Like impeachable offenses. Not worth our effort or time, when both can be spent on keeping the Mueller investigation at the forefront.

How quickly some forget which voters put them where they are. Unless Doug is willing to switch parties (which based on this move may be a strong possibility) he will never get enough republican votes to get re-elected, so placating to the other side with this stance is a waste of Doug’s time and serves as a slap in the face to the women who were assaulted by Trump. This is already strike one in my view and Doug hasn’t even been seated yet. Pretty sad 😢.

Just pointing out the fact that unless there is a change in the Senate and House, nothing will be done. Unless there is a change in attitude as a whole by the American public, nothing will change.

...should just be ignored, right?

Like that time the KKK bombed a church in Birmingham in, I think it was, 1963? And they knew who did it in 1965? I mean... all that water under the bridge. And the perps had been, like hired for jobs and gotten on with their lives and stuff, so, like "the people had spoken" because, really, no one wanted to waste time PROSECUTING THOSE ANCIENT CRIMES, right?

Besides, a whole lot of people WEREN'T killed in that bombing. It was all just allegation anyway, right? Those black people mighta smashed up their own church just to be messin' on the Klan, after all.

Just allegations.

And ancient ones, at that.

So, yeah, they should be ignored.

Move on, get down to business, do important stuff about "real issues" and forget about old allegations of disgusting crimes by people who've gotten away with them.

(Do I NEED the smiley here? ::sigh::.... probably I do.)

self-righteously,
Bright

Completely Agree....

feel they are taken seriously, heard....when laws are in place in the work place where the assaulter is made accountable...when the 16 or more women who have accused trumpf of assault, and I surmise more allegations will follow [do you think that trumpf s vulgar perverted behavior towards women just stopped after the access tape?] So...when they have had their day in court and trumpf has resigned then we will stop...so until then Mr. Moore-- we will not be silent or silenced.

I sure hope Al Franken is thinking of what he should step back from too....

constutents as best he can in view of his own principles. This is a quaint notion, but it's what a Senator is supposed to do.

For instance, he may be more focused on desperate poverty in his own state:

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2017/12/17/1723554/--Because-it-is-right-because-it-is-wise-The-War-on-Poverty-needs-to-restart-in-Alabama

Or environmental problems in his state:

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/sanitation-open-sewers-black-belt_us_5a33baf5e4b040881be99da5

My guess is political expediency. If he said that about il douche , he'd lose support and money from Democrats. I would have thought long and hard about giving him any money
I think he should consider not undercutting the party he belongs to. You don't get that kind of behavior out of Republicans because they realize that it will be used against their party.
"Well, you know Senator (insert name) has said something totally different..."
I disagree with him 100%

beyond 2020 he'll have to be much more of a centrist than DU would like.

"Arguments" hardly worth responding to.

If he believed it, he should have said something
This is not about Moore being better (which he's not) or worse (which he is)
This is about what Jones just said.
Your spin notwithstanding. The question is legitimate, "If he believed that and it's something that serves his constituency as some here are arguing, why didn't he say so earlier?"

It's not a question of his political philosophy. This is an issue of the behavior of the sitting president and something that many within the Democratic Party have been raising (centrist and progressive).
Why didn't he say it earlier?
To say it was settled by the election is a cop out (IMO). The president is accused of forcing himself on women, of having remained in a room where underage girls were in various stages of undress, etc.
That's kind of in tune with saying that anything he did prior to the election was settled when he won. Some of his behaviors (like not leaving the room where 15 year old girls weren't dressed) were likely criminal

And truth is... I can't find either way. In the absence of information, I'm going with no, he was probably not asked and I cede that point to you
But, I would point out that he was rather quick to call for Franken to resign at a meet-and-greet with supporters at a phone bank, "... It seems to me now that we’re at a point that it would be best for the country and what would be best for his constituents is for Sen. Franken to step aside and let’s move on,”

He could have simply used that as his statement. Or just used part of it, " It seems to me now that we’re at a point that it would be best for the country...”

1. As far as his position being centrist... I'm not sure that sexual harassment, remaining in a room with half-dressed and undressed underage girls is (or should be treated as) a right, centrist or left issue.

