That caused me to leave holes in my brain 20 years ago!

The Movie "Go" is one of my favorites for a reason!

(Probably not his intent of his work)

"He earned the title, the “Godfather of ecstasy”, after developing a new synthesis method for MDMA – the purest available form of ecstasy – in 1976"

GHB and royphinol (sp?) are known and used as date rape drugs, not MDMA.

I've seen first-hand the damage that ecstasy can do, but date rape isn't part of that damage.

of course)

http://brown.edu/Student_Services/Health_Services/Health_Education/alcohol,_tobacco,_&_other_drugs/ecstasy.php

A rape drug typically involves either knocks you out or affects your memory (amnesiac characteristics), MDMA does neither.

http://www.uic.edu/depts/owa/sa_drugs.html

The article mentions Ketamine, Rohypnol, GHB, alcohol.

especially if you have kids to worry about...

http://brown.edu/Student_Services/Health_Services/Health_Education/alcohol,_tobacco,_&_other_drugs/ecstasy.php


I appologize for unintentionally sidetracking your OP on the news of the passing of a very interesting chemical pioneer. I didn't know of him before, and I certainly didn't mean to stir up a hornets nest of reactions.

Sometimes I wish people would just own that they are wrong.

It's not the end of the world to be wrong.

But that doesn't mean that they are all "date rape drugs"

Most of the "MDMA == Date Rape" fearmongering came out of the anti-rave news coverage of the 1990's. Raves were still seen as a threat to public order and were regularly shut down by the police. Because Ecstasy was ubiquitous at raves, CNN and other major media organizations latched onto X as a "danger to our children" and ran with the date rape stories, even though it was later shown that rapes in which X was used to deliberately intoxicate a victim were actually fairly rare. In most cases where X was involved in a rape, it was merely an intoxicant that clouded judgement, and could have been replaced with any other drug or drink. There was nothing about it that made it particularly suited to rape. Unfortunately, some people still hold on to the whole "all drugs are bad" mindset and continue to propagate that idea.

In truth, MDMA simply puts you in a good mood and makes you groovy with the world. It's true that some people can take advantage of that, but it's generally no different than alcohol, marijuana, or any other drug capable of inducing euphoria and happiness. The world has always been full of assholes who want to take advantage of someone's buzz, but the "date rape drug" label that was slapped on X during the rave era was largely unjustified.

Any substance that clouds your judgement can be used to facilitate a rape. That doesn't mean all judgement clouding drugs should be vilified as rape tools.

I am not willing, however to accept your implication that I have been duped by CNN coverage or other fear-mongering, or I might mistakenly think 'all drugs are bad' Substances that cloud judgement can all implicated as accomplices to sexual assault. Alcohol chief among them. ("No mean no" and "Drunk, or drugged means No also&quot But unlike alcohol, that you tend to all consume knowingly together, Mollys or XTC can be slipped into someone's drink...

You said it yourself: "In most cases where X was involved in a rape, it was merely an intoxicant that clouded judgement, and could have been replaced with any other drug or drink" If it's used to unknowingly cloud judgement and someone gets assaulted, even if not as often as some other more popular rape drugs, it could still be considered one, no?

...but the meme that has persisted among many drug warriors that MDMA needs to be attacked as a "date rape drug". It's a holdover mindset from the 90's that's largely unjustified.

It's a drug that inspires euphoria and happiness by releasing serotonin in the brain. It used to have the nickname "the love drug" because it made you think that everyone you met was your best friend. As I said, anything that clouds judgement can be used to facilitate a rape.

In truth though, MDMA isn't a "good" rape drug. It has a very strong and bitter taste that is very hard to mask. I used to take it with grapefruit juice because you really needed something that strong to cover the overpowering bitter and salty taste that it left behind. MDMA will ruin most drinks, and most people with a spiked drink would immediately recognize that something is wrong with it. MDMA also doesn't inhibit memory, cognition, or motor skills at all. Hell, I'm a software developer and I used to write incredible C while rolling on X. The code I was writing seemed like the coolest thing in the world at the time, and the drug not only gave me a lift, but would inspire incredible creativity. More than once I'd go back and look at my code after an X fueled coding session and spend hours trying to figure out how I'd pulled off some cool coding feat.

