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oberliner

(58,724 posts)
Wed Aug 30, 2017, 01:27 PM Aug 2017

Joel Osteen pushes back against accusations he closed his megachurch to Harvey victims

Source: Chicago Tribune

Joel Osteen, Houston's celebrity televangelist, pushed back against accusations that he closed off his 606,000-square-foot megachurch amid a flooding crisis that has displaced thousands of residents.

"The idea that we wouldn't receive people - we've been here in this community for 60 years," Osteen told Chris Cuomo Wednesday on CNN's "New Day," adding that: "We've always been open . . . How this notion got started, that we're not a shelter and we're not taking people in is a false narrative."

Lakewood Church spokesman Don Iloff said the building itself had been flooded during the weekend, with water getting close to spilling over the facility's floodgate. Taking in a crowd of storm evacuees over would've been unsafe, although Iloff maintained that the church's doors were never closed.

Read more: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/ct-joel-osteen-megachurch-harvey-victims-20170830-story.html

18 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Joel Osteen pushes back against accusations he closed his megachurch to Harvey victims (Original Post) oberliner Aug 2017 OP
How much has Joel donated to Harvey relief? sarcasmo Aug 2017 #1
He's accepting donations, though. Pope George Ringo II Aug 2017 #8
Free advice matt819 Aug 2017 #2
celebrity televangelist underpants Aug 2017 #3
If his mega church was close to flooding why didn't he say that to begin w/? Botany Aug 2017 #4
Osteen: Where he gets his money? DonaldsRump Aug 2017 #5
Proof that his wealth is only from book sales. SammyWinstonJack Aug 2017 #6
Negativity about Osteen? Two words: "Prosperity Gospel" hatrack Aug 2017 #7
I just read exactly that phrase in Osteen's Wikipedia page DonaldsRump Aug 2017 #9
Yep. It's a - literal - heresy that puts Christian window-dressing QC Aug 2017 #10
The church is open to all that have money to give to the church, but if you need something, Thor_MN Aug 2017 #11
Hey Osteen, my father is a minister of the United Church of Christ turbinetree Aug 2017 #12
if you give a man a fish.... The Mouth Aug 2017 #13
He can start by being honest about the photos. politicat Aug 2017 #14
Write a personal check or STFU n/t TexasBushwhacker Aug 2017 #15
Here's what I think of this guy, and all others like him neeksgeek Aug 2017 #16
Wrong finger. n/t Virtual Burlesque Aug 2017 #17
But the necktie is correct. neeksgeek Aug 2017 #18

matt819

(10,749 posts)
2. Free advice
Wed Aug 30, 2017, 01:31 PM
Aug 2017

When you're already in the hole, stop digging.

Roll up your sleeves and get to fucking work helping those who need it. Get food, water. Provide same for pets. Set up funding specifically for storm victims. You claim to be a man of god? Then fucking act like a man of god.

Botany

(70,614 posts)
4. If his mega church was close to flooding why didn't he say that to begin w/?
Wed Aug 30, 2017, 01:37 PM
Aug 2017

"Lakewood Church spokesman Don Iloff said the building itself had been flooded during the weekend, with water getting close to spilling over the facility's floodgate. Taking in a crowd of storm evacuees over would've been unsafe, although Iloff maintained that the church's doors were never closed"


http://samaritanoutreachservices.com/about-sos/ My late Aunt & Uncle's gift to the town where they had worked.


Joel Osteen

DonaldsRump

(7,715 posts)
5. Osteen: Where he gets his money?
Wed Aug 30, 2017, 01:37 PM
Aug 2017

Dear all:

I have some family members who love him. I am not defending him and not denigrating him, but from what I can see, he takes no money from his church but made his money through book sales.

There seems to be a lot of negativity about Osteen: can someone share a reliable article etc. to give some more insight about the negativity?

To repeat, I know nothing about him except watching him while channel surfing. Accordingly, apologies in advance for my ignorance.

