Maduro is the poster child of incompetence. Which is the kindest thing that can be said about him. Many throw in words like corrupt, power hungry, stubborn, stupid, etc.

of their people and use government money for social programs is incompetent, stupid, corrupt, power-hungry, and stubborn according to the US. It's a shame that even liberals in the US can't see this for what it is.

We'll go on destroying democracies and thwarting the will of others as long as people like you refuse to see what's really been happening and acknowledge our destructive role in what's going on. Learn your history.

The US isn't the reason the Venezuelan economy is in the tank.

Learn some basic economics.

is solely the responsibility of Maduro, that the US and the right-wingers in that country haven't been plotting and scheming to destroy it since Chavez passed? If you believe that then you have a very CNN/New York Times view of the situation and I'd suggest you branch out more and get a broader view than the neoliberal one that you've internalized.

The US has been hard at work trying to undermine Venezuelan democracy since Chavez took power (including two attempted coups) and the fact that you believe it's all Maduro's fault says that you are very ill-informed.

The right-wing elites in these countries can't win elections so they are working with the US to destroy their own countries and regain power. If I were Maduro, I'd have the military round up all of these people and deport them to Miami (where they can join the long-bitter right-wing Cubans).

Currency controls, fixed/tiered exchange rates, and import controls decimated the economy.

Venezuela used to have car manufacturing (gone now because they can't import parts) and many other industries that, if successful, were taken over by Maduro and failed.

He left them with a 100% oil export economy, didn't invest in the oil infrastructure, didn't pay the companies that helped so they left. Dropping oil production in the process.

Then he digs the hole deeper with price controls, fixed wages, and taking over businesses.

You are woefully ignorant of basic economics.

The best plan the US could have is sit back and watch Maduro fuck up the place himself.

possible. And when they don't get it they exact revenge to punish the impudent little people who had the misfortune of being born on top of U.S. oil.

Some people here may be stupid enough to buy your fucking "pinko commie" 1950's era propaganda. Hopefully most are not.

is that, when oil was $100 a barrel they spent the money like drunken sailors, throwing away billions upon billions in an effort to establish Chavez as the head of a new Latin American power group. When the price of oil cratered they had no investments, no reserves and no way to deal with it. Which brings us to where we are today. So please tell me just what the US' role in their incompetence?

The USA is evil, EVIL they say. Economics, facts, logic be damned.

Come on, we need you back!

but I do know that the US has been a declared enemy of Venezuela, with Obama going to the astounding length of declaring them a "national security threat" to the US. I think most of the world outside the US scratched their heads at that, but it was the US declaring openly that Venezuela was a target.

You can go on all day about Maduro's incompetence and you may be right, but you must also acknowledge that the US has been working hard to sink socialism in Venezuela from day one.

If you can't at least acknowledge that then you're not even worth debating.

for example, we have been the largest purchaser of their oil for decades. We have done nothing to inhibit trade with VZ so it is hard to argue that we have been trying to sink their economy. We make lot of money from them.

their economy for the purpose of creating widespread discontent and ultimately removing their leader (if not at the ballot box, then by military coup or impeachment). The two can happen simultaneously and have been.

or give away billions to Cuba? Or divert gas company profits from infrastructure repair and expansion to social programs? Or fail to diversify their economy such that it collapses when oil prices plummet?

Wow - we are truly all powerful.

off economically as Venezuela.

....for import AND exports?! lol

are based on the desires and wishes of the economic elite and their corporations, we have no qualms doing business with any government on the face of the earth. The problem arises when that other country decides to use their own tax dollars and the proceeds from their trading for the benefit of the people in their own country.

Right-wing economic conservatives around the world have pretty much the same goal: Privatizing any publicly-owned institutions so that the money can go into private hands (or to the Cayman Islands). This is why the US invariably takes the side of the very rich and financial elite in any given country. We are not content with simply trading and doing business with Venezuela, we want our corporations to be in the position to potentially exploit the labor of their people (one of the goals of "trade deals" like NAFTA) and exploit their resources (in this case, oil) without having to worry about the proceeds going to fund the education and healthcare of poor Venezuelans.

