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MelissaB

(16,420 posts)
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 02:11 PM Aug 2018

White House Counsel Has Cooperated Extensively With Mueller's Obstruction Inquiry

Source: New York Times

WASHINGTON — The White House counsel, Donald F. McGahn II, has cooperated extensively in the special counsel investigation, sharing detailed accounts about the episodes at the heart of the inquiry into whether President Trump obstructed justice, including some that investigators would not have learned of otherwise, according to a dozen current and former White House officials and others briefed on the matter.

In at least three voluntary interviews with investigators that totaled 30 hours over the past nine months, Mr. McGahn described the president’s furor toward the Russia investigation and the ways in which he urged Mr. McGahn to respond to it. He provided the investigators examining whether Mr. Trump obstructed justice a clear view of the president’s most intimate moments with his lawyer.

Among them were Mr. Trump’s comments and actions during the firing of the F.B.I. director, James B. Comey, and Mr. Trump’s obsession with putting a loyalist in charge of the inquiry, including his repeated urging of Attorney General Jeff Sessions to claim oversight of it. Mr. McGahn was also centrally involved in Mr. Trump’s attempts to fire the special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III, which investigators might not have discovered without him.

For a lawyer to share so much with investigators scrutinizing his client is unusual. Lawyers are rarely so open with investigators, not only because they are advocating on behalf of their clients but also because their conversations with clients are potentially shielded by attorney-client privilege, and in the case of presidents, executive privilege.

Read more: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/18/us/politics/don-mcgahn-mueller-investigation.html




38 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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White House Counsel Has Cooperated Extensively With Mueller's Obstruction Inquiry (Original Post) MelissaB Aug 2018 OP
Was just about to post BumRushDaShow Aug 2018 #1
McGahn doesn't want to be the Chuck Colson of Trumpgate marylandblue Aug 2018 #2
Well no pardon for you McGhan - hugs and kisses - shithole. Iliyah Aug 2018 #3
This story got a "Boom" response from Lawfare's Benjamin Wittes, plus this: highplainsdem Aug 2018 #4
He isn't the presidents lawyer...... getagrip_already Aug 2018 #18
+100 BadgerMom Aug 2018 #23
yawn Backwoodsrider Aug 2018 #19
Thx. You posted excellent analysis another thread. Link and quote: Bernardo de La Paz Aug 2018 #21
Backwoods, I don't think you understand the implications. Not even a little bit. Nitram Aug 2018 #33
looking at the facts not feelings Backwoodsrider Aug 2018 #34
What makes you so sure MgGahn was not involved in discussions related to Comee's firing and Nitram Aug 2018 #35
I dont see why they would discuss firings with McGahn he only represents the OFFICE of the pres Backwoodsrider Aug 2018 #36
The fact that he only represents the office of the president is exactly why it is so important. Nitram Aug 2018 #37
yep I may of been wrong on this one Backwoodsrider Aug 2018 #38
Doesn't the White House counsel support the Office of the Presidency Zorro Aug 2018 #5
Exactly. BumRushDaShow Aug 2018 #8
Trump thought the attorney general was there to protect him also. milestogo Aug 2018 #31
Yup. BumRushDaShow Aug 2018 #32
WHC is the legal representation of the Executive Office of the Executive Branch... TygrBright Aug 2018 #9
Greg Sargent's reaction: Holy crap highplainsdem Aug 2018 #6
Two Questions mobeau69 Aug 2018 #16
he's not worried because heaven05 Aug 2018 #7
This message was self-deleted by its author pecosbob Aug 2018 #10
Well...there goes McGahn's security clearance... pecosbob Aug 2018 #11
"Boom boom boom BOOM - gonna shoot you right down" Leghorn21 Aug 2018 #12
YaaaaaaHoooooooo rurallib Aug 2018 #13
Trump doesn't believe in law or precedent bucolic_frolic Aug 2018 #14
Indeed. iluvtennis Aug 2018 #17
We keep hearing this *boom* stuff, but nothing ever changes GusBob Aug 2018 #15
True..... kinda' difficult to break the spine of a worm groundloop Aug 2018 #20
To Really Put this Article into Focus Read This Quote DDySiegs Aug 2018 #22
What kind of co-operation? Call my cynical still_one Aug 2018 #24
White House counsel is not dumps lawyer, if I am not mistaken, he works for us , the people. scarytomcat Aug 2018 #25
Uhhh... "For a lawyer to share so much with investigators scrutinizing his CLIENT..." tinrobot Aug 2018 #26
They simply want to cloud the waters further pecosbob Aug 2018 #27
McGahn is not Trumps lawyer, he is Whitehouse counsel. sfwriter Aug 2018 #28
you would think someone who has spent that much time being sued and filing for bankruptcy Takket Aug 2018 #29
McGahn represents the Office of the President, not the person who is President milestogo Aug 2018 #30