Ecstasy-related rapes do occur, but nearly all happen after the victim has taken X willingly, and the rapist convinced the euphoric victim that they were really "in love" with them. Because the serotonin increase bumps both your empathy and your emotional state, and that love and empathy can cause the victim to trust the rapist, the victim may "consent" to sex that they never would have consented to when sober. From the perspective of the victim and any outsiders, the victim will be a participating, consenting, and willing partner in the sex. When the X wears off a while later, the victim realizes that the love and trust were a side effect of the drug, and that they were taken advantage of. There are always people who will take advantage of another persons clouded perceptions, and people used these an an example of MDMA's dangers. They're real, but they are no more or less valid than the dangers that come along with any mind-altering drug.

Of course, there did used to be a question that occasionally got asked and I never got an answer to. If two people willingly get high on X, fall in love, have sex with each other, and are both horrified by it the next morning...which one is the rapist?

MDMA does not put people to sleep or make them passive or vulnerable. Quite the opposite. You should be ashamed for pimping out low-grade drug war propaganda.

Ecstasy is a date rape drug?
What am I - and Google - missing?

Ecstasy is not a "date rape drug," it is pretty much opposite in function, and to say so is incredibly ignorant, wrong, and shameful.

"Rohypnol, Like alcohol, the drug is considered a date rape drug of choice; attackers slip the drug into victims’ drinks to promote disinhibition."

Try to stay on topic here; the OP addresses the pharmacologist who synthesized mdma.

Your link provides no allusion to mdma being utilized as a 'date rape' delivery method, in fact promoting just the opposite effect of Rohyphnol.

There are clinical trials utilizing the effects of mdma in order to combat post-traumatic stress syndrome with great success.

On the date rape page, ecstasy is not listed. I'm trying to figure out what your point is, or if you even have one.

sexual assault. Here's one: http://oade.nd.edu/educate-yourself-drugs/rohypnol-flunitrazepam/

The OP is about a very interesting experimental chemist, who just happened to also perfect a drug that has had a checkered life.

Clearly from the reaction here, many seem believe it is anything but an unsafe party drug, or that I am promoting some nefarious anti drug agenda...

The big three "date rape" drugs are Rohypnol, GHB and ketamine.

The most important date rape drug, in terms of the number of date rapes facilitated by it, is alcohol - but you can just imagine the screaming if people knew that.

but I won't ascribe any ulterior motives to you for asking that, because Ecstasy has a bad rap for a reason. And that reason is largely because when you buy X from some guy at a club or rave, the majority of the time what you're getting isn't going to be MDMA. A lot of the pills have no MDMA at all, and are often a combination of GHB, amphetamines, and caffeine.

MDMA doesn't put someone that takes it in a state that would facilitate a rape any more than methamphetamine does. It increases alertness, which is why when they try to fake it they tend to put speed of one kind or another in the pills. To be a "date rape drug" something pretty much has to either knock people out, or knock them into a stupor that will decrease/eliminate resistance. That's why the big date rape drugs are benzos (like rufilin) or anesthetics (like ketamine) or CNS depressants (like alcohol).

Such as TFPP and BZP. Cheaper pills, weaker highs, harsher come downs, and higher risk of overdose and negative side effects.

in all the headshops that everyone that was into drugs bought and took one time and spent a half a day praying for death because they don't mimic the effects of X at all?

DIRTY PICTURES is a documentary about Dr. Alexander "Sasha" Shulgin, the rogue chemist who discovered the effects of MDMA (aka Ecstasy) and over 200 other mind-altering drugs. Shulgin's alchemy has earned him the title "The Godfather of Psychedelics," and a reputation as one of the great chemists of the 20th century.

Working from a lab in his home, and using himself and his wife Ann as test subjects, Shulgin's discoveries have brought him into conflict with the law but made him a worldwide underground hero. The two books they co-authored, "Pihkal" and "Tihkal", have built a foundation for cutting-edge neuroscience and medical research. DIRTY PICTURES examines the impact of Dr. Shulgin's lifelong quest to unlock the complexities of the human mind.

{Alexander "Sasha" Theodore Shulgin (June 17, 1925 -- June 2, 2014) was an American medicinal chemist, biochemist, pharmacologist, psychopharmacologist, and author. He was the scientist behind more than 200 psychedelic compounds including MDMA, more commonly known as Esctasy. Considered to be one of the the greatest chemists of the twentieth century, Sasha's vast array of discoveries have had a profound impact in the field of psychedelic research. By employing unorthodox methods; testing his creations on himself, working from a makeshift lab in his home, Shulgin has gained the reputation of a modern day alchemist within the scientific community}

My Organic Chem Prof. died from Cancer at 37. The doctors opened him up, took one look and sewed him back-up. He was dead in a Month.