We want people in charge of the country who will let us do what we want in their countries, and it is the right-wing of these countries who could care less about the poor and working people of their own countries.

Why so many self-styled "liberals" and "Democrats" seem to be OK with this is bewildering to me. I guess the simple fact that a Democratic president is in charge makes everything different somehow...

of Venezuela's economy are on how bad things are, here is an article that provides an alternate thesis.

It is interesting that Fortune magazine proposes 4 steps to "fix" the Venezuelan economy (at least one of them would fall into the "progressive" bucket).

Exactly right, here and abroad.

Thank you.

Having his buddies cousin run refining plants and the like...

Got skills? NO PROBLEM! Government check is waiting for you, just support ME!

Some days reading the DU you'd think the world was a blissful garden of harmony until the USA came into existence.

want to survive, they should immediately get rid of any US embassies in their countries and ban of US-based NGO's operating there. Regime change work is now done through NGO's and the State Department, groups that fund and provide training to the far-right, elitist elements in these countries and I can't understand why in the world these groups aren't banned outright.

We've already seen the Russians and Chinese take steps to limit the activities of the NGO's, and the rest of the world's governments who seek a course independent of US domination would be wise to do the same.

I hope Maduro takes the appropriate measures to defend his country against the forces of regression (right-wing racists who are cheered on by Democrats and Republicans alike in the US). Brazil now has an all-white, all-conservative leader and cabinet now thanks to intervention by the US, and Venezuela is likely to go down the same disastrous path if they don't step up and kick the US out completely.

According to a few DUers.

Not quite as informed as they think they are, but funny as hell.

according to a few DUers all over this thread.

I think you can probably come to that conclusion without much of a problem.

If you think the US is exceptional and tends to carry out all of its actions with benevolent intentions, probably not.

They can engage on that progressive, democratic goal of building socialism in one country in the spirit of self-reliance.


Wow.

Perhaps the resulting leader could adopt the name "Kim Stal-In." Not sure he'd want to keep the word "juche".

goal of regime change.

I mean, why do you find this a more likely possibility than Maduro simply being no good at his job (for which there is at least as much evidence as there is evidence of past US shenanigans in Latin America)?

at their job....14 years and 1 month and Chavez and Maduro have been in power

Unlike the U.S., Russia and China have only peaceful and altruistic intentions. They put the welfare and prosperity of the rest of the world's people ahead of even their own. They are honest and honorable nations - when have you heard any major corruption allegations from that part of the world? When have you heard of any military adventurism from them?

Yep, Venezuela doesn't need our dirty bloody money.

Afghanistan, can't exactly remember the details. Not military adventurism, you say???

Cough cough....Tibet...cough cough.

And the native people of Tibet are beneath them, so they don't count.

look to is China.

petro-based economies they want to control/takeover is the deal Kerry made with the Saudis to keep their oil production high in order to drive down oil prices. This effected Venezuela, Russia, Iran and even the Saudis (who are hurting just as badly from the low oil prices). The US is not likely to stop buying Venezuela's oil and Venezuela obviously needs the money from its oil.

I understand you're trying make light of this situation, but it's no laughing matter. It only shows me that you don't really know what's going on in the world. While the US/NATO is setting the stage for a potential nuclear military confrontation with both Russia and China, all people like you can do sit at your computer and suck in what the American media outlets want you to believe. It's people like you who fell for the "Iraq has WMD" lie and cheered as "shock and awe" commenced. You're doing the same thing now.

Most of the rest of the world views the US as the #1 threat to world peace, and there's a very good reason for that viewpoint.