DsR

DonaldsRump

(7,715 posts)
9. I just read exactly that phrase in Osteen's Wikipedia page
Wed Aug 30, 2017, 02:07 PM
Aug 2017

There is a specific sub-heading in his page that addresses the prosperity gospel issue:

Prosperity gospel

Osteen's sermons and writings are sometimes criticized for promoting prosperity theology, or the prosperity gospel, a belief that material gain is a reward for pious Christians. On October 14, 2007, 60 Minutes ran a twelve-minute segment on Osteen, titled "Joel Osteen Answers his Critics", during which Reformed theologian Michael Horton told CBS News correspondent Byron Pitts that Osteen's message is heresy. Horton stated that the problem with Osteen's message is that it makes religion about us instead of about God.

When asked if he is a prosperity teacher, Osteen responded that if prosperity means God wants people to be blessed and healthy and have good relationships, then he considers himself a prosperity teacher, but if it is about money, he does not. He has specifically stated that he never preaches about money because of the reputation of televangelists.

In an interview with The Christian Post on April 21, 2013, Osteen expressed his sentiments on being perceived as being part of the prosperity gospel. "I get grouped into the prosperity gospel and I never think it's fair, but it's just what it is. I think prosperity, and I've said it 1,000 times, it's being healthy, it's having great children, it's having peace of mind. Money is part of it; and yes, I believe God wants us to excel ... to be blessed so we can be a bigger blessing to others. I feel very rewarded. I wrote a book and sold millions of copies; and Victoria and I were able to help more people than we ever dreamed of. But when I hear the term prosperity gospel, I think people are sometimes saying, 'Well, he's just asking for money'."


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joel_Osteen



Like I said, I have no proof, one way or other, but I have seen specific references to the "fact" that he takes no money from his church and that his book sales have been enormous (I know at least one was an NY Times monster bestseller).

Folks like Franklin Graham and Falwell Jr. deserve all the venom they get for their blind support of the Buffoon. Osteen is different, at least to me, in that he seems to be apolitical.

Again, I may be totally wrong on this, but am just trying to understand the guy and what he is really about.
 

Thor_MN

(11,843 posts)
11. The church is open to all that have money to give to the church, but if you need something,
Wed Aug 30, 2017, 04:10 PM
Aug 2017

"Fuck you"

turbinetree

(24,726 posts)
12. Hey Osteen, my father is a minister of the United Church of Christ
Wed Aug 30, 2017, 06:03 PM
Aug 2017

he doesn't and hasn't bastardized religion EVER.................in fact, here is some tidbit information ''

How much is worship worth? That question is at the heart of a quiet (and, for many, uncomfortable) issue: pastor compensation. It would be a very different world if people were paid based on their value of their profession to society. Most clergy in America earn a humble $45,000 or less per year as they work tirelessly to share the gospel. While most seminarians don’t pursue a career in preaching expecting to get rich—some spiritual leaders have built lucrative empires comparable to the dynasties previously only enjoyed by star athletes, A-list actors, and corporate elites. Who are these pastors and what are their net worths? Let’s get to know some of the richest pastors in America.

These pastors inspire millions—and make millions.

By Megan Schmidt

Read more at http://www.beliefnet.com/faiths/christianity/8-richest-pastors-in-america.aspx#jDqywvRrrmssxwiM.99


Explain this information on this site to your masses, there Osteen that donate to your "religion"

http://www.thesquander.com/joel-osteen-net-worth-2017-tale-questionable-numbers/





Maybe this clan can explain there wealth, since your on the "list", here take a gander of BS, and in fact how much has this "gang" donated to the flood relief..............................how much jerk, I can't hear you, try again

Kenneth Copeland: Net Worth $760 Million

Kenneth Copeland, who leads the "Believer’s Voice of Victory," TV show and network, is a giant within the Word of Faith branch of Pentecostalism. Kenneth Copeland Ministries operates on a 1,500-acre campus near Fort Worth, TX, equipped with a church, a private airstrip, and a hangar for the ministry’s $17.5 million jet and other aircraft. Copeland resides with his wife Gloria in a $6 million church-owned lakefront mansion. Copeland, who is of partial Native American descent, converted to Christianity in the 1960s. His first dream was to be a recording artist. His "Pledge of Love” made No. 12 in the Top 40 in 1957......... .


