Gosh if I didn't know better, I'd say the corporate owned media were ginning up knee jerk support for a new war.

But, no, that can't be...they are the MEDIA, for God's sake!

No conspiracy theories here. What I'm saying is that the pressure from Iraq, the Kurds and others is putting the pressure on IS to the point they are seeking bright events such as Paris in an attempt to rebuild morale and structure.

L-

Obviously Paris was a planned event. A lot of their operation (filmed beheadings and burnings) are pure marketing. They have to constantly recruit. There have been several stories about disillusion of new recruits and really heavy drug use.

Paris may not have been a signal of strength but of weakness or desperation.
OR provoking the West to feed their marketing.
ISIS, in my opinion, is a waiting game. Can they govern? Can you really build a model on nothing but killing? I think the considered opinion of the Pentagon brass to contain and take sharp strikes is the correct one. But it doesn't make for sound bytes.

existence to plunder the areas. They always make their main gold to take over an area plunder the museums and destroy any evidence of what was taken and move on.

in at which point they will then claim they are "invaders" in an effort to try and gain more recruits because its hard to get new recruits if the face of the enemy is that of a drone.

nearby mountain and the world watched in horror. This is very, very, good news also and also under mentioned.

It is an act of criminal neglect by the media to play up ISIS wins and not coalition wins...of which there have been nor than a few.

Our news is drama not information. Jeb says we need a "strategy" like there is no plan. If there was reporting about what's actually being done the cries of DO SOMETHING would sound stupid and not feed the drama.

The media wants a war so bad, they're sick of reporting on the Kardashians and other celebrity crap. They want the glory days of the Iraq invasion playing out on our screens again. It's sickening.

react is to subtly and not so subtly start routing for more war. They live off sensationalism. They have no interest whatsoever in getting at the real truth about what is creating ISIS and how we should deal with it. Thought and planning don't sell papers.

Truth => Expenses.

I don't think it's impossible at all.

Let's just imagine that we hadn't meddled, and others hadn't meddled, in the Middle East. What if we had decided that oil and other commodities were worth less than the goodwill with other people in the world. It doesn't follow that we would therefore expect aggression from people. So a vicious cycle is forever perpetuated. It's for our health, not wealth.

edit- I know this was violence from among local groups, but it's not in a vacuum. If we want to change what we're doing, let's think about alternatives that work to create a better future.

Could you clarify? When you say "can it be impossible to get along", do you mean with ISIS?

I'm going to an extreme, in order to ascertain the limits of this situation.

I do not believe humans span a spectrum which includes one who are completely murderous. I think the tendency it to an equilibrium which is relatively happy. Now this totally ignores all environmental forces. Everything from thousands of years of conflict in some regions, to imperial subjection. Now some have seen generation of western aggression. These are the people who are beyond hopeless. The environmental forcing on them is huge. My point is that it's counterintuitive. The worst need the most. I was confronted by a homeless guy this week. Here I am walking out of the grocers with bags of food, while this guy is struggling to survive. We all discus what to do, based on our judgment of these situations. I asked myself later whether that man would be on the street if he had someone giving him money. I doubt it. He might be a degenerate, until something changed his consciousness, or he may be some other way. Maybe I'm wasting my energy, and it really is hopeless. I just think that after all is said and done, the only way to create a better future is to break the cycles we have. There are ways to accomplish what we need without the strife.

and who the first aggressors have been, and why, read Agents of Empire by Noel Malcolm.

- it doesn't call for respect or tolerance of other faiths or religions

- it calls for forceable conversion. This may be the reason why the youth who begin to study the religion more closely get radicalized by the tens of thousands.

- which other religion calls for the death of anyone who leaves the religion

- questioning anything that is taught by the religion can be considered blasphemy and you guessed it - punishable by death.

A nice ground invasion across Central Iraq into Syria of about 1 million troops would do nicely.

Then a nicely worded diplomatic message to Riyadh of "Go Fuck Urself" would be icing on the cake.

Shouldn't *someone* have destroyed it as soon as it was known to be an IS headquarters? (shaking head)

Seems like everyone knows where ISIS is until they don't. Shaking my head also.

shitstorm has commenced. It's all over for them now, better late than never.

Attacking France was the straw that broke the camel's back. France has many allies and always has erred on the side of compassion and valor, no matter how many jokes people try to make. She is a strong, noble country and is only passive until pushed to the brink. Then, anyone who wrongs her
better get out of the way.

Sorry, you comment made me burst out laughing.

Every major country including the U.S and Russia has been bombing ISIS for months and still haven't significantly damaged them, yet somehow you think that France is so strong a country that they can do what the superpowers of the world have been unable to do to this point, haha.

Look, we all hope ISIS is destroyed, but damn, how gullible and dopey can you be.

Once of those francophobes, I see.

So I guess the US and Russia were so competent that they kept missing the daesh HQ and it was pure luck that FR just bombed the shit out of it. I'm sure that's how that worked out, just pure dumb luck on the part of the incompetent and foolish French.