BumRushDaShow

(129,197 posts)
1. Was just about to post
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 02:12 PM
Aug 2018

This could be why some of the ranting and raving!

Edit to add that Wittes cracks me up with that BOOM one because he added the comment "Sweet" to the audio.

highplainsdem

(49,006 posts)
4. This story got a "Boom" response from Lawfare's Benjamin Wittes, plus this:
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 02:21 PM
Aug 2018
This story is completely remarkable. The President’s lawyer is one of the principal witnesses as to his conduct on obstruction. That will teach Trump to waive all executive privilege claims!








getagrip_already

(14,776 posts)
18. He isn't the presidents lawyer......
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 04:03 PM
Aug 2018

His title is White House Council. His client is quite literally the white house executive branch operations. Trump is not his client, though he certainly does a lot of work involving trump.

But he doesn't represent trump. He represents the white house and executive branch. So he has no duty of attorney client privilege with trump personally.

As an example, if I am interviewed by my companies corporate lawyers, I have no attorney client privilege with them. I would treat any such conversation just like I would a conversation with an fbi agent. If there was ANY chance of jeopardy I either wouldn't discuss it (and probably get fired) or I would insist my own attorney be present, and probably be fired.

The CEO is in the same position,. but can fire the lawyers. I couldn't.

He may have them tied up with an NDA, but those don't apply to criminal investigations. You can't be compelled to with hold evidence via an NDA. That's illegal.

Backwoodsrider

(764 posts)
19. yawn
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 04:22 PM
Aug 2018

Really, you folks are falling for this? This is some duff dancing in the corner while team Trump has knocked off one institution after another now all we got left is the judicial and he is taking that down one honest leader at a time. Trump is accessing both his bases and us the Progressives on an emotional level. This article is no reason for high 5s its going to be gone replaced by something tomorrow when trump gives our little wounded egos something else to latch onto that makes us feel like we are better than him, while he empties out the cookie jar

Yes I chose to communicate with emotion when I discuss Putin and his agent Trump are pushing the US down off the hill bit nothing else seems to work

Bernardo de La Paz

(49,015 posts)
21. Thx. You posted excellent analysis another thread. Link and quote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 04:36 PM
Aug 2018

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=11017408

First the author Haberman has written many storys that take Trumps side I suspect her source for this piece is Gulliani so I expect that she is doing her part for Trump as she has done these last 18 months.

Next MgGahn is attorney for OFFICE of pres not pres himself so he has no information on what Trump does behind the scenes. The office of pres did not colluded with Russia D Trump did so MgGahn can talk all week he knows nothing because he didn't need to.

Trump has whitewashed every single document before it was releases to the GC. Remember the Cohen videos Trump team go access to them before trial, they know what they are doing when it comes to controlling information.

Remember all NDSs? Trump knows the only way him and the mob can pull off the mob taking control of western institutions is if they control the information and Trump, probably with the help of a few russkies has learned how to control information.

Finally what is the reason Haberman and Trump posted this right now? First this article has allowed Trump to control what cable news talks about this weekend and 2nd Trump can now say "see I gave up all the documents presidential restrictions on the questions the SC could as MgGahn so Trump must be innocent if they have no smoking gun". paraphrase.

Hold on everyone we are picking up speed as we near the bottom of this slippery slope

Nitram

(22,825 posts)
33. Backwoods, I don't think you understand the implications. Not even a little bit.
Sun Aug 19, 2018, 03:01 PM
Aug 2018

But go ahead, moan and groan, and curse the fates. Meanwhile an airtight case is being constructed one brick at at time. thee wall was finished some time ago, now there are water-proofing it and sealing it.

