Groping a woman's breast is child's stuff?

of putting your hand too high up someone's back is.

And the vast majority took it and dealt with it and never said a word.

So I'm not very empathetic about a very small number of men having to deal with accusations they view as making a mountain out of a molehill.

If a guy puts his hand too high up my back, that's a problem.

Here's a rule that would solve the problem: don't touch a woman's body without her permission.

Very simple. It's stunning to me that many guys just can't bring themselves to follow that rule. But if they did, there would never be a problem.

That's the problem.

Here's a video:

after some accusation from years before...it was nothing shocking, but I don't recall the details. But nothing anyone should be fired over, IMO. It was a hasty, rash reflex in the fury of the "Me, too" movement.

Thank goodness they took him back, stating they had been too hasty.

It's gone from "he came out naked under a robe and said I'd have to stay and watch him, if I want the job" to "he put his hand around my waist when he agreed to take a pic with me that I asked him to take."

Like many things involving masses of people, it can get out of hand.

by zealotry incapable of balance, and even decency, are just as real in this scenario as those good people who are grabbing this moment to further good. To imagine one is joining a good "side" is to do wrong. There is no black and white here, and justice demands attention on individual cases, both of accusers and victims.

He apologized for it. I saw the video....on the beach I think, attractive blonde with mike interviewing him in casual setting. He's answering, acting silly, then he just reaches over to grab her boob, like kinda joking (like a teenage guy would do), but really did very quickly grab her, then withdrew his hand. Even then I think he said on camera that he was sorry, and she said it was okay (what else would she say?). Maybe that's it.

Maybe Neeson was just making a general "such as" reference, but no case in particular.

written consent has been floated as wise, or a good idea by some people, and yes, best not to be left alone with anyone in this environment, and parse words carefully

Witch hunt?

He used the word "witch hunt" in the way some DUers might use it to refer to the allegations against Al Franken.

He said that what he's been learning about how women are treated has been "chilling." And he's clearly disgusted with Harvey Weinstein and others. But he wonders if some people, like Garrison Keillor, might have been unfairly targeted. And he's not certain what to think about the allegations against Dustin Hoffman.

And I think he's not entirely wrong.

He simply touched a woman's back in was probably a instinctual attempt to offer comfort, immediately realized this wasn't the right thing to do and with equal immediacy apologized. The woman appeared to accept his apology. Then, eight or ten years later, on the verge of retirement, not having repeated the act in any other situation, he gets called out and fired?

If a societal consensus had emerged accepting the need to stop sexual harassment, would he even have ended up in the situation he was in? Did he get forced out simply because the feeling was that the larger problem would only be addressed by making what he did on(apparently) a single occasion a career-ending thing?

Don't have anything else to say, don't know the answers, and recognize that the rules on all of this should be determined entirely by women.

His love for Trump.

We like to watch you in movies, not to listen to you.

to assert their freedom of speech.

Your freedom to criticize the criticizers. All part of it.

It would be better if they listened to the video that someone else posted here.

the misguided concept that freedom of speech equals freedom from being criticized. That one always gets me

misled a lot of people who didn't watch the video. Neeson's comments were much more thoughtful and nuanced than you'd guess by reading the title.

to judgment based on a poor summary in the Guardian piece.

and the ability to face your accuser.

else needs to call it out right there and then, ideally by telling that person to stop it, and if the person continues, then take appropriate action against this person, whether it is legally, or to loudly and clearly tell that person to keep their f**king hands to themselves

Especially in certain power dynamic circumstances.

because of certain "power dynamics", I should just do what they want, because it is a lot to ask

Especially for young people - it can be very difficult.

I froze when after dinner at an acquaintance's house, while my little sister and the man's wife was in another room, he picked up my hand and put it on his crotch.

After I got over the initial shock, I got my sister, made polite goodbyes to his wife and him and left.

Why didn't I say something then? I don't completely know. Not wanting to bust up a marriage? I was very shy at that age, and avoided conflict like the plague. He and his wife were past middle-aged. Trying to protect my sister? After we left, I found out that earlier in the evening she had a similar thing happen (and likewise didn't say anything).

After we were safely out of there, the next day I called and gave him a piece of my mind - more indignant about him doing that to my sister than myself. I don't think at that time I knew what he did was potentially criminal. It never occurred to me to even tell my parents, much less take any legal steps. That was around 1971, and what little I knew about crimes involving sex was limited to rape.

And though it was an unpleasant memory that I didn't forget, I also didn't dwell on it. Of course in my case, I wasn't in a workplace environment or subjected to power dynamics. Also I didn't see the old creep again so the memory wasn't aggravated by those factors.

Just to say, young people like I was don't necessarily have a clue about how to deal with something completely out of their knowledge or experience.

At that age I don't think I'd have been that brave.

But I do sympathize with someone whose past behaviors don't comport with their behavior today. Moreover, we are talking about mistakes with the same ardor as deliberate, overt, and dangerous sexual assault incidents.

That just can't be right.

The reason why most woman I know don't speak up is because they're afraid of being called liars, bitches, gold diggers, feminists etc. It's the easiest way to shut a victim up.

any requirement that women speak up. We all experience crap from other people throughout our lives that we just let go.

when life gives us sh*t, we build a toilet. We don't just put up with it.