They are very often shams. Once I was with a company who had someone they wanted to keep, but who happened to be Canadian. So they advertised the position, putting people through sham interviews, and in the end kept on the person they intended to keep all along.

It leaves the door open for one who was put through the sham interview to file a complaint.

The H-1B visa does not require any recruitment efforts whatsoever, unless the employer is considered to be a willful violator by USCIS. The article does mention that this idea was proposed as part of the immigration reforms being considered by Congress, but didn't make it.

PERM is the first stage towards employment-based U.S. lawful permanent residence (a/k/a green card) for professionals. It does not involve USCIS. Rather, it involves the Dept. of Labor. There are certain requirements as to the kind of recruitment to be conducted. Generally, the minimum requirement is to run ads in the largest circulation paper on two consecutive Sundays. For most professions, the requirements also include external and internal posting of the position, and more recruitment activities (such as posting the position on the company's website, career fairs, professional journals, etc.).

If the PERM is certified (approved), then the second step is the I-140 alien worker petition filed by the employer on behalf of the foreign national employee. Then, if it is approved, the employee must wait for his/her priority date to become current before s/he can apply for the 3rd and final step: the I-485 application to adjust status to permanent resident.

Currently, an average professional in the most common employment-based category (EB-3) has a 5-6 year wait. If the country of origin is India or China or the Philippines or Mexico, it is nearly 8-9 years. In the meantime, the foreign national must maintain valid non-immigrant status (such as an H-1B, L, etc.).

In other words, the PERM stage is for those who are already working in the U.S. in a non-immigrant visa classification and who are seeking to become permanent residents of the U.S.

At a previous employer I had to write extremely specific Job postings that only the current H-1b employee could fit. Including technical and language skills that were not even part of the job requirements. This was to "prove" to the DOL that my company, at the time, was willfully making every attempt to hire a US applicant as the H-1b employee was filing for an extension on his H-1b application. I had to conduct interviews on applicants which applied, and even when I stated that the interviewee that was turned away was better suited for the job. My director flat out stated that we would have to pay a higher salary to these candidates, and to find a reason to not hire them.

I have worked at and contracted for several companies, and have witnessed and asked to partake in some very unethical business practices... all in the name of short-term profits. I could go on all day about these unneeded programs that you are promoting.

In my eyes, you are no better than the shady companies, which I gave my resignations to shortly after.. you defend this mentality. I hope that some day you take off your blinders and open your eyes to this bullshit before the day comes that you are forced to train your H-1b replacement. But, I guess you are earning a living off of this
avocation, and sleep at night only by turning a blind eye.

an h-1b co-worker applying for green card had sham recruitment, totally tailored to his work in india, and totally irrelevant to our job site

i also saw, in the middle of the late 1990s tech bubble, a candidate who had the most flawless, up to date marketable skill set possible at the time, but was a little over 50. i advanced him, but knew he had no chance of being hired - 'Team Fit' was the reason, the code word for 'too old'

made me want to throw up, i knew i was looking at my future right there. Then, a year later in 1998, the first big h-1b expansion.

they had these wastefull super discriminatory hiring practices before they even went with h-1b/L1 big time

foreign workers are merely the vehicle to enable the use 'em up an spit 'em out sweatshop labor practices

the tech field is viewed as 'taking us into the future at light speed', but in reality they are time traveling labor practices back to the 18th century

that really outlines the worst of tech culture, in a 'how to do it' tone 19 years ago

i really couldnt believe they were putting in print as advice, what most IT workers already suspected, a case study using skill set obsolecence as a tire iron on tech workers, firing half of them while increasing the workload, keeping people not for specific skills or knowledge, but by their percieved subservience to the brutal labor practices, while throwing the rest on the street with obsolete skill sets (1993 was still a recession)

and datamation was cheerleading it as the ideal

i cant find it on the internet, but i have a pdf copy (I photocopied it as soon as I read it), if you'd like me to send it to you, if you want to create a temp email for your privacy, that's fine

it really put h-1b in context - anyone who knows history knows that the 'labor ideal' in that article was unsustainable without endless disposable labor.....and that's where h-1b comes in

i really think it is a 'smoking gun' of what this is all about, the fact that a 'respected' industry magazine would print something like that so long ago, really tells of the brutal greed of the culture, the absolute desire to hold extortion over the heads of anyone they have to deal with

no other industry's magazine would ever print something so unethical, even if they condoned in behind closed doors

that says 'OPEN SEASON ON AMERICAN WORKERS'

hell, why not give a tax break for outsourcing jobs (oops, we already do that)

we talk talk talk about jobs jobs jobs

yet at every turn, we give even more away

and then we wonder why the recession is so stubborn

it's not a 'recession' it's a continued dismanteling of the middle and working classes

