Trump is livid I am sure. Pressure is mounting on him, McConnel, and GOP. No giving in to extortion. Now rightwing radio is condemning trumps offer. Great to watch.

The Russians would be so disappointed. Mango Musselini would be trapped.

But nonwhite Americans who are born here are still foreign invaders.

To say, "All steel must come from US companies," would essentially be giving into the primary issue, should the wall be built at all?

No wall, ever, is the correct position, both morally and politically.

anything less will lead to repeating this idiocy over and over

Citizenship guaranteed as part of bill or no wall. Of course with all the lawsuits against the wall, he won't even be alive when and if the wall is started.

It's technically not feasible as Trump describes it. And legally, they'd have to purchase a massive amount of land from Americans who don't want to sell. Both will be tied up in studies and legal cases that will last many years.

This Engineer Is An Actual Wall Expert And She Just Destroyed Trump’s Wall Proposal In One Post
https://www.boredpanda.com/actual-engineer-wall-explanation-amy-patrick/

Can All Lawyers Just Admit The Wall Will Never Be Built Because Of The Fifth Amendment?
https://abovethelaw.com/2019/01/can-all-lawyers-just-admit-the-wall-will-never-be-built-because-of-the-fifth-amendment/

Knowing full well that it will never come to fruition maybe we should stop saying that, pretend it's a good idea, go with it, provide some funding that we know will be a sunk cost -- maybe even redirect money already wasted in the military budget, in exchange for permanent DACA protections and other permanent immigration reforms. We get our thing now, they get to pretend they're getting a thing we know will never happen.

He's pathetic!

wall is permanent. (Here's hoping that's still enough to piss off the MAGAts)

They built a "permanent" wall around the "Western degenerate" city of West Berlin in 1961. In 1990 they were feeding it into rock crushers and paving roads with the remains.

Given that, there's already a pretty substantial barrier between Mexico and the United States. Are we supposed to believe Trump's wall has magic powers the one that's already there doesn't have?

do I actually have to explain on this board that the point is the wall is intended by its proponents to be permanent--a massively stupid idea on its face and fitting for the dumpster--while the immigration fix is intended to be temporary?

.. is so worried about the 'humanitarian crisis at the southern border,' then why did he approve separating families, locking children in cages, failing to provide medical care to those in need, and allowing Border Patrol to mistreat people and destroy water relief stations set up to help those 'making the dangerous trek north?' Why doesn't he listen to officials in the area (Republican Rep Hurd, the Mayor of McAllen, etc.) who refute his statements about illegal crime and drug trafficking?

He's a disingenuous bastard.

He really doesn't give a shit about anyone but himself. This proves it beyond doubt.

My op earlier on scotus
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100211695586

Last edited Sat Jan 19, 2019, 06:51 PM - Edit history (1)

Reporters need to keep asking him why he's trying so hard, when he said, "Mexico will pay for the wall."

Then play a compilation of all the times he shouted it at rallies.

BTW, has anyone pointed out that $5.6 billion is nowhere near enough to build a 2,000 mile wall? I read one estimate that said it would complete maybe 700 miles. And that's if everything goes as planned, which it never does. Government projects are notorious for overruns, usually many times the original cost.

This is one of those "I only want to put it in part way in" moments. Trump knows that once the first 10 foot wide section of his wall goes up, it will have to be finished even after he's left office, because "Look at all the money we've already put into it."

The wall is Trump's pyramid -- something that ensures his name will live eternally.

But he'll have to drop the Canadian steel tarriff.

aluminum is real?!?

Here are the Republican senators up for re-election in 2020. They have to be worried about the impact of the shutdown on their re-election. I can see the Democratic campaign ads now!

Lamar Alexander (R-Tennessee)—has said he’s retiring
Shelley Moore Capito (R-West Virginia)
Bill Cassidy (R-Louisiana)
Susan Collins (R-Maine)
John Cornyn (R-Texas)
Tom Cotton (R-Arkansas)
Steve Daines (R-Montana)
Mike Enzi (R-Wyoming)
Joni Ernst (R-Iowa)
Cory Gardner (R-Colorado)
Lindsey Graham (R-South Carolina)
Cindy Hyde-Smith (R-Mississippi)
James Inhofe (R-Oklahoma)
Martha McSally (R-Arizona)
Mitch McConnell (R-Kentucky)
David Perdue (R-GA)
Jim Risch (R-Idaho)
Pat Roberts (R-Kansas)
Mike Rounds (R-South Dakota)
Ben Sasse (R-Nebraska)
Dan Sullivan (R-Alaska)
Thom Tillis (R-North Carolina)

...and I’m a big softie. I hate this shutdown and the humiliation that people living paycheck to paycheck are experiencing. Not to mention looming air catastrophes and food poisoning. But he’s not offering anything Dreamers don’t already have since they can apply for a 2 year extension in Sept 2019.

