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angka

(1,599 posts)
Thu Nov 2, 2017, 06:27 PM Nov 2017

Shoppers pulled guns in response to Thornton Walmart shooting, but police say that slowed investigat

Source: Denver Post

When a gunman opened fire inside a Walmart in Thornton Wednesday night, shoppers screamed and ran for cover — and others pulled out their own handguns.

But those who drew weapons during the shootings ultimately delayed the investigation as authorities pored over surveillance videotape trying to identify the assailant who killed three people, police said Thursday.

Although authorities said “a few” individuals drew handguns, they posed no physical hazard to officers. But their presence “absolutely” slowed the process of determining who, and how many, suspects were involved in the shootings, said Thornton police spokesman Victor Avila.

It took more than five hours to identify the suspect, 47-year-old Scott Ostrem, who is accused in the seemingly random shootings. The problem for investigators came when they reviewed the surveillance footage and had to follow each individual with a firearm until they could eliminate them as a suspect.

Read more: http://www.denverpost.com/2017/11/02/shoppers-pulled-weapons-walmart-shooting/

43 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Shoppers pulled guns in response to Thornton Walmart shooting, but police say that slowed investigat (Original Post) angka Nov 2017 OP
Geesh, not that I've ever shopped at a Walmart.... LisaM Nov 2017 #1
I've never shopped in one Codeine Nov 2017 #8
Which of those categories sarisataka Nov 2017 #14
Gee, thanks.... I frequent a WalMart because it's my only choice within 25 miles. groundloop Nov 2017 #18
Maybe I'm just there to buy a five-pound bag of grits. No one else has them. NT mahatmakanejeeves Nov 2017 #29
So aren't the armed shoppers supposed to shoot the shooter and save lives and all? Leghorn21 Nov 2017 #2
Good guys with guns are never around and when they are HAB911 Nov 2017 #22
Maybe they adhere to training and watch for a clear shot. Hangingon Nov 2017 #30
doesn't change the end result HAB911 Nov 2017 #32
Did not change in this instance. Hangingon Nov 2017 #33
Did not change in this instance, X virtually always HAB911 Nov 2017 #34
No. Hangingon Nov 2017 #36
I guess we will just have to agree to disagree then HAB911 Nov 2017 #37
I'd certainly appreciate some cites. crim son Nov 2017 #41
And had an officer been on the scene.. HopeAgain Nov 2017 #3
That is the problem I never hear the gun idolator address... Thomas Hurt Nov 2017 #4
Maybe they have to assume there are no "good guys" with guns. It sounds reasonable to me. NNadir Nov 2017 #7
Simple when looked at from the blue point of view...look for the closest non-white person available. pecosbob Nov 2017 #11
Isn't it the law? SCVDem Nov 2017 #20
So, gun humpers how is getting the bad guy working out for you? Doreen Nov 2017 #5
Yet law enforcement seem to support this kacekwl Nov 2017 #6
Many of them really do not n/t radical noodle Nov 2017 #12
The police officers I know DO NOT want more guns on the streets groundloop Nov 2017 #19
Better to have and not need and delay ileus Nov 2017 #9
This message was self-deleted by its author bluevoter4life Nov 2017 #10
all those guns did not save those people Skittles Nov 2017 #13
Perhaps that is why they did not fire. Hangingon Nov 2017 #31
yet they still helped to delay identifying the killer Skittles Nov 2017 #38
"helped to delay"??? Hangingon Nov 2017 #39
did you even READ the article? Skittles Nov 2017 #40
The article indicates that crim son Nov 2017 #42
remember that shooting Mosby Nov 2017 #35
How does this not lead to good guys with guns shooting one another? bucolic_frolic Nov 2017 #15
Meanwhile, black folks get killed for holding fucking TOY guns Blue_Tires Nov 2017 #16
What would be the most intelligent and logical response to these repeated incidents? yallerdawg Nov 2017 #17
Walmart may need to update their job descriptions Sancho Nov 2017 #21
Fuckin' Walmart doesn't even provide their own security HAB911 Nov 2017 #23
Yep.... Sancho Nov 2017 #24
Not only that but we subsidize their employees with HAB911 Nov 2017 #25
Depends on the Walmart, I have been in several with armed security Not Ruth Nov 2017 #26
In smaller towns they might have to but HAB911 Nov 2017 #27
White guy shoots three separate Hispanic shoppers I don't know how random this was lunasun Nov 2017 #28
disaster waiting to happen dembotoz Nov 2017 #43

LisaM

(27,813 posts)
1. Geesh, not that I've ever shopped at a Walmart....
Thu Nov 2, 2017, 06:32 PM
Nov 2017

but now I really don't want to shop at a Walmart. Sounds as if half the clientele is armed.