2. I realize Jones is not a politician by profession, but as a lawyer he knows (or should) to choose his words carefully. I 'ixquicked' (I don't use google) about Jones and trump and found page-after-page of links to news sites, aggregate sites, blogs, etc about what he said. Many of the more conservative sites just giddy about what he said. This is the sort of stuff that permeates the discussion and is used against Democrats constantly, "Well... Senator such-and-such doesn't agree..." It's why for years Republicans have done well, because they had a coherent message.

3. In fairness to Sen-Elect Jones, he did qualify his statement with "right now". But the focus is not on the "right now' but on the previous comments and that's by reputable news outlets (Reuters, Guardioan, NY Times, etc), aggregate sites, blogs, etc. Again, as a lawyer, he should know better. Especially given that his just won election was full of previous statements said by both men used against them

It's not a death knell and it doesn't make him a bad person or someone who should be drummed out of the Party and be forced into exile on an island somewhere. He was asked the question and he answered it. He can't really honestly say he didn't expect that question or something similar, because of the nature of politics now and his past statement on Sen Franken.

I happen to think the statement was wrongly worded, especially given the certainty with which he called on Franken to resign (and for honesty, I don't entirely disagree with either statement he made). Where I do disagree with him is to say that the election has settled matters. Things change quickly in the world of politics and what trump said and did has taken on more relevance than it did a year ago.

It'll pass, as do most things in politics. I was not happy when Sen Manchin said he was really more an independent two years ago. But, in a later interview on faux and fiends he was asked if he'd switch parties and said his brand was Democratic. It's all good and I will donate to his campaign as I did to his before; as I did Heitkamp, Jones , Landrieux and both Nelson's campaigns (I only mention those because they're more conservative Democrats).
I think it's a learning curve for anyone new to politics. Things are reported on and then feedback is quick (and often unmerciful). I don't have twitter, but I am guessing he's getting blistered hard by people -- part of the reason I don't have it.

We'll see. I don't regret that he won. I can''t think of anything moore would bring to the senate that I could support (other than maybe the horse would be spared his racist, bigoted butt riding on it). Politics is tougher than it was twenty years ago.

What I do take exception to, on this site is, that somehow people who are unhappy with what he said are somehow unrealistic purists, who are more than happy to undermine Democrats no matter what happens (Fred Sanders for example makes that very accusation) and because they're unhappy, outraged, whatever should be dismissed as ignorant or unrealistic.

situation, the fact that a madman is in charge of the nuclear arsenal, I think we should focus on the worst of the worst things he's doing and how his various proposals affect millions of people -- even all the people -- in the country. Not behaviors with individual women that, as bad as they were, probably ended years ago.

I posted below why I think Doug Jones took this position. (#37)

He's got to keep his re-election in focus. His hold on the seat is just as tenuous as a Congressman's, that is, two years. Since he eked out a win that was remarkable, he needs to build his constituency in order to stay in office.

Besides, how can anyone say how they will vote in a jury system? While I detest Trump, there aren't any articles of impeachment that were approved by the House. How could he possibly say how he'll vote? If he says up front that his mind is made up, how reasonable is that? No one would get seated on a criminal jury with that perspective.

Let's be glad he won the election. Support Democrats!

No.

others can see.

Doug Jones said it’s time for his fellow Democrats to “move on” from focusing on the numerous sexual misconduct allegations against President Donald Trump.

My gut tells me something is really wrong with this picture. No mention of russiagate either, and trump should not resign. All is fine, lets move on and carry on like democracy isnt crumbling. Has Jones always been/voted as a dem?

because he will lose that seat in 2020

Are we sure that Jones is a Democrat? Right now, I am ashamed that I donated money to his campaign. We should forget the molester in the White House and move on? In what universe? He is willing to vote on the Republican side? What is that all about? Call me upset and confused, and just a little angry. Okay, a lot angry!

There are a lot of steps that will have to take place before Senator-Elect Jones has to decide how he'll vote on any impeachment trial. If there's actually a Senate trial, I'm certain he'll vote appropriately. Simply look at his professional history to understand that he's a Democrat.

He's speaking to his home state and the people who voted for Moore. He must build his base because he barely won the election with only 1.5% of the vote. He has to run again in 2 years. That's not a lot of time.