Backwoodsrider

(764 posts)
34. looking at the facts not feelings
Sun Aug 19, 2018, 03:27 PM
Aug 2018

We could get all excited about MgGahn talking to Mueller but facts are MgGahn saw Mueller way back in Oct yet it is just released now? Also MgGahn nows nothing about Trumps illegal behavior he is not Trumps attorney he is attorney for pres big difference to the type of info MgGahn was exposed to.

Who benefits? Trump by him now being able to say 'Look what Trump did he is working with Mueller' yet we know he has no intention in allowing Mueller to complete his report but this article sure made some on the lefts day.

What is airtight is objective truth and they will come out sooner or later. The US still going to be a democratic republic when truth finally does come out? stay tuned

Nitram

(22,825 posts)
35. What makes you so sure MgGahn was not involved in discussions related to Comee's firing and
Sun Aug 19, 2018, 04:23 PM
Aug 2018

attempts to fire Mueller, just for two examples? The motives for both old those were obstruction of justice, and Trump would probably have been quite clear about his personal motivations with someone who he sees as part of the Executive Branch. Trump has long labored under the deduction that everyone within the Executive Branch owes him 100% loyalty and is working directly for him. MgGhan is in a position to share "objective truth" about any number of significant topics.

Backwoodsrider

(764 posts)
36. I dont see why they would discuss firings with McGahn he only represents the OFFICE of the pres
Sun Aug 19, 2018, 10:56 PM
Aug 2018

But cool part is with McGahn and Cohen and Stone and others I do not see how Trump can keep the facts quiet this fall so we will get to see what really happens before our eyes

Nitram

(22,825 posts)
37. The fact that he only represents the office of the president is exactly why it is so important.
Mon Aug 20, 2018, 09:49 AM
Aug 2018

He was present at discussions but is not limited by attorney-client privilege in the case of President Trump. He could be a gold mind of very reliable testimony regarding motive. Dean played a similar role during Watergate.

Backwoodsrider

(764 posts)
38. yep I may of been wrong on this one
Mon Aug 20, 2018, 07:44 PM
Aug 2018

Did not know he knew McGahn was present for any of the meetings or knew anything else.

Lets let some time go by but yeah this looks a lot more serious than I first thought.

Zorro

(15,743 posts)
5. Doesn't the White House counsel support the Office of the Presidency
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 02:28 PM
Aug 2018

and actually isn't a Trump personal attorney?

I believe this issue came up before in the Paula Jones case.

BumRushDaShow

(129,197 posts)
8. Exactly.
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 02:36 PM
Aug 2018

The OP linked article pretty much indicates this too -

It is not clear that Mr. Trump appreciates the extent to which Mr. McGahn has cooperated with the special counsel. The president wrongly believed that Mr. McGahn would act as a personal lawyer would for clients and solely defend his interests to investigators, according to a person with knowledge of his thinking.

<...>

Mr. McGahn, who had objected to Mr. Cobb’s hiring, was dubious, according to people he spoke to around that time. As White House counsel, not a personal lawyer, he viewed his role as protector of the presidency, not of Mr. Trump. Allowing a special counsel to root around the West Wing could set a precedent harmful to future administrations.

BumRushDaShow

(129,197 posts)
32. Yup.
Sun Aug 19, 2018, 11:50 AM
Aug 2018

DOJ = personal law firm
DHS = personal goon squad
Treasury = personal piggy bank
DOD = personal honor guard

TygrBright

(20,763 posts)
9. WHC is the legal representation of the Executive Office of the Executive Branch...
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 02:37 PM
Aug 2018

...of government, NOT of the Executive himself.

It's a difficult line to walk, but there's a fair amount of precedence accumulated over time to guide an attorney in where the interests of the one leave off and the other begins.

helpfully,

Bright

mobeau69

(11,149 posts)
16. Two Questions
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 03:36 PM
Aug 2018

1. Isn't that last sentence that begins "Mr. McGahn cautioned..." a little bit of a bummer?

2. So does McGahn show up at the WH on Monday or what?


 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
7. he's not worried because
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 02:35 PM
Aug 2018

Is the fix in? Way down in the pit of my stomach something tells me that it is...orange nightmare will skate, patsies and trumpchumps will be crushed under the wheels of the bus that orange nightmare is driving to our destruction. I so hope I'm wrong.