Currently the cap for H-1B visa is around 85,500, and the bill wants to raise it as high as 180,000!
This is crazy.
I keep advocating that the H-1B cap should be tied to the unemployment rate especially for the high-tech position.
If the unemployment rate goes up, the H-1B cap should be lowered.
If the unemployment rate goes down, then the H-1B cap could be raised.

Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX) wants to raise the cap to 325,000 because he says that
[font color=Red]"I think high-tech immigrants are an unambiguous good for our economy and our country,"[/font]
Nothing like really lowering the pay of high-tech citizens.

Currently companies are getting rid of high-tech engineers over the age of 50, and replacing them with an H-1B.
If they raise the H-1B cap to 180,000, you'll start to definitely see engineers over 50 replaced, but I believe that you'll
start seeing engineers over 45 start to disappear, maybe even as low as 40 years old.

THIS IS NOT A GOOD THING!!!

Your assessment is 100% correct. The increase on H1-B will further hurt the middle class and depress wages.

I grew up in Hammond.

I know a manager at Qualcomm in San Diego who told me that they would prefer H-1B
and they advertise the position in newspapers where they know that engineers don't use
to find a high tech position. Then when they hire and H-1B, they can claim that they had
advertised in the US looking for a US citizen.

He justified this because all companies are doing this, and they can't compete
if they didn't do it as well.

I'm sorry, but advertising in Podunc, Kansas for a high tech position is not looking for
a US citizen.

And no, you can't convince me that H-1B's in the high tech industry are getting paid
the "Prevailing Wage". 40% tops.

However, I'd like to know why this manager is advertising for H-1Bs anyway, since there is no advertisement required for H-1Bs and you cannot legally state that you are seeking an H-1B or a U.S. citizen (except for jobs that require U.S. citizenship) or a green card holder or etc.

Either way, this manager should be reported to USCIS or ICE. They have anonymous tip lines and they take fraud seriously.

You can't get an H-1B without having a job offer with employment letter or contract beforehand. You can't come to the U.S. in H-1B status without having a job. That's because the H-1B visa - like other visas - requires that the employer submit a bunch of forms and attestations prior to the visa being approved. Moreover, the employer must submit proof of the foreign national's education, credentials evaluation, passport photo, etc.

Then, if USCIS approves the visa, the foreign national must apply for the visa itself at a U.S. consular section abroad before being admitted to the U.S.

H-1B workers who are already in the U.S. can change employers fairly easily, as long as the new employer files the required set of forms, attestations and documentation. But the worker must demonstrate that s/he is in valid H-1B status at the time the new petition is filed (usually by submitting the most recent paystub from the current employer).

There's no need to justify the hiring of an H-1B visa holder, so again why would this friend of yours claim that they advertise looking for U.S. citizens (again, you can't discriminate against green card holders and others who are legally authorized to work in the U.S., as well as U.S. citizens)?

As for the wage issue, here's a report from the GAO with data from 2008 (the last time we had a huge wave of H-1B petitions prior to FY2014) - you can find the report at http://www.gao.gov/assets/320/314508.html. From this report, the only disparity that stands out is for H-1B workers in the 40-50 age group and their earnings considerably lower than those of U.S./LPR counterparts. However, there are no wage disparities, except that in one age category the H-1B workers are paid a little more than others:

The manager I mentioned never said that they were advertising for H-1B's, and
I never said this in my post.

One of the requirements before you can get an H-1B engineer is to advertise and
look for a US engineer. If you can't find someone to fill the position, then you can
look at H-1B engineers.

What he said was that they would advertise the position in periodicals that are
not frequented by engineers.

That way when they hire an H-1B, they can claim that they had advertised in
the US looking for a US citizen.

violators by DOL or USCIS. Therefore, the company where your friend works must have been deemed a willful violator.

Here is a list of H-1B willful violators: http://www.dol.gov/whd/immigration/H1BWillfulViolator.htm

And, from DOL:

In 2012 there are 85,000 cap subject H1B visas available to be issued
- 65,000 cap subject visas are available for the Regular Cap
- 20,000 cap subject visas are available for the ADE Cap

I usually believe data supplied by the GAO.

