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Bosonic

(3,746 posts) Tue Oct 9, 2012, 07:28 AM Oct 2012

Merkel lands in Greece as protesters mass on streets

Source: Reuters

ATHENS, Oct 9 (Reuters) - Germany's Angela Merkel arrived in Greece on her first visit since Europe's debt crisis erupted here three years ago, braving protests to deliver a message of support - but no new money - to a nation hammered by recession and fighting to stay in the euro.

Thousands of Greeks defied a ban on protests, gathering in Syntagma square in central Athens as Merkel's plane touched down. Two protesters dressed in German military uniforms waved a red-black-and-white swastika flag and held out their arms in the Nazi salute.

Many Greeks blame Merkel for forcing painful cuts on Greece in exchange for two EU-IMF bailout packages totalling over 200 billion euros.

Police have readied 6,000 officers, including anti-terrorist units and rooftop snipers, to provide security during the six-hour visit. German sites in the Greek capital, including the embassy and Goethe Institute, are under special protection.

Read more: http://www.trust.org/alertnet/news/merkel-lands-in-greece-as-protesters-mass-on-streets

Live stream:

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/12241370

11 replies

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Highlight:

Merkel lands in Greece as protesters mass on streets (Original Post) Bosonic Oct 2012 OP

waved a red-black-and-white swastika flag and held out their arms in the Nazi salute Kolesar Oct 2012 #1

That was two protesters cate94 Oct 2012 #3

K&R midnight Oct 2012 #2

Livestreams tama Oct 2012 #4

The choice is straight dipsydoodle Oct 2012 #5

Also "ordinary consumers" tama Oct 2012 #6

Yes "ordinary consumers" stop paying debts all the time, no big deal. dipsydoodle Oct 2012 #7

The thing is, tho, that some of these loans were made on the basis of false Ghost Dog Oct 2012 #8

It was the misrepresentation of data which got them into the Euro dipsydoodle Oct 2012 #9

I think it's only the usual suspects who've benefitted much, in either country, actually: Ghost Dog Oct 2012 #10

"Greek taxpayers spent more than 2.5 million euro in order to secure her a safe stay in Athens." tama Oct 2012 #11

Kolesar

(31,182 posts)

1. waved a red-black-and-white swastika flag and held out their arms in the Nazi salute

Reply to Bosonic (Original post)

Tue Oct 9, 2012, 07:45 AM

Oct 2012

Bad messaging. That does not earn them any sympathy with me.

cate94

(2,811 posts)

3. That was two protesters

Reply to Kolesar (Reply #1)

Tue Oct 9, 2012, 09:47 AM

Oct 2012

out of thousands.

midnight

(26,624 posts)

2. K&R

Reply to Bosonic (Original post)

Tue Oct 9, 2012, 08:50 AM

Oct 2012

tama

(9,137 posts)

4. Livestreams

Reply to Bosonic (Original post)

Tue Oct 9, 2012, 10:04 AM

Oct 2012

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/journalsp
http://www.livestream.com/stopcarteltvgr
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/xorisfm

dipsydoodle

(42,239 posts)

5. The choice is straight

Reply to Bosonic (Original post)

Tue Oct 9, 2012, 11:37 AM

Oct 2012

like it or not.

Greece either implement the cuts in which case the net benefit is 13bn euros PLUS additional the bailout funds or they don't make the cuts which leaves them just a theoretical 13bn Euros to do with as they please. They have 11 days left to decide. The former will allow them to continue paying state pensions etc.

Perhaps those who don't agree with loans having terms and conditions attached could quote where they have obtained ordinary consumer loans in the past where they were able to change the terms and conditions at their own will.

In the current case with Greece the main lender is German taxpayers.

I got the 11 day ref from here :

Speaking on Monday, Jean-Claude Juncker, chairman of the Eurogroup finance ministers of the eurozone, raised the pressure on Greece, calling on the government to demonstrate it could implement planned reforms "by 18 October at the latest" to qualify for the next bailout instalment of 31.5bn euros.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-19879584

tama

(9,137 posts)

6. Also "ordinary consumers"

Reply to dipsydoodle (Reply #5)

Tue Oct 9, 2012, 12:13 PM

Oct 2012

stop paying debts all the time, no big deal.

What makes Che admirer so keen spokesman for IMF neoliberals?

dipsydoodle

(42,239 posts)

7. Yes "ordinary consumers" stop paying debts all the time, no big deal.

Reply to tama (Reply #6)

Tue Oct 9, 2012, 12:43 PM

Oct 2012

No big deal other than the fact when they need another loan whatever the lender wants a higher yield to reflect the risk.

In the case of Greece which has a poor payment record they have to chose between the bond market and paying a high interest rates with no conditions attached or funds from the ECB at much lower rates but with conditions attached.

It is their however their choice to make.

I was originally foreseen that Greece would make November at best before the final calamity. Their now seems to be postponements in hand simply to protect the possible affect on US elections from the inevitable worldwide financial fallout. Fat of of good that does the population of Greece.

Ghost Dog

(16,881 posts)

8. The thing is, tho, that some of these loans were made on the basis of false

Reply to dipsydoodle (Reply #7)

Tue Oct 9, 2012, 02:11 PM

Oct 2012

information, misrepresentation of data, cooked books, outright fraud, dammit, a scam or scams, complicit in which were/are no doubt many, and many high-up Greeks, but also including, apparently and for example, some Vampire Squid 'professionals' out of Frankfurt (backed up by head office, and behind them...)...

dipsydoodle

(42,239 posts)

9. It was the misrepresentation of data which got them into the Euro

Reply to Ghost Dog (Reply #8)

Tue Oct 9, 2012, 02:31 PM

Oct 2012

It was being in the Euro which got them the loans. Since then Greek population has benefited particularly by way of lower overall unemployment but now they're facing the downside.

Ghost Dog

(16,881 posts)

10. I think it's only the usual suspects who've benefitted much, in either country, actually:

Reply to dipsydoodle (Reply #9)

Tue Oct 9, 2012, 03:02 PM

Oct 2012

eg:

... By comparison with the rest of the eurozone, Germany's recent economic performance has looked good. But compared with the days of Konrad Adenauer, Ludwig Erhard or Willy Brandt, it has been unimpressive. For much of the past decade, German banks were as reckless as their American and British counterparts, shifting capital abroad to finance housing bubbles in Spain and Greece. Investment in domestic industry was weak until the advent of the sovereign debt crisis prompted a much more conservative approach to lending.

"It is a myth that the German economy has gained from euro membership," said Charles Dumas, of Lombard Street Research. "Its growth has decelerated. Its growth of productivity has halved. Its citizens have accepted severe wage restraint without the former benefit of a rising currency, leading to negligible gains in consumer welfare. The undervaluation granted by their wage restraint has benefited producers artificially, and weakened the incentive to cut out waste – hence lower productivity growth."...

/... http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/sep/17/angela-merkel-shape-europe-german-image

tama

(9,137 posts)

11. "Greek taxpayers spent more than 2.5 million euro in order to secure her a safe stay in Athens."

Reply to Bosonic (Original post)

Tue Oct 9, 2012, 03:07 PM

Oct 2012

"And what did we hear from her? “I wish and hope you stay in the euro“. That’s the most expensive empty phrase I ever heard in my whole life."

Pic of a naked guy:
http://www.keeptalkinggreece.com/2012/10/09/merkel-in-athens-protesters-set-nazi-flags-on-fire-video-live-blogging/

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