I disagree with Doug. Sexual harassment and sexual assault are important mattters that need attention in the country. When it comes to dealing with Trump and his administration however, his (Trump’s) disregard for the constitution, collusion with foreign governments, dismantling of social programs, destruction of the environment, etc. are perhaps more important from a legislator’s standpoint. A return to checks and balances would be refreshing.

Plus, the guy did just win a tight race in Alabama to a horrendous opposing candidate.

The question of course was will he help our side at all? He could flip and just become a repub.

Democrat. Its time the DNC started supporting liberal or at least middle of the road candidates.

Are Charlie Brown.

thuglicans, are Lucy.

how stupid.

that'll infuriate DU.

When we had our majorities, we always had several Senators DU disparagingly called DINO's. That's how we kept leadership of all the Senate committees.

I'm glad to have another southern DINO in the Senate, IF that's what he turns out to be. He hasn't had a single vote yet though, so it's too early to tell.

fake President to resign but at this point with all else going on it is a distraction.
The outrage on the thread is unwarranted.

eom

There is a genuine difference of opinion on strategy, nothing more.

And no, I will not answer "when did you stop beating your wife" attempts.

resignation as opposed to one single Democrat who is saying otherwise, from a state where the last Democrat elected switched party to the Gop, Sen Shelby - who supported Jones, too.

I am curious, though, why you brought up beating your wife, its never even crossed my mind.

and people are bitching. Ffs.

for Trumps resigning for assaulting women, particularly since Moore called for Al Franken to resign.

It's one thing to take the position that Trump shouldn't be asked to resign, another thing to ask Franken to resign for the good of the country, but not ask the same of Trump.

I agree that the outrage in this thread is ridiculous. The guy barely won his race!

He's got to run for re-election in two short years. He must build his constituency and I think his comments are directed at Moore's voters. Alabama is one of the reddest states and his win was partly the result of Moore's awfulness. Next time, the GOP will field a better candidate and Senator-Elect Jones will need a larger margin of victory.

Importantly, he cannot say how he would vote on a hypothetical impeachment trial because there hasn't been any articles of impeachment, no presentation of evidence and no rebuttal. If you were charged with a crime, would you want the jurors to enter the jury box with prejudiced perspectives? That's not really how our system is supposed to work.

including nepotism, money laundering, tax evasion, and charging taxpayers to have the Secret Service at his own properties. And then we can look at what the blithering idiots he appointed to cabinet positions are doing.

Trump is a despicable, sexist pig, but this was widely publicized before the election and he still got enough people to vote for him to swing the Electoral College.

This is pretty simple and straight forward.

But, Dems gotta be Dems.

....

1) Doug Jones is another Joe Manchin

2) Doug Jones will be another rat fucker like Richard Shelby

3) Doug Jones is playing his cards close to his chest to keep the Republicans, guessing

I would much rather have him as my representative than that pedophile and lawbreaker Moore. And yes, I live in Alabama.

We're infinitely better off with Jones.

When Doug Jones made these comments, I'm willing to bet that he was speaking to the Alabamans who voted for Moore. I think he's trying to build some bridges in his home state. Don't forget, not only did he not win in a landslide, (he won by 1.5%), but he has to run again in a couple of years.

There are other voices in Congress, the Senate and the media that can keep up the pressure on Trump. Let the women who were assaulted and abused get their day in court. Should articles of impeachment be drafted, approved by the House and then tried in the Senate, I feel fairly confident that Senator-Elect Jones will vote to convict.

Give the guy a chance to have his election certified and get seated in the upper chamber. He's on our team.

There are more important things to spend time on than whether donald effing tRump is capable of feeling shame or remorse. He isn't. And clearly neither are those who voted for him and/or NoMoore.

Focus on the things that fire up our base--all of it! Focus on making things better for poor and middle class Americans of all colors. Doug Jones was elected in AL as the the result of a series of flukes and bad decisions on the other side of the aisle, plus a very smart and focused campaign on this side. I think he should work on proving that he belongs where he is, that he can be helpful where he is, by concentrating on economic issues, not on whether the patently unspeakable unteachables can be educated on the subject of race or respect for women. They can't. So go around.