 

Codeine

(25,586 posts)
8. I've never shopped in one
Thu Nov 2, 2017, 06:59 PM
Nov 2017

but my work takes me into one or two locations five days a week. It's the weirdest combination of strung-out tweakers, flag-draped old people, and the morbidly obese you can possibly imagine.

I can totally imagine what a shitshow this investigation must have been.

groundloop

(11,519 posts)
18. Gee, thanks.... I frequent a WalMart because it's my only choice within 25 miles.
Thu Nov 2, 2017, 08:09 PM
Nov 2017

I see just a normal cross section of my community, not "strung-out tweakers, flag-draped old people, and the morbidly obese" as you describe.

Please quit with the insults, it doesn't help.

Leghorn21

(13,524 posts)
2. So aren't the armed shoppers supposed to shoot the shooter and save lives and all?
Thu Nov 2, 2017, 06:35 PM
Nov 2017

Isn't that the point of carrying one's weapon into Walmart, to potentially save innocent victims?


RIP

HAB911

(8,904 posts)
22. Good guys with guns are never around and when they are
Fri Nov 3, 2017, 07:30 AM
Nov 2017

they just pull their peashooters and stand there, apparently.

Hangingon

(3,071 posts)
30. Maybe they adhere to training and watch for a clear shot.
Fri Nov 3, 2017, 09:58 AM
Nov 2017

CHLtraining stresses that you not just shoot at first sight but make sure that there are no innocents in the bullet path. Similarly the training deals with what to do when police arrive.

Hangingon

(3,071 posts)
36. No.
Fri Nov 3, 2017, 11:07 AM
Nov 2017

We could trade cites but I am sure that you would not appreciate any that show citizen self defense.

crim son

(27,464 posts)
41. I'd certainly appreciate some cites.
Sat Nov 4, 2017, 09:43 AM
Nov 2017

I've seen some that rely solely on the word of the gun-owner and I don't believe those to be reliable for obvious reasons. What do you have?

HopeAgain

(4,407 posts)
3. And had an officer been on the scene..
Thu Nov 2, 2017, 06:41 PM
Nov 2017

He would not have known who the shooter was with all kinds brandishing weapons. I have never had the urge to carry a concealed weapon and now it is even less likely.

Thomas Hurt

(13,903 posts)
4. That is the problem I never hear the gun idolator address...
Thu Nov 2, 2017, 06:46 PM
Nov 2017

If there is one bad guy with a gun and 3 or 4 good guys with a gun....how do the good guys know who the bad guy is.......I think they live in some 50s western movie fantasy, where nothing is messy or confused and you know who the black hat is and the good guys shoot the gun out of the hand of the bad guy or kill him......and never hit an innocent, never mistake anyone for a bad guy, etc.

ileus

(15,396 posts)
9. Better to have and not need and delay
Thu Nov 2, 2017, 07:05 PM
Nov 2017

than be an easy victim for the sake of making the cleanup easier for the cops.

Response to ileus (Reply #9)

Skittles

(153,169 posts)
13. all those guns did not save those people
Thu Nov 2, 2017, 07:19 PM
Nov 2017

they were KILLED by a gun

how would one of those gunners know who was the the shooter and who was another gunner? It is INSANE.

Hangingon

(3,071 posts)
39. "helped to delay"???
Fri Nov 3, 2017, 12:55 PM
Nov 2017

Are you implying they were in cahoots with the killer? The guy who came in, shot 3 people and then left. How much delay there? You are really straining.

crim son

(27,464 posts)
42. The article indicates that
Sat Nov 4, 2017, 09:46 AM
Nov 2017

the gun-toters were part of the problem. You don't have to believe it but your blindness casts doubt on your credibility in this instance. An idea: if you can't defend carrying without ignoring the facts and bending reality, perhaps you should rethink your position. I don't intend to be rude, btw.