Response to MelissaB (Original post)

pecosbob

(7,542 posts)
11. Well...there goes McGahn's security clearance...
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 02:48 PM
Aug 2018

Important to remember here that McGahn is not Trump's attorney and Trump is not his client. McGahn represents the office of the president.

Leghorn21

(13,525 posts)
12. "Boom boom boom BOOM - gonna shoot you right down"
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 02:48 PM
Aug 2018

How glorious and enthralling!!

Mr. Wittes doesn’t BOOM as often as he used to, so nowadays when he DOES???!?!?




Have MERCY!!!

bucolic_frolic

(43,218 posts)
14. Trump doesn't believe in law or precedent
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 03:01 PM
Aug 2018

There's just Trump. History began with Trump. The present is Trump. The future is Trump. There is only Trump. Very simple world view.

GusBob

(7,286 posts)
15. We keep hearing this *boom* stuff, but nothing ever changes
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 03:10 PM
Aug 2018

Lost track of the straws that broke the camels back

Because the camel is the spineless GOP

groundloop

(11,519 posts)
20. True..... kinda' difficult to break the spine of a worm
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 04:29 PM
Aug 2018

And yes, it seems like there's a daily revelation that certainly must be IT, but Spanky keeps right on dragging the country down. I was a mere teenager during Watergate and didn't pay a lot of attention to the news, but I do recall there being new revelations all the time which everyone felt would be the end of Nixon yet he seemed to hold on. Ultimately he did finally slither away, but it sure seemed to take a lot longer than it should have. I suspect Russiagate will play out much the same.

DDySiegs

(253 posts)
22. To Really Put this Article into Focus Read This Quote
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 04:36 PM
Aug 2018

This quote appears about 20% into the article and records the reaction to its content of the Deputy Whitewater prosecutor (who investigated Bill Clinton in the 1990s):

“A prosecutor would kill for that,” said Solomon L. Wisenberg, a deputy independent counsel in the Whitewater investigation, which did not have the same level of cooperation from President Bill Clinton’s lawyers. “Oh my God, it would have been phenomenally helpful to us. It would have been like having the keys to the kingdom.”

scarytomcat

(1,706 posts)
25. White House counsel is not dumps lawyer, if I am not mistaken, he works for us , the people.
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 05:29 PM
Aug 2018

He should be cooperating. Telling all that he knows, hears and is told.

tinrobot

(10,903 posts)
26. Uhhh... "For a lawyer to share so much with investigators scrutinizing his CLIENT..."
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 05:40 PM
Aug 2018

McGahn is NOT a personal attorney.

His "client" is the White House.

Let's be clear on this.

pecosbob

(7,542 posts)
27. They simply want to cloud the waters further
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 05:48 PM
Aug 2018

making Mueller out to be somehow cheating or subverting due process. I think this was put out right before the weekend by the RWers to take some traffic away from the Manigault fiasco.

 

sfwriter

(3,032 posts)
28. McGahn is not Trumps lawyer, he is Whitehouse counsel.
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 10:46 PM
Aug 2018

They said:

"For a lawyer to share so much with investigators scrutinizing his client is unusual. Lawyers are rarely so open with investigators, not only because they are advocating on behalf of their clients but also because their conversations with clients are potentially shielded by attorney-client privilege, and in the case of presidents, executive privilege."

I think this all sounds like McGahn sees his duty to the office over his duty to Trump. That's a good sign.

Takket

(21,587 posts)
29. you would think someone who has spent that much time being sued and filing for bankruptcy
Sat Aug 18, 2018, 10:55 PM
Aug 2018

would understand the difference between a corporate and personal lawyer.

LOL

milestogo

(16,829 posts)
30. McGahn represents the Office of the President, not the person who is President
Sun Aug 19, 2018, 09:08 AM
Aug 2018

I'm sure Trump does not understand the difference.

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