I have absolutely no doubt that his heart is in the right place on this issue but in AL it isn't a winning issue, not against a "normal" Republican. His foot is in the door now though--a Democrat's foot is in the door--let him show the people of Alabama how we are different, and better. If that requires recognizing that his state largely gave tRump a pass on this, so be it (I think it is significant that the allegations did not hurt the pResident, but his chaotic, swamp-dwelling, healthcare-jeopardizing, fat cat-pandering administration IS hurting him...even in AL. Even among Fux Newz viewers).

I assume I'll get flamed for this. Ironically, I think it will largely come from folks who decry purity tests and demand that Democratic candidates fit their districts.

In Alabama he is Teflon Trump. They would offer up their babies to be sacrificed by him if he asked. It is pointless to attack Trump the person. He's already been forgiven of egregious sins. If Jones just focused on Republican party attempts to steal from the public purse, focus on GOPs actions which is what is really going to hurt average Alabama folks, knowing that Trump is far more popular than Republicans in congress. That is the weak spot.

But it is sad how we have to play these games. It probably won't make a difference anyways next election if the Republicans can scrape up someone other than a pedo to run.

We have to focus on th problems with Republican policies and why Democratic policies are better.

voted for Trump knowing that he admitted sexual assault on video. They heard he hung around with pedophiles and a woman accused him of raping her when she was 13.

that sometimes is best to shut your mouth, keep your thoughts for yourself.

It would be so discouraging if Mr. Jones ends up being a republican dressed like a donkey, one of those "blue democrats"...

Why go on the record, even if he feels this way?

We knew he wasn't going to be another Ted Kennedy, not in Alabama. But he is a yuge improvement over Beauregard and did stop "Judge Roy".

Right now the trumpsters are all up in arms about the emails. Special Prosecutor is part and parcel Doug Jones bailiwick. Maybe he senses this will be escalated to the point that even the useless GOP congress can no longer ignore it.

He's representing Alabama. And there isn't a bit of a chance that the Republican led Congress is going anywhere with sexual harassment allegations against Trump. So I couldn't care less what he says about this.

Look at his votes, not what he says. And then give him a lot of leeway. He's representing Alabama, not DU. He's going to have a tricky path to follow to get re-elected in 2020. He won't satisfy any of the purists here.

and I do speak for myself, but, IMO, there is nothing for him to gain from that statement, on the contrary, he now has set himself as a contradiction to what some people in his party are trying to do, and second, he now has aligned himself as an ally to Trump.

Why allow Franken to resign, why ask for Franken to resign from unproven, non investigated allegations but let trump move free when his are far worse?

I would like to understand what he gains with his comments. I feel this is a time when he could have kept his thoughts to himself. He just got elected, has not been sworn in, has not proposed any legislation, in other words has not done anything as a senator and his first public statement is that? Why.

I may be wrong, and I am open to be corrected on this, but that is how I feel. It is not that I am turning on him but that I am judging his statements as more detrimental than useful.

The only reason Moore didn't get elected was because he was a child molestor. Even then he only lost by 2 points.

Jones is going to have to stake some positions that are not mainstream Democratic if he is to have a chance of being re-elected in 2020.And this is nothing. It wasn't even a vote.

My initial reaction to the headline was "Hell f-ing no!"

But then I thought about it. He is right. Theses allegations didn't stop a lot of white women from voting for Trump. What makes us think they've really changed their minds now?

The point is people already had a chance to speak with their vote on Trump. They did. So maybe it is time we move on and put our energy into future battles and stop trying to re-fight one we lost.

1.I guess it is a good thing that he dudn't go out to shoot someone on Times Square at noon.
2. He used his wealth and power to silence women prior to his election. The whole story wasn't known then.
3. No one accused Al Franken of any abuse that occurred after his election.

It isn't as if there is any process to make him resign if it doesn't strike his fancy. His resigning would allow his accussers their fair day in court. If he would resign it isn't as if he would elude Mueller's net.