Pat Robertson: Net Worth $100 Million

Marion Gordon "Pat" Robertson, son of U.S. Senator A. Willis Robertson, served as a Southern Baptist minister for many years before carving out a career as a media mogul and executive chairman. Robertson is host of "The 700 Club," the flagship program of the Christian Broadcasting Network, which Robertson launched in 1960 in Virginia Beach, VA. After an unsuccessful presidential bid in 1988, Robertson founded the Christian Coalition, a Christian Right organization that raises money for conservative political candidates. Robertson was instrumental in building a number of organizations committed to promoting conservative Christian ideals. He is the founder, CEO, and chancellor of what we know today as Regent University. He also established the American Center for Law & Justice, a major public interest law firm headquartered in Washington, D.C...... .


Benny Hinn: Net Worth $42 Million

Toufik Benedictus "Benny" Hinn is a televangelist originally born in Jaffa, Israel and was raised in the Eastern Orthodox tradition. He converted to Pentecostalism as a teenager in Toronto and became so immersed in the faith that it actually concerned his family. Despite dropping out of high school, he went on to found the Orlando Christian Center in 1983 and began professing his faith healing abilities........ .


Benny Hinn: Net Worth $42 Million

Hinn’s teachings are characterized as charismatic Christianity, with an emphasis on spiritual gifts and the prosperity gospel. He is best known for hosting “Miracle Crusades” —faith healing summits—generally held in large stadiums in major cities, which are later broadcast worldwide on his television program, "This Is Your Day," on the Trinity Broadcasting Network. Hinn has been scrutinized for personal use of church-owned luxury goods and a lack of financial oversight on the ministries' boards, which are often populated with family and friends of the televangelist....... .


Joel Osteen: Net Worth $40 Million and your at NUMBER 5

Joel Osteen is a best-selling author and the senior pastor of Lakewood Church, the largest Protestant church in America, based in Houston, TX. Osteen spent much of his career behind the scenes. He founded Lakewood's television program and produced his father's televised sermons for 17 years until his father died suddenly from a heart attack. Although his father always encouraged Osteen to preach, he didn’t take the stage until two weeks after John Osteen’s death. Since then, Lakewood's attendance has grown from 5,000 to 43,000. In his teachings, Osteen says that he aims to focus more on the goodness of God and on living an obedient life rather than on sin. He says that he tries to teach biblical principles in a simple way, emphasizing the power of love and a positive attitude. Sometimes his teachings are characterized as prosperity gospel. He lives with his family in a $10.5 million home........................ .

Creflo Dollar: Net Worth $27 Million

Creflo Augustus Dollar, Jr. is at the helm of a number of organizations: Creflo Dollar Ministerial Association, Creflo Dollar Ministries, and Arrow Records. He is the pastor and founder of the non-denominational World Changers Church International based in College Park, GA, a suburb of Atlanta. Raised in a Baptist church, Dollar received a Bachelor of Science degree in education from West Georgia College in Carrollton before holding his first sermon in an elementary school cafeteria in 1986. By 2007, he was preaching to a congregation of 30,000 members with $69 million in revenue through gross cash collections. Both his prosperity gospel-style teachings and his lavish lifestyle have been criticized. He owns two Rolls-Royces, a private jet, and three multi-million dollar homes.................. .


Billy Graham: Net Worth $25 Million...............Note: the trump supporting Franklin took over the empire

William Franklin Graham is a well-respected Southern Baptist minister and best-selling author who was one of the first pastors to reach celebrity status in the 20th century. Graham is known for hosting the annual Billy Graham Crusades from 1947-2005. It has been estimated that 3.2 million people have accepted his invitation to "accept Jesus Christ as their personal savior,” and that 2.2 billion people have tuned into his radio and TV broadcasts. It is believed that more people have heard him preach than any other person in the history of Christianity.