But the last statement says the data you're displaying is based on
Self-Reported earnings.

Are companies paying a placement agency and then the placement
agency paying the wages? (Acting like a contract house?)
If so, are companies reporting what they are paying the contract house.
and not was is really paid to the engineer?

Also, it will be very hard to convince me that H-1B are being paid
the prevailing wage. As a contractor, I was getting paid contracts
anywhere between $60 - $85 per hour, and since about 2007,
I've seen contracts continue to decrease in pay. I was offered a
contract as low as $30/Hr. for a position that paid me $65/Hr. in
2004-2006.
I literally just received a notice for a contract position not more than
2 hours ago for $37.50/Hr.
If H-1B's are being paid the prevailing wage, why are salaries across
the High Tech board decreasing?
Why are there so many High Tech engineers unemployed?

These companies list positions that have 10 job requirements, and
then won't accept a local US citizen who has capabilities in 9 of 10.
But, no doubt would hire a H-1B with capabilities in 5 of 10, because
they would be cheaper.

at a regular company are $2,325 owed to USDHS. On top of that, there are legal fees. How is this cheaper?

If you know and have proof that employers are unlawfully excluding qualified U.S. citizens, LPRs or others legally authorized to work in the U.S. without restriction (such as refugees, asylees, etc.), then you should definitely report it.

Note, however, that you cannot legally restrict a position to U.S. citizens only - unless there are government clearances involved or for certain government jobs.

Qualified workers can include U.S. citizens, U.S. nationals, lawful permanent residents (green card holders), and those who have unrestricted employment authorization (refugees, asylees, DACA, etc.).

compared to the $$$$'s they'll be saving.

This is in the noise level.

Why you continue to push the H-1B is beyond me.
This will affect you as well.
Wait and see.

of which 20,000 were reserved for graduates of U.S. universities with master's or above degrees.

FWIW, my dad -a mechanical engineer- is 65 years old and still has a job. In fact, his company is having a very difficult time finding qualified engineers and they cannot even hire non-US citizens due to the secret clearances that its employees must have.

Last edited Wed May 15, 2013, 11:55 PM - Edit history (1)

in the past: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=1101569

I have worked in immigration law since 1999. I am very particular about following the law and the regulations. Most legal immigrants are also keen on following the law and regulations.

Most employers do the same. Does this mean there is no fraud? No, of course. That's why any such rumor of fraudulent visa activity should be reported to USCIS, ICE or DOL.

I take the time to correct misinformation about visas with the actual regulations on the books and my professional experience in the field on DU. How is that equivalent to propaganda? I do not like it one bit when people spread wrong information about a topic I know extremely in detail - whether they are on DU or any other website.

If you were an ob/gyn and people posted on DU that the uterus is made of cheese, would you not try to provide the correct information? Would that be propaganda?

The posts above and below contain misinformation and selectively sourced data. Since I work with legal immigrants and professionals on a daily basis and since I actually do this job for a living, I want to ensure the information is accurate.

The H-1B visa is not perfect, but it's not the worst visa out there. The L-1B is much more rife with abuses.

An honest answer would be obvious.

replaced by a lower paid H1B1 employee. I have talked to college age folks who say they WON'T go into high tech because of this and all the outsourcing.

These programs are counter productive and are not about enough workers. They are about lowering wages.

I say every single H1B1 vias ought to
* Pay at the high end of going rate
* all taxes and benefits paid
* be taxed at least 25% on top of that, money to go to college scholarships.

H-1B workers are subject to the same withholdings as any other worker. They have to receive the same employer-provided benefits that all other workers receive (vacation, health, 401(K), etc.).

The only two classifications that are exempted from certain withholdings are the F/M and J visa holders. Some countries have treaties with the U.S. where social security credits earned while working in the U.S. can be credited. Most do not. This means that a lot of people who end up returning to their countries of origin will not see their withholdings for social security or Medicare back.

can I get an H1B visa to work IT in India or China, I have 20 years experience, two degrees, and am not retired or bound by a rich family to keep me?

nor ship that much TP overseas.

But seriously, you could get a 1-year visa to train a native to replace your function, assuming your field was very specialized. Hell, here in the US, we give them out to junior level programmers! Unreal.

fuck these job pimping bastards