The 13 people who made torture possible
http://www.salon.com/2009/05/18/torture_25/READ IT AND WEEP
Blue Owl
(50,489 posts)Downwinder
(12,869 posts)standard for the United States.
AndyA
(16,993 posts)Response to Demeter (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Iwillnevergiveup
(9,298 posts)Welcome to DU even though what you posted is a real stomach turner. Makes me wonder if news of the first deaths among the hunger strikers will be let out.
uppityperson
(115,678 posts)Last edited Wed May 29, 2013, 05:17 PM - Edit history (2)
ETA, since that poster has now been banned and their post deleted, I am editing mine out as it was only meant to address the wrong bits in his, not to say I agree with force feeding in Gitmo and people seem to be taking it that way.
I think it wrong and am not saying it should be done. To the contrary. And Gitmo should be closed now. I was ONLY addressing the fallacies in the now banned poster's now removed post.
To address the larger problem of Gitmo, it should be closed. Now.
Dragonfli
(10,622 posts)the ACLU hates us for our freedoms from humanity and the Geneva Conventions, did they not learn how to handle prisoners from the 13? They are walking free, they are the ones that were right all along, they need more, newer medals for their brave stance against quaint notions of weak ass humanity.
In a letter addressed to Hagel, the organizations describe the process being used to deliver nutrients to 29 of the 100 prisoners who are currently protesting by not eating:
The force-feeding process is inherently cruel, inhuman, and degrading. The prisoner is strapped into a chair with restraints on his legs, arms, body, and sometimes head, immobilizing him. A tube is inserted up his nostril, and snaked down his throat into his stomach. A liquid nutritional supplement is then forced down the tube. The prisoner is restrained in the chair for upwards of two hours to prevent him from vomiting. As Guantánamo hunger-striker Samir Naji al Hasan Moqbel explained recently: I cant describe how painful it is to be force-fed this way. As it was thrust in, it made me feel like throwing up. I wanted to vomit, but I couldnt. There was agony in my chest, throat and stomach. I had never experienced such pain before. 1 Debilitating risks of force-feeding include major infections, pneumonia, collapsed lungs, heart failure, post-traumatic stress disorder and other psychological trauma.
Military officials confirmed the controversial process on Monday, saying that they had been managing the hunger strikers in that manner since March.
The letter went on to claim that the military's handling of the hunger strike violates the Geneva Conventions and could be considered "torture" under some treaties. It also asked Hagel to investigate and to rectify any "abusive conditions and treatment" outside of the hunger strike.
uppityperson
(115,678 posts)extreme points in the now banned/deleted post. I think you missed that. And this: To address the larger problem of Gitmo, it should be closed. Now.
bvar22
(39,909 posts)...is TORTURE.
RobertEarl
(13,685 posts)Yep. Reading that post made me sick. Rationalizing torture always has made me sick. Hopefully they will delete it and repent? Maybe even beg for forgiveness?
Uppityperson should be ashamed.
uppityperson
(115,678 posts)To address the larger problem of Gitmo, it should be closed. Now.
RobertEarl
(13,685 posts)That the force feeding, even if it goes all just perfectly like you were selling, is torture? That we are torturing these men? Can you say that?
uppityperson
(115,678 posts)be ashamed?
My point was it is bad enough, what they are doing, without having to wildly exaggerate it.
RobertEarl
(13,685 posts)Had you actually stated in the first post that it is torture and had you stated in the most recent reply to me that it is torture, then yeah, I could say that.
But you haven't yet.
uppityperson
(115,678 posts)Yes, I agree with you. Yes, it is torture. Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yesYes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes.
OK, your turn. Again you misunderstand and again you blame it on me rather than saying YOU misunderstood. Is it clear now? Or do you want to continue to just attack?
RobertEarl
(13,685 posts)It took awhile, but you finally wrote it out.
uppityperson
(115,678 posts)uppityperson
(115,678 posts)uppityperson
(115,678 posts)ashamed? Waiting still.
Or are you one who will never ask for clarification but instead like to attack and then claim "if only you'd been clearer" rather than saying you misunderstood. Hmmm. Let's see.
uppityperson
(115,678 posts)uppityperson
(115,678 posts)poster was banned and the post deleted. I agree, it is wrong. To address the larger problem of Gitmo, it should be closed. Now.
Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)Dragonfli
(10,622 posts)none may speak of forced feeding or any other current mistreatment. 13 are above the law, and we shall never speak of mistreatment again.
Excellent!
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)Dragonfli
(10,622 posts)because the new batch in the same positions would also be above the law.
I just don't remember the civics class that detailed exactly who is above the law. I know Presidents and Vice Presidents are, the entire CIA, anyone from the DOJs Office of Legal Counsel and I believe investment bankers.
I wish I still had those books so I could look up the complete list.
grahamhgreen
(15,741 posts)polynomial
(750 posts)The answer is an unequivocal no.
Ladies and Gentleman of America this torture crime always generates a fury of anger that flows throughout America. Especially for those who got tortured, however the reasons have not been fully explained. With that said good reason McCain went on a secret trip to Syria. Keep the Bush/Cheney war profiteering/ torture Gitmo plan going.
Think about it, the torture strategy the Bush administration made for war must continue. Use torture to get information to end war or protect the troops and save lives. Says Bush.
Torture used to get information to win wars, besides getting confessions or especially intimidating any other people for personal pleasures. America finds out Bush and Cheney enjoy torturing. Enjoy hurting harmless helpless human beings or as satisfaction from revenge. Or a very cruel way of profiteering...
The word torture seems to be saying you must suffer because America says so that is what will prevent America from its basic dream. Or, If the stakes are high enough, torture is permissible. No one who doubts that this is the case should be in a position of responsibility. Here then is the prime directive from the constitution Torture Is Always Immoral.
True, said in a different way as cruel and unusual punishment. But wrong.
Yes, President Obama will burn in hell with Bush and Cheney if America finds out Obama is stalling or covering up the Crimes of torture the whole administration needs to accountable for.
Ladies and gentleman of America our country will always fester in a deep seated controversial mess till indictments and convictions are made America will never have a Golden Age.
The Stranger
(11,297 posts)they should be arrested, arraigned and tried.
Every last one of them.