China to Help Build Las Vegas-to-Los Angeles High-Speed Railway
Source: Reuters
by REUTERS and JAMES ENG
A unit of CCRC, China's largest train maker, has signed a deal to help build a high-speed bullet train railway linking Las Vegas and Los Angeles.
China Railway International USA inked an accord for the project with XpressWest, a venture set up by Las Vegas-based hotel and casino developer Marnell Companies.
XpressWest and the Chinese firm said in a joint statement that the agreement would accelerate the plan for a 230-mile high-speed line between the two cities, with construction expected to start in September 2016. Finer details and financial terms weren't disclosed, though the statement said the project had initial capital of $100 million. No completion date was announced.
The high-speed railway project would have stations in Las Vegas, Nevada, Victorville and Palmdale, California, and service throughout Los Angeles.
Read more: http://www.nbcnews.com/tech/innovation/china-help-build-las-vegas-los-angeles-high-speed-railway-n429346
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jberryhill
(62,444 posts)
mahatmakanejeeves
(57,533 posts)
hibbing
(10,100 posts)At least we are investing in important things like the MIC and giving the struggling ruling class more tax cuts.
Peace
SoapBox
(18,791 posts)And why aren't we building our own infrastructure?
Something sounds fishy with this.
Lychee2
(405 posts)BlueJazz
(25,348 posts)...bought/made/sold by China.
L0oniX
(31,493 posts)BTW how many jobs will China lose while this HS railway is being built?
ErikJ
(6,335 posts)Less traffic congestion.
Agnosticsherbet
(11,619 posts)Cars off the road. When people see how well it works, my be we can build more.
Journeyman
(15,036 posts)
MisterP
(23,730 posts)
eppur_se_muova
(36,274 posts)
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)
bananas
(27,509 posts)Yet Another “One-Off” Problem for the China-Built Bay Bridge
By Elizabeth Brotherton-Bunch Thursday, May 21, 2015
A steel rod designed to secure the bridge in an earthquake has fractured.
Well, color us surprised!
Back in April, the San Francisco Chronicle reported that one of the anchor rods in the eastern span of the San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge may have snapped. And on Wednesday, state officials confirmed that one of the steel rods that anchor the eastern span’s tower had indeed fractured.
<snip>
But several experts told the Chronicle that “photos of the broken rod indicate the presence of corrosion that could also infect hundreds of 25-foot-long rods that sat in water after they were tensioned in 2010.”
This “one-off” problem is just one in a series of issues for the Bay Bridge, which has been plagued with problems from the start.
Opened in 2013, the eastern span of the bridge was designed to replace a bridge that partially collapsed during the 1989 Loma Prieta earthquake — the famous one that interrupted the World Series. Problems began when then-Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger decided to outsource much of the eastern span’s fabrication to a company in China that had zero experience actually building bridges.
And while the governator picked that company to save money, the choice led to severe cost overruns and delays, along with a host of safety issues that the Sacramento Bee has done an award-worthy job of chronicling.
<snip>
Bridge Comes to San Francisco With a Made-in-China Label
By DAVID BARBOZAJUNE 25, 2011
SHANGHAI — Talk about outsourcing.
At a sprawling manufacturing complex here, hundreds of Chinese laborers are now completing work on the San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge.
Next month, the last four of more than two dozen giant steel modules — each with a roadbed segment about half the size of a football field — will be loaded onto a huge ship and transported 6,500 miles to Oakland. There, they will be assembled to fit into the eastern span of the new Bay Bridge.
The project is part of China’s continual move up the global economic value chain — from cheap toys to Apple iPads to commercial jetliners — as it aims to become the world’s civil engineer.
The assembly work in California, and the pouring of the concrete road surface, will be done by Americans. But construction of the bridge decks and the materials that went into them are a Made in China affair. California officials say the state saved hundreds of millions of dollars by turning to China.
<snip>
American steelworker unions have disparaged the Bay Bridge contract by accusing the state of California of sending good jobs overseas and settling for what they deride as poor-quality Chinese steel. Industry groups in the United States and other countries have raised questions about the safety and quality of Chinese workmanship on such projects. Indeed, China has had quality control problems ranging from tainted milk to poorly built schools.