The first being the recent revelation that Michel Temer, the interim president, was in close contact with US authorities going back to 2006. He has been described as an "informant". The only mention of this I could find in what could be considered "mainstream" US media is the link below, but there are many others.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/brazils-temer-gave-us-sensitive-briefings-wikileaks-171157598.html

Then there was the NSA actively spying on Rousseff and other top officials in her government. This made headlines in the US and other Western media outlets, but was basically blown off as something all governments do. Rousseff was pissed about and canceled a scheduled meeting with Obama in protest. It should have been clear then that the US was actively looking for an angle to bring down Rousseff's government.

http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/246869-wikileaks-nsa-spied-on-brazils-president

Brazil has been a target since the ascendancy of Lula but hasn't been subject to the outright demonization that greeted other more leftist government in Latin America. However, Brazil is a member of BRICS, a coalition of countries in the Global South (including Russia) that has set about establishing an alternative to the Bretton Woods institutions (World Bank, IMF) that the US uses to force austerity on governments in exchange for loans, and that aimed to create an economic infrastructure independent of the US dollar and Western domination. The US is currently openly hostile to two BRICS members (Russia and China).

Yes, Maduro is an economic incompetent, but so was Chavez.

This was the inevitable result of their policies whether Chavez had lived and remained in power or not.

It is actually a shame Chavez is not still alive and president so he and his supporters would be forced to own this mess. As it is, Chavistas can try to claim all was well when Chavez was in power and were it not for Maduro, Venezuela would be a socialist paradise.

These are the fruits of countless years of horrendous economic policies.

Socialism as practiced by Chavez/Maduro simply doesn't work, and will never work anywhere. Thoughtful and intelligently regulated markets work, corrupt and stupid socialism doesn't.

and the stars, and then starving the people: they killed 3,000, remember? they're not gonna be able to set the economy on the right foot

how's the Honduras showcase doing?

He really took the country down the hole and Maduro has certainly worsened it.

done to destroy Venezuela since George W. Bush was in power, or do you just not really know?

If you aren't aware of it, then I'd say there's more to it than the US foreign policy establishment's view of "incompetence". If you are aware and are just willing to overlook it then I say you're no better than Bush's neocons - same shit, different president.

Period.

Sorry, no matter how sympathetic you are with Chavez, Maduro, the movement, whatever, the socialist government has been a total disaster. Complete, utter and total clusterf**k.

It has been obvious that they don't even understand basic economic principles. I don't think Chavez, Maduro or any in their governments even know what the law of supply and demand is or means. I think if you explained it to them, they'd still fail to comprehend.

Here is the problem. Chavez/Maduro are ideologues, probably with good intentions, that decided on an outcome but had no idea how to get there. Good intentions aren't enough, you have to actually implement policies that work. If the US or Columbia or any other boogeyman is interfering, you have to craft your policies around those problems.

Venezuela was run into the ground, almost as bad as Zimbabwe has been. Nothing, and I mean nothing, has done more to discredit the left in South and Central America than Chavez/Maduro policies.

A brilliant plan, well executed.

If he is not a CIA plant, he is making their jobs easy. Sit back and watch him fuck up the country all on his own.

I wonder what's taking them so long.

They've ascended hundreds into the rank of generals in these last 17 years, even though there hasn't been any actual war during those years. Now there's more Venezuelan military generals than ever, for some reason... And if they aren't high-ranking officers, they can just participate in the local drug trafficking ring. It's not like nobody's gonna stop them anyway. I'd wager even quite a few of them were already drug traffickers and street thugs before they joined the military.

them to do just that. One of our favored right-wingers there (Capriles) even came out publicly encouraging the military to take over.

This is the same racist bullshit we've been doing to Latin America for centuries, but I'm hoping the military backs Maduro and jails every rich Venezuelan who's been working to destroy their own country. The US wouldn't put up with it, and neither should Venezuela.

Again, if you can't win an election fairly, encourage a military coup. DU is full of a bunch of right-wing warmongers.

President Marcos, approaching the end of his term, declared an emergency, suspended the Constitution, closed the Legislature, imposed censorship....sounds vaguely familiar.

We had a lot of "Marcos can do no wrong" people, led by Ronnie Raygun.
(Who probably couldn't find the Philippines even on a map.)

Nowadays we have "Maduro can no wrong" people who are just as stupid.

Same old, same old.

"Sure he's an incompetent corrupt asshole, but he's OUR incompetent corrupt asshole!"