Mosby

(16,319 posts)
35. remember that shooting
Fri Nov 3, 2017, 11:07 AM
Nov 2017

Where a crazy rw couple shot some cops and then went into a Walmart or a grocery store to shoot more people?

An armed customer saw the guy with a gun walk by his isle and he pulled his concealed weapon and told the guy to drop his gun, he was then shot in the back and killed by the wife who was following behind at a distance.

bucolic_frolic

(43,178 posts)
15. How does this not lead to good guys with guns shooting one another?
Thu Nov 2, 2017, 07:35 PM
Nov 2017

How does one sort it out - in the moment?

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
17. What would be the most intelligent and logical response to these repeated incidents?
Thu Nov 2, 2017, 07:38 PM
Nov 2017

Take away - gun proof - these facilities, no one gets a gun or...

...give everyone a gun, and as they say in Vegas, let the chips fall where they may?

Sancho

(9,070 posts)
21. Walmart may need to update their job descriptions
Thu Nov 2, 2017, 08:48 PM
Nov 2017
https://www.job-applications.com/walmart-greeter/

Walmart Greeter Job Description & Interview

Job Description and Duties

Walmart greeters meet customers at store entrances. Greeters at Walmart may assist customers with cart selection, offer coupons, or simply welcome people to the store. Walmart greeters may direct customers to specific areas of the store or note a return a customer brings back. Greeters with Walmart may need to perform other assigned duties, according to shift and location. Walmart greeters may clean store entryways, departments, or even restrooms if assigned such a task from a managing supervisor.

Greeters at Walmart may also need to identify customers for security purposes.


HAB911

(8,904 posts)
23. Fuckin' Walmart doesn't even provide their own security
Fri Nov 3, 2017, 07:34 AM
Nov 2017

Police come to shoo away panhandlers, referee parking disputes and check on foul-mouthed teenagers.

They are called to arrest the man who drinks a 98-cent iced tea without paying and capture the customer who joyrides on a motorized shopping cart.

The calls eat up hours of officers’ time. They all start at one place:

Walmart.

Law enforcement logged nearly 16,800 calls in one year to Walmarts in Pinellas, Hillsborough, Pasco and Hernando counties

, according to a Tampa Bay Times analysis. That’s two calls an hour, every hour, every day.

http://project.tampabay.com.s3-website-us-east-1.amazonaws.com/2016/public-safety/walmart-police/?src=longreads&mc_cid=37a7277d9b&mc_eid=d2958640a5

HAB911

(8,904 posts)
25. Not only that but we subsidize their employees with
Fri Nov 3, 2017, 07:47 AM
Nov 2017

food assistance. My last Repub friend goes to Sam's and Walmart and I can't convince them the prices come at greater cost. Duh.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/nation/walmart-raises-still-leave-many-near-poverty-line/2218435

 

Not Ruth

(3,613 posts)
26. Depends on the Walmart, I have been in several with armed security
Fri Nov 3, 2017, 07:52 AM
Nov 2017

Most have unarmed security, that check receipts on the way out. The greeters are not security, often they are handicapped people, Walmart is good that way.

HAB911

(8,904 posts)
27. In smaller towns they might have to but
Fri Nov 3, 2017, 07:59 AM
Nov 2017

in urban areas they rely on the taxpayer to provide security and rely on the taxpayer to subsidize their employees pay on top of that.

lunasun

(21,646 posts)
28. White guy shoots three separate Hispanic shoppers I don't know how random this was
Fri Nov 3, 2017, 08:56 AM
Nov 2017
http://www.westword.com/news/scott-ostrem-alleged-walmart-shooter-questions-answered-9659470
View Post
The identities of the murdered victims are being reported:

Victor Vasquez, a father of 2 little girls w/ a baby on the way:
http://kdvr.com/2017/11/02/first-vic...er-to-2-girls/

Carlos Moreno, a husband, father and grandfather:
http://kdvr.com/2017/11/02/grandfath...mart-shooting/

Pam Marques, a mother:
http://kdvr.com/2017/11/02/woman-kil...rt-identified/

dembotoz

(16,808 posts)
43. disaster waiting to happen
Sat Nov 4, 2017, 10:57 AM
Nov 2017

either armed shopper shoot each other by mistake....

or the cops shoot armed shopper by mistake

great tv script for a crime show if anyone wants it...please send royalties to me....not all but some

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