<snip>
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)Here's your piss poor bridge back.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)It will only increase the trade deficit and make China richer.
bananas
(27,509 posts)<snip>
Gary Wong, a Hong Kong-based analyst at brokerage Guotai Junan, estimated that the project could be worth US$5 billion. He said that although it would likely offer the many Chinese firms involved little financial benefit, it was significant for their long-term goals.
"If this opens up the U.S. market for them, opportunities for future expansion will increase. And if (their technology) is used in the United States, it will be easier for them to sell to other countries," he said.
CRRC is leading China's aggressive pursuit of overseas high-speed rail deals in competition with traditional suppliers such as Germany's Siemens AG and France's Alstom SA. Beijing recently clinched contracts in Russia, although it has faced hurdles in Mexico and Indonesia due to bureaucratic flip-flops in those countries.
US POTENTIAL
The United States is a key target for China's rail industry, even though policymakers have been split over the need for high-speed rail and some have taken a dim view of Chinese involvement in potentially strategic deals. Most of a dozen or so U.S. projects lined up have struggled to gain traction, leaving the country far behind Europe and Asia in this area.
XpressWest won the green light for the 230-mile high-speed line linking Los Angeles to Las Vegas in 2011 and applied for a federal loan in 2010, according to the company's website. It did not say whether its loan application had been successful.
<snip>
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)bananas
(27,509 posts)This is something that needs to be investigated more fully - there could be zero-down low-interest taxpayer federal loans going to Chinese companies to build this, it could be another case of "privatizing the profits while socializing the costs".
From that same article:
XpressWest won the green light for the 230-mile high-speed line linking Los Angeles to Las Vegas in 2011 and applied for a federal loan in 2010, according to the company's website. It did not say whether its loan application had been successful.
Merrily started a thread last weak about infrastructure loans:
Creating one or more infrastructure banks is a vintage Democratic Leadership Council recommendation.
I added how Bush's "nuclear loan guarantees" turned into actual taxpayer loans:
How "nuclear loan guarantees" became actual taxpayer loans.
<snip>
The "Nuclear Power 2010 Program" was launched in 2002 by President George W. Bush in order to restart orders for nuclear power reactors in the U.S. by providing subsidies for a handful of Generation III+ demonstration plants. The expectation was that these plants would come online by 2010, but this expectation was not met.
<snip>
The Energy Policy Act of 2005 (Pub.L. 109–58) is a bill passed by the United States Congress on July 29, 2005, and signed into law by President George W. Bush on August 8, 2005, at Sandia National Laboratories in Albuquerque, New Mexico. The act, described by proponents as an attempt to combat growing energy problems, changed US energy policy by providing tax incentives and loan guarantees for energy production of various types.
Public Utility Holding Company Act of 1935 was repealed, effective Feb 2006, by the passing of this act.
<snip>
February 17, 2010
Nuclear Loan Guarantees Aren’t Just Guarantees: They are Actual Taxpayer Loans
President Obama’s announcement yesterday of a “conditional” $8.3 billion loan “guarantee” to the Southern Company for construction of two nuclear reactors in Georgia obscured an important fact about the loan guarantee program: taxpayers are not just providing a guarantee, they also will be providing the actual loans.
<snip>
The Federal Financing Bank (FFB) is a little-known government entity that more typically makes loans to universities, colleges, rural electric co-ops and other small-scale projects. Interest rates from the FFB may be lower than offered by private financial institutions. Use of the FFB means that the loans themselves for new reactor construction will come from taxpayers, putting taxpayers in the risky business of both providing the loans and guaranteeing to themselves that the loans will be repaid.
<snip>
April 22, 2014
Now we know just how desperate the Department of Energy was to give a taxpayer loan to Southern Company and others for construction of two new reactors at the Vogtle site in Georgia.
Like a car dealer trying to sweep unsold autos off the lot, DOE gave Southern Co. the loan with nothing down. Nada. Zero.
<snip>
This is a completely inappropriate use of the FFB.
Major Hogwash
(17,656 posts)Taking many of our jobs overseas was one thing, but giving them our jobs right here at home is pure bovine scatology!!
bananas
(27,509 posts)All the contractors dropped out of the UK new nuke build because it makes no sense and is a boondoggle.
Only France Inc was left, and they couldn't carry it on their own,
but China Inc wants to build lots of reactors and other major construction projects worldwide,
so the UK reactors will be built by France and China.
This is a major mistake, these reactors should be cancelled.