You aren't very well informed about France's significant place in world history, especially in warfare, from ancient times through yesterday. I suggest a bit of reading. Even wikipedia could provide some clarification for you, but there are a few hundred thousand other books on French Military history that could interest you.

Or not. Maybe shitposting on websites is just easier than a bit of self-education.

Or maybe the French dropped a bomb on any building while claiming that it was a HQ?

You see why I was so kind to you and called you gullible?
You automatically believe the French when they come out and say they hit a rich HQs target that the Americans and Russians were unable to locate and bomb it with their own war planes.

Seriously, the fact that you truly believe and are arguing that the French were able to just on a whims notice use their planes to do something that a years worth of bombing by the world's major powers (including the French themselves) was unable to do is so laughable.

You do realise that the French have been working with the Americans for a long time now to locate and destroy Isis.
So what in the world makes you think that the very country that has been helping to try and destroy Isis for over a year is suddenly able to locate a rich HQ target and destroy it less than a day after the Paris attacks when it has had over a year to do this and hasn't done it up to this point?

Your gullibility shows again with how you argue that France's significant place in world history somehow makes it able to accomplish something that every major power in the world has been unable to accomplish at this stage.
Even more laughable is that this France that you argue has a significant place in history has been helping these major powers for over a year to try and destroy Isis.
What are France suddenly after these Paris attacks going to be able to locate and destroy Isis when they haven't been able to do it for a year for the Paris attacks? lol

is the term used in France24's translation:

You think for one second that the French, Americans, British, Russians, Australians, Iraqis. Iranians, Assad, etc who have all been bombing ISIS for months and some for even a year would not have targeted and taken out this command centre, this recruitment centre, this munitions depot and this training camp a long time ago if they knew where they were?

Yeah ISIS moves their people around to different buildings to keep them hidden, but only someone who is gullible would believe that ISIS would suddenly let their people and operations become visible enough to locate and bomb when they knew (just like the whole world knew) that air strikes were on the way.

Not too mention that ISIS has gone a whole year of constant bombing from all the worlds major powers and managed to hide their people and assets enough that they are still as strong now as they were a year ago.

Lastly, to believe that less than 24 hours after the Paris attacks that the French were simply able to open their eyes and identify and bomb ISIS people, assets and operations when ISIS was expecting it and would have cleared out and bunkered everything down is also laughable.


Like I said, the French picked any buildings in Raqaa and bombed them as a show of force simply for the optics of getting revenge on ISIS, all the whilst proclaiming that they hit important targets and relying on gullible people to believe that they suddenly found 20+ rich targets that hadn't been discovered or bombed for the whole preceding year.

course ever??? There's a reason the French experience in Algeria is called "The Dirty War" and it has nothing to do with nobility, honor or valor.

Geesh!

Did it ever occur to any of you guys that this is psy ops by Iraqi forces etc.?

Seriously, if you think for one second that if Iraq, Iran, America, Russia, Britain, France, Australia, etc knew there was a ISIS headquarters containing 250 militants just waiting to be destroyed that they wouldn't have dropped a bomb on it long long ago?

We all want ISIS to be destroyed, but don't be so dopey as to just believe anything that any country puts out there like it is the gospel truth.
The truth is that if it was that easy to kill 250 militants because they holed up in one easily identifiable headquarters, then this war would have been over a year ago, and ISIS wouldn't be controlling a huge swath of land.
If Iraqi forces were so good as to identify and destroy a headquarters in Ramadi with 250 militants holed up in it, then Iraqi forces would be patrolling streets now instead of fighting fiercely to recapture small town along the way.

On Mon Nov 16, 2015, 01:44 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

reall, you guys are so gullable as to believe this psy ops?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=1261509

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Calling DUers gullible (misspelled) and dopey is rather rude. He could have made his point without being so condescending and superior.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Mon Nov 16, 2015, 01:58 AM, and the Jury voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Dear alerter please refrain from the temptation to use the alert feature.

Thanks.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Alerter- grow up.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: meh.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Other than ignorant conjecture I see no problem with the post
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Poster's will take care of this poster themselves info.
Juror #7 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given

Must be a Hillary supporter. They alert all the time for the use of adjectives. Including gullible.

Oh my....

September 27: "The French military has carried out its first airstrikes against ISIS in Syria, according to a statement from the office of France’s presidency. The country had announced earlier this month that it would expand its aerial campaign against ISIS in Iraq — which it began a year ago — to include the militant group’s positions in Syria."
"The French president’s office said that ... our country confirms its firm commitment to the fight against the terrorist threat Daesh (ISIS). We will strike whenever our national security is at stake."
"Islamic extremists killed 17 people in a quick succession of attacks in Paris in January. ... But France has also linked the refugee crisis Europe is facing in part to ISIS, saying it would strike the group for driving thousands of civilians out of Syria. ... France also places blame on Syrian President Bashar al-Assad."