instigating reforms, President Maduro is looking for new loans.

Ninety-six percent of Venezuela's revenues are generated by crude oil. The proceeds are used to import almost all other products. But oil prices have reached their lowest level since May 2009: one barrel of Brent crude now costs $57.33 (48 euros), while a Venezuelan barrel has fallen below the $50-level. Analysts are talking of an impending default: "The situation has not been this bad for a long time," said Nikolaus Werz, professor of political science at Rostock University.

'US is out to destroy us'

Venezuela's president Nicolas Maduro mainly blames the "American empire" for the price drop. In a televised New Year's address, the president argued that the US were flooding the market with cheap shale oil, putting pressure on the commodity price: "The [oil] war has an objective: to destroy Russia. It's a strategically planned war ... also aimed at Venezuela. [The US] is seeking to turn our country into a colony, to destroy our independence and our revolution with the aid of an economic collapse."

Maduro did not mention that, thanks to state subsidies, Venezuelans only have to pay two cents per liter of gasoline. And he did not say that the country's inflation rate has risen to one of the highest worldwide because the government keeps printing more money to pay foreign debts.

http://www.dw.de/oil-price-slump-weakens-venezuelas-economy-and-government/a-18174071

Did no one ever teach them it was the most manipulated market in the world? How could they never think to diversify a bit to give them an edge against the next downturn? That's extremely short sighted and borders on suicidal for a government to be so irresponsible. Still, oil was only at it's peak for a brief time in 2008, the rest of the market history is a vast array of peaks and valleys since I guess around 1970ish. You cannot rely on oil alone to sustain you unless you play it long and slow like Saudi Arabia, who have amassed insane amounts of wealth and investments during the peaks to pull them through the low points. They also have the lowest production cost of any oil. It's around $5 a barrel. It's how they're in a position to now to thumb their nose and dry up production at their whim. That and the quality of oil in Saudi Arabia is better, and thus much cheaper to extract, than Venezuela.

I do have to laugh at how it's America's fault, though. Sure there are a lot of very rich oil companies drilling in the US who will weather the storm of lower prices just fine until they rise again. There are also many small companies who are going to lose their shirts due to foolishly betting on oil maintaining a higher price until they could recoup their primary investments. Shale isn't cheap to extract, it's at minimum twice as costly as even the most expensive of oil in Venezuela, which is still six times as costly as the oil from Saudi Arabia. Yet it's America's fault prices are down on the global market?

ain't it?

People have a difficult time separating their emotions from facts. It's easier to understand when it's a nobody spouting off and not a political leader of a country, but it's still what's taking place in this instance. It bodes poorly for the people there, but they'll have to figure that out on their own eventually, or not.

And they were good-hearted wanting to feed people but they neglected the adage about giving people a fish vs. teaching them to fish.

the people, but the people have been fed a steady diet of "it's the US' fault", so I'm not sure I want the US to do much heavy lifting to ease the situation.

We see it everywhere. "leave us alone, leave us alone" "Help us"!!

I hope he has lots of Pepcid AC stockpiled.

same ring as it once did.


Venezuela Food Lines

'By'Anatoly Kurmanaev and Andrew Rosati
10:00 AM EST February 4, 2015

Venezuelans who already must line up for hours to buy chicken, sugar, medicines and other basic products in short supply now face a new indignity: Condoms are hard to find and nearly impossible to afford.

“The country is so messed up that now we have to wait in line even to have sex,” lamented Jonatan Montilla, a 31-year-old advertising company art director. “This is a new low.”

A collapse in oil prices has deepened shortages of consumer products from diapers to deodorant in the OPEC country that imports most of what it consumes, with crude exports accounting for about 95 percent of its foreign currency earnings. As the price the country receives for its oil exports fell 60 percent in the past seven months, the economy is being pushed to the brink with a three-in-four chance of default in the next 12 months if oil prices don’t recover.

The impact of reduced access to contraceptives is far graver than frustration over failed hookups. Venezuela has one of South America’s highest rates of HIV infection and teenage pregnancy. Abortion is illegal.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-02-04/the-755-condom-is-the-latest-indignity-in-venezuela

Venezuela, on the other hand, though, has it happen almost every day now.

I suggest you take a trip to Venezuela yourself one of these days. Maybe it'll convince you once you see the situation with your own eyes.

They need longer hours to shop indeed of being so regimented and held back from the store. That mall should be able to serve those folks better.

Also, I'm teasing Tarheel, not really commenting on VZ in that post. It looks like things are coming to a head down there.

Peace Out.

you get a pound of flour and 4 onions

And Cuba chose the winning hand.

At this point it's about making a soft landing with the global dominance of capitalism.

But the problems are because of mismanagement from Maduro's government. He could fix a lot of stuff overnight if he chose to. But people don't want to do business with him because of his heavy handed tactics. It's just not worth anyone's while to try to sell stuff down there.
Would you support him changing his policies to attract business?

It's absolutely pathetic to see an OPEC country reduced to the functioning level of Cuba because its duly elected 'leaders' can't find their ass with both hands and a flashlight.

I have nothing but sympathy for the people suffering. But many of us have been pointing out the utter folly of Venezuela's economic policies for YEARS.

That has been our history...Viet Nam, Iraq, Libya...

I don't have much confidence in reaching any kind reasonable agreement with Maduro, but I'm perfectly fine with diplomacy in most any situation.