China to leverage investor role in Hinkley C nuclear project
djysrv Sat, Sep 12 2015 5:51 PM
In return for taking a 30-40% equity stake in the $24 billion project Hinkley nuclear project, two Chinese state-owned nuclear firms are asking UK Prime Minister David Cameron for the rights to build a 1000 MW Hualong One reactor at the Bradwell site near London
It looks like a deal with something for everyone. The UK gets significant equity funding for the first reactor in a massive 19 Gwe nuclear build in return for letting Chinese firms book an export sale of its newest light water reactor (LWR) technology in a western nation with the ability to pay for it. Earlier this year China booked a sale for a Hualong One with Argentina, but for now, unless a miracle occurs, China will be building and providing 100% of the financing for that plant as a turnkey project with Argentina paying it off with revenues generated by the electricity produced by the reactor.
What set the complex deal in motion is that EDF, which is planning to build two Areva 1600 MW at the Hinkley site, simultaneously issued two press releases both filled to the brim with bad news.
First, EDF said that its planned completion of a similar EPR nuclear plant at Flamanville in France is falling further behind in its schedule and it was cost more, a lot more. The cost of the project is now pegged at $11.7 billion.
Anyone looking at the players involved in Flamanville, and has a stake in Hinkley C, is now wondering about the ability of Areva and EDF to complete that project on time and within budget. EDF and Areva are also pegged to build two more EPRs at the UK’s Sizewell site. From the perspective of UK PM Cameron, these players have a lot of risk associated with them and on his watch.
Second, EDF said it was halting further work on the Hinkley C site until the finances for the project could be settled in terms of funding for it. This produced all kinds of uproar in the UK tabloid press which said that EDF was calling it quits. EDF strongly countered that it has complete confidence in the project.
<snip>
LibDemAlways
(15,139 posts)Las Vegas. It was slow as molasses and stopped frequently out in the middle of the desert for lengthy periods to allow freight trains to go by. I took it once and it was a 12 hour ordeal. Today there are only two ways to get from LA to Vegas -- fly or drive/take a bus along crowded Highway 15. Either way is a pain in the ass. California has no incentive at all to participate in the construction of a high speed rail line to Las Vegas. It stands to reason that a private company is taking the initiative to finally get it done. Unfortunately, our Congress is full of boneheads who lack the political will to invest in infrastructure and who should be ashamed that this project is being planned in tandem with a Chinese firm.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)The last time I took it was from Chemult Oregon down to Oakland California. It took nearly 12 hours for the trip. My wife had never been on Amtrak before. Unfortunately the next part of the trip was a flight back to South Korea which was bad enough, but after being on Amtrak for that long we were exhausted.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)"Place your bets...don't mention Tibet!".
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)Then they can have the 'No Drama Dalai Lama Lounge'.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)They write themselves, don't they?
Third class is underneath the train. 
truthisfreedom
(23,149 posts)It goes 300 km/hr (188 mph) for about 15 miles from Shanghai to the airport. That's all they ever built. It's a little demo track.
bananas
(27,509 posts)truthisfreedom
(23,149 posts)
JoeyT
(6,785 posts)I've been on a project with steel from China. It would've taken us two weeks to weld it all together if it had just been the steel. Instead we spent a month grinding bad welds out and welding it back together. (For those that weld: It was unbelievably bad. Most were run downhill with 7018. Some looked like someone tried to drag a 6010. Some I couldn't even tell you what process they were welded with or what position they were welded in. I only know it was a wire fed process because there was wire sticking out everywhere. All of it had horrible fit up. Some of it was so poorly fused you could smack it with a hammer and break the weld out.
Pretty much everyone in commercial/industrial construction, especially riggers, ironworkers and welders, refuse to work with Chinese made stuff, especially anything made out of steel that has to carry a load. Shackles made in China are notorious for the pin breaking out after they've been in use for a while, and if they're rigged sideways (incorrectly) they're going to open up and break in half the second you pick anything up.
So yeah, there's no way I'd ride on it.
djean111
(14,255 posts)Bwahahahahaha! Will they be using their own workers and their own materials? Will the profits stay in the US? Will they have cut a deal to evade taxes?
Those are rhetorical questions.
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)It needs too much water, there has to be a better place to put a huge tourist town.
Major Hogwash
(17,656 posts)There is no reason to outsource this railway.
There are companies in the U.S. that could build this.