But I might be willing to trade for a State of the Union address where he’s not allowed to demonize anyone or anything. Wouldn’t that be something? I still wouldn’t listen to it, but I would love it to happen anyway, just for the novelty and the ridiculous presidential pivot analysis it would create.

To fight the right wing media's meme of "Democrats want an open border...no security" . And of course the rest of the MSM likes to keep the "both sides are guilty" narrative going.

What I'd love to see is a set of commercials that says nothing about Trump or his wall. Just an ad promoting border security spending by .......Democrats!

They have already proposed a bill spending a billion dollars on border security...outside of a wall. More advanced tech etc....

https://www.kjrh.com/news/national/house-democrats-to-propose-1-billion-for-border-security-without-money-for-wall

As part of a package of six spending bills, House Democrats next week will vote on $1 billion for additional border security measures, according to a Democratic source.

The $1 billion would not include money for the border wall, as Democrats are trying to make the case there are other border security measures that are more effective.


Run an ad, a smart ad, with the message that no one takes the security of the United States more seriously, but also no one takes financial responsibility more seriously than Democrats either. A double whammy. An ad highlighting how this is now the 21st century, and there are better more efficient ways to spend less of your tax dollars on border security, than what a wall would cost, and get much the same results. Promote American ingenuity, technology, etc...But have the tone of the ad serious, and smart, and with no mention of Trump whatsoever.

I'd counter with 750 new judges, 10 year DACA and TPS and buy Made in America steel.

Pelosi and the other Democrats should know that. They should not take this offer.

would consider supporting it.

With apologies to Hans Christian Andersen...


There existed an pResident who loved walls and spent all of his people's money on them.

One day, two swindlers claiming to be wall builders entered the pResident's city and proclaimed they were capable of making the finest, biggly-est, most magnificent wall the world has ever seen. So extraordinary was this wall, it was invisible to anyone who was incompetent or stupid.

Hearing of the amazing "wall", the foolish pResident thought he could use it weed out undesirables in his city. He paid the swindlers an enormous sum & they set out to "create" the wall; knowing they would only need go through the motions.

The pResident sent several advisors to guage their progress and all the advisors reported the wall magnificent, not wanting to appear unworthy for seeing nothing at all; the wall didn't exist!

Finally the wall was "finished", the swindlers already having counted the gold and jewels they had received. A procession was arranged to show off the pResident's new wall and the entire city gathered to view it. Having been paised by the swinglers, who remarked how wonderful he the wall looked, and how big the wall was, he appeared before his people.

The people, having heard of the builders's abilities and the wall's fictious properties, were amazed and offered thunderous applause to the now beaming pResident. None of them were willing to admit that they hadn't seen a thing; for if anyone did, then he was either stupid or unfit for the job he held. Never before had the pResident's wall been such a success.

While expressing admiration at their pResident's new "invisible" wall, a small boy cried out... "But the pResident has no wall!"

That can be cut thru with a blowtorch or hacksaw? Huge waste of our money.

Go for the tech, you idiot. Maybe no one has explained to him how that works?

Namely, running a cable between the top of Trump's wall and the back of a D6 Cat and stepping on the gas.

I actually did that once with my old one-ton dually. Evil CA neighbors put a gate up in front of my gate on my access road. Took out a headlight, but it was worth it!

What does that mean? That doesn't make them citizens, does it? I suppose Pelosi could counter.

They invented clear aluminum. That's all I keep thinking about.

A keyboard, how quaint!

only to renege at the last minute?

Hey, Trump! We don't need you to promise to look into something and then, at the last minute, after you have gotten what you want from it, pull the rug out from under us!

That's what we have Susan Collins for.

The Russian Con Artist offered a temporary DACA deal for a permanent wall. Come on McLaughlin, do your homework before you put misleading titles like this up!

He could at least be honest about it. The Eminent Domain claims alone would run into hundreds of billions of dollars, and decades of litigation. The raw steel costs would be over $80 B. Add in the actual construction costs AND border security costs to... protect the fucking fence against every midnight vandal with a buzz saw.

So he doesn't actually want a barrier. It seems he just wants to fuck with America.

And all his claims in this offer is worthless. Democrats should offer him a stealth wall that's invisible (lol) and see if he'd take that. All trump wants, is to get approval so he can then get contractors he can pressure to give him a payoff in the form of campaign funding contributions , which he'll funnel into his pockets with. That's why he wants it , and soon to do infrastructure, and using it to generate him money into his pockets also. He did this already with his running as a candidate , and after he was elected for his election party he scammed millions from to give himself with. His rally funds he generates isn't used for his campaign either , andmore than likely what he uses for a legal defense money generator.

Trump wants a wall in part to stop the flow of illegal drugs and illegal guns between our two countries. So, why does he want to build a structure with slats spaced just far enough apart to pass guns and drugs through? And, naturally, it's got to be made out of a kind of steel only the Russians make.

As for the DACA concession, that isn't much of one: We have no guarantee whatsoever Trump isn't going to decide to rescind the protection as soon as he gets his wall money.

Sorry Donald, we're going to have to pass on this too.