Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

OnDoutside

(19,969 posts)
Thu Aug 2, 2018, 05:54 AM Aug 2018

Brexit : John Major: 'Undoubtedly a case for second EU referendum"

Very good interview with John Major by Robert Peston. He makes the obvious but rarely heard point that making trade deals as part of a 500m person block gives you way more strength that a 65m block.

19 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Brexit : John Major: 'Undoubtedly a case for second EU referendum" (Original Post) OnDoutside Aug 2018 OP
A second referendum is the only honorable way out of the mess. First is not valid. Bernardo de La Paz Aug 2018 #1
While you're right, it needs to be step by step because the British people have to feel it is the OnDoutside Aug 2018 #3
A Do-Over bucolic_frolic Aug 2018 #2
Can we have one too? tavernier Aug 2018 #7
What I can't understand The King of Prussia Aug 2018 #4
In what way airbrushed ? I keep hearing Brexiteers referring to it. OnDoutside Aug 2018 #5
Really? The King of Prussia Aug 2018 #8
For example OnDoutside Aug 2018 #10
Well... The King of Prussia Aug 2018 #12
Ah, pedantry R Us ! If I have a beer and then I ask the barman for a second, I will wait in OnDoutside Aug 2018 #14
It isn't pedantry The King of Prussia Aug 2018 #16
Because it was heavily influenced paleotn Aug 2018 #6
No it wasn't The King of Prussia Aug 2018 #9
There is the tangential implication of the Robert Mercer backed Cambridge Analytica though. OnDoutside Aug 2018 #11
But that has nothing to do with the first referendum The King of Prussia Aug 2018 #13
Well it is the first of this (hopefully) brace of referendums. OnDoutside Aug 2018 #15
You keep believing that. paleotn Aug 2018 #17
You keep saying that then. The King of Prussia Aug 2018 #18
My misunderstanding... paleotn Aug 2018 #19

Bernardo de La Paz

(49,032 posts)
1. A second referendum is the only honorable way out of the mess. First is not valid.
Thu Aug 2, 2018, 06:49 AM
Aug 2018

It is clear that a second one would vote "stay", which is the true sentiment, especially now.

OnDoutside

(19,969 posts)
3. While you're right, it needs to be step by step because the British people have to feel it is the
Thu Aug 2, 2018, 06:57 AM
Aug 2018

right thing to do. If they feel railroaded, I think they'd vote no again through sheer bloody mindedness. I said on the morning after the No vote that I didn't know how they were going to do it, but they will have another vote on this. It's been a tortuous process, and will result in massive humiliation for the British people, but some good might come out of this, in that they'll be an awful lot wiser about the benefits of EU membership, and more importantly for all of us, it will be the start of the fightback against Russian cyber aggression.

8. Really?
Thu Aug 2, 2018, 08:03 AM
Aug 2018

Not being funny but I can't remember the last time I heard it mentioned, by either side - so link me up please if you have a recent reference. Even the phrase "we need a second referendum" denies the existence of the first.

OnDoutside

(19,969 posts)
10. For example
Thu Aug 2, 2018, 08:15 AM
Aug 2018

Ree-Mogg

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/987626/brexit-news-jacob-rees-mogg-britain-voted-brexit-three-times-theresa-may

The MP for North East Somerset said Britain voted three times to sever its ties with the European Union.

Two of the most recent vote were the General Election and the 2016 referendum.

Mr Rees-Mogg said: “There were actually three votes around the referendum.

“There was the General Election David Cameron won promising a referendum, there was the referendum itself and then there was last year’s General Election when the two major parties both said they would accept the result.”


Farage

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/977263/Brexit-news-Nigel-Farage-Brexit-vote-John-Bercow-meaningful-vote

Mr Farage argued that regardless of how people voted in the EU referendum they now just want the Government to “get on with it”.

Before the key vote MPs were told that an official ministerial statement would be issued on Thursday making clear it is ultimately for Speaker John Bercow to decide whether they get a "meaningful vote" on a no-deal withdrawal from the EU.


As regards "Even the phrase "we need a second referendum" denies the existence of the first."

Surely "Even the phrase "we need a referendum"" wouldn't deny the existence of the first ? Second implies there was a first, no ?
12. Well...
Thu Aug 2, 2018, 08:20 AM
Aug 2018

Neither of the examples you quote refers to the first referendum.
For your information, the first referendum was in 1975, the second was in 2016. So saying that we need a "second" referendum now very clearly denies the existence of one of the others. As I said - airbrushed from history.

OnDoutside

(19,969 posts)
14. Ah, pedantry R Us ! If I have a beer and then I ask the barman for a second, I will wait in
Thu Aug 2, 2018, 08:58 AM
Aug 2018

anticipation for him to say, "have you airbrushed all the thousands of others you have had" ?

paleotn

(17,946 posts)
6. Because it was heavily influenced
Thu Aug 2, 2018, 07:36 AM
Aug 2018

by Russkie money and disinformation similar to the 2016 US elections. It's as tainted as the orange shitgibbon.

13. But that has nothing to do with the first referendum
Thu Aug 2, 2018, 08:22 AM
Aug 2018

Cambridge Analytica was founded in 2013. Or does Norman Voles work for them?

18. You keep saying that then.
Thu Aug 2, 2018, 12:06 PM
Aug 2018

Provide one example of anyone suggesting that the first referendum, which took place in 1975, was in any way influenced by "Russkie money and disinformation".

I'm confident that you can't.

I'm not sure what you mean by "wishes sometime come true".

Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»Video & Multimedia»Brexit : John Major: 'Und...