Graham served as a spiritual adviser to Presidents Dwight D. Eisenhower, Lyndon B. Johnson, and Richard Nixon. He was active in the civil rights movement, held integrated crusades, invited Martin Luther King, Jr. to preach jointly at a revival, and even bailed MLK, Jr. out of jail......................... .


Rick Warren: Net Worth $25 Million..................oh yippy still drive a ford

Rick Warren founded the Saddleback Church in Lake Forest, CA, in 1980, which today stands as the America’s eighth-largest church. Warren is the author of numerous best-selling books and advocates a five-point plan to bring global harmony to the world, which involves planting churches, helping the needy and sick, and promoting education.

He and his wife consider themselves “reverse tilters.” They live on 10 percent of their income and donate the rest to charity.

“I drive a 12-year-old Ford, have lived in the same house for the last 22 years, bought my watch at Wal-Mart, and I don’t own a boat or a jet,” Warren once said of his lifestyle in a media interview.......................... .


Joyce Meyer: Net Worth $8 Million........................she doesn't have to apologize----------------

Joyce Meyer is a charismatic Christian speaker and author who previously ranked as No. 17 on the list of “25 Most Influential Evangelicals in America” by TIME Magazine. In 2003, Meyer and her husband, Dave, launched a television ministry, "Enjoying Everyday Life," headquartered in the St. Louis suburb of Fenton, MS.

A mom of four kids, Meyer has received flack for her extravagant lifestyle. In 2004, the St. Louis Post-Dispatch detailed her and her husband’s assets, which were reportedly all paid for by the ministry: a $10 million jet, several homes that cost up to $2 million each, and a $107,000 silver Mercedes sedan. The ministry's $20 million headquarters is outfitted with $5.7 million worth of furniture (including a $23,000 antique marble-topped commode).

She responds to her critics by saying that she doesn’t have to apologize for being blessed........................ .


The Bottom Line

There is nothing wrong with being wealthy, of course. But with great wealth comes great responsibility. Regardless of your rung on the income ladder, we must remember that Jesus viewed wealth as a gift from God to be used in His service. The Parable of the Shrewd Manager teaches us that God must be the most important thing in our lives: "No one can serve two masters. For you will hate one and love the other, or be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money" (Luke 16:13-31).


So Osteen, do you and your bunch think that you should still have your tithe being "TAX EXEMPT" I don't think so, because somewhere I and millions of others have to foot your bill...................that is a fact.....................



So much for the money changers, this bunch even though this information is some what old still have a NET of over 1 BILLION and 27 MILLION.....................





The Mouth

(3,165 posts)
13. if you give a man a fish....
Wed Aug 30, 2017, 06:31 PM
Aug 2017

“if you give a man a fish he eats for a day. Lock your megachurch during a huge storm, teach a man how to be a fish.”

politicat

(9,808 posts)
14. He can start by being honest about the photos.
Wed Aug 30, 2017, 06:48 PM
Aug 2017

Photos were posted on Instagram that showed 3-4 feet of water in corridors overlooking a drained pool (I assume the baptismal pool.) Drained. It was dry down there. And a similar amount of water behind the type of waist-high gate used to separate the player's box from the hockey rink. The front of the gate was not inundated, and looked dry.

Even concrete corridors don't "hold" water, because the railings overlooking the pool are not concrete -- they're metal bolted into the poured floor. A 10 foot wide by 3 foot high by 10 foot long (ten foot long section of ten foot wide corridor to a 3 foot depth) weighs around 2500 pounds. Water flows to the lowest point first, and in those quantities, it starts breaking railings and gates, or at least leaking around the edges. So how are hundreds of thousands of gallons of water 20 feet above an empty and dry room below? How are hundreds of thousands of gallons of water sitting behind a flimsy sheet-metal gate that doesn't seem to have an edge gasket?

Explain those. Explain the citizen video that shows the dry, underground parking -- at or near the same level as the image of flooded corridors.

If a staffer "repurposed" photos of another flood because getting to the building was too difficult and dangerous and they didn't feel they could say that, then be honest and say that. If someone photoshopped in that water, again, say that. Admit the error and get on with it. Be humble and be honest.

But don't brush it under the carpet and hope everyone forgets.

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