The question I bring up isn't that Jones has any effect either way whether Trumps resigns or not, my question is: in that asking for Trumps resignation doesn't take any energy from the work that needs to be done, getting rid of Trump, the tax "reform". restoring the ACA if not furthering coverage from it, why wouldn't he be consistent in his demands for both Franken and Trump?

in 2004, people voted to outlaw gay marriage in many states. It was only a short time (within three years) that people's opinions had changed a lot on the issue and polls showed a plurality of people felt it was okay.
People are more engaged about the issue of sexual harassment, sexual assault, etc than they were a year ago. More people do believe that he did do what he's accused of.
Except for the President, the US Senate is the most visible body in our Government because there are so few of them (relatively speaking and because of their intentional visibility). It is the place where most of the discussion gets wider attention
I also think it is a present battle we are fighting. Using your phrase 'battle' I would argue it's still part of a bigger war and to ignore it, is to give cover to others (Just my opinion)

can keep the sexual assault/harrassment charges in the forefront.

Jones is right that Dems shouldn't get themselves distracted by things that simply aren't going to happen like Trump resigning or the GOP-congress investigating the allegations. It's the same as Rachel Maddow deciding to ignore Trump's tweets and focus on informing viewers about the Russian interference investigation and other policy issues that are happening and do affect us.

sexual assault history cause, it isn't as if there is a process to make him resign. Its about letting know where you stand,

Hell I can't wait till Mueller indicts Trump.

against Trump. Dems can certainly go on record saying Trump should resign if they want to be consistent.

I 'spect he knows what case can be made in the present environment

Which... fine. Still a zillion times better than Roy Moore. That said, the national party as a whole does not need to tailor its message to the most Conservative voters in the nation. Its base thinks sexual harassment and assault are serious issues.

I get that he is representing Alabama, but sexual assault and harassment matter. Dems should absolutely make that case. Loudly. Every. Fucking. Day. Go after the Pussy-grabber in Chief.

Something more important than fixating over the election he just won.

Trump is still popular in AL. He doesn't want to be on the front lines against Trump.

...and for what it's worth, his comments say nothing about policy positions, just the question of whether he'll make progressives happy by criticizing Trump.

He's a Democratic senator in Alabama. If he went all-out left, he'd get smoked in 2020 by 30 points.

Jerk.

Better to have a conservative Dem in office than a conservative Repub in office.

He has to do this to be there for us on votes that really matter for millions.

Though I don't like what he's saying here, keep in mind he didn't exactly win in a landslide, and that was against a known pervert who only lost because he was scrutinized before the election.

What matters here is how Jones VOTES in the Senate, not whether or not his speeches will parrot those of Elizabeth Warren. Here's a sneak preview: they never will. Not if you want to get over 20% of the vote in Alabama.

As long as Jones VOTES like Elizabeth Warren, it will matter far more than whether or not he says the same things she does in front of TV cameras.

If the Democrats can regain the majority in the Senate, then a lot of stupid and hateful bills will never even come up for a vote. We won't be talking about protecting Medicare and Social Security because the Democrats who will control the committees won't allow such nonsense to reach a vote. Instead, we'll have an opportunity to try to do some good.

I know that you understand this but a lot of DUers don't seem to get this.

Go get him! Hurry, turn on him before he is even seated and his opponent concedes!



Talk about Dumbfounded..

.

to impeach. Trump Russia is what we should be getting him on. I agree he is a sexist asshole who probably assaulted numerous women but that was litigated during the election and he won with people knowing this. Coming from western PA, I believe the smartest route is the Russia route.

found that he did something then they could ask him, but there has been no investigation.

he is in a very red state and wants to hold on to the senate seat, so he's basically throwing some chum to the repuke voters of the state.

nothing like a strong Dem, huh folks.

Doug Jones positions must be in line with the People of Alabama. Not DU, Not The Purists of DU, Not Those On DU Looking To Throw Doug Jones Under The 18 Wheeled Bus Because He Represents The PEOPLE OF ALABAMA -- as a Democrat, Which Is Hard To Do As Many of those Same People almost elected a Child Molester.

Chill Out because Doug Jones is going to piss off many DU Purists all day long for the next three years, however, remember --- unless you live in ALABAMA he does not represent YOU. Doug Jones was Elected by DEMOCRATS in ALABAMA.

Last edited Mon Dec 18, 2017, 06:14 PM - Edit history (1)

is getting ready to do his job. I really don't want Trump to resign over the sex charges, and he won't anyway. Everyone knows he won't. I want him impeached for conspiracy with the Russians to change US foreign policy (or something along those lines). Anything less and he will end up a hero/martyr.