I always try to be polite - I flash my lights to let them know they can pull in front of me, etc. I usually get a nice brake-flash in return. The kids love to get them to toot their horns.

(but never from an angle where they can actually see me)

Speaking as one of the many DU Truckers, don't flash your brights at night.

Not saying you do (because you didn't!) but many people do that, INCLUDING other truckers.

Invariably, it is just when I am glancing at my right mirror that I get an eyeful of high beams.

During the day it isn't so critical, but the best signal is to turn them on and then off in the day and just off and back on at night.

I appreciate the courtesy, really.

I try to remember to dim rather than high-beam at night.

During the day I run w/ lights on and hit the high beam if a trucker signals a turn into my lane.

You guys are doing a job.

I used to take other drivers' actions personally, then I grew up. Now, I usually give way to anyone because I don't want to ding my pickup. That and getting there are my only concerns. I don't own the road, so no one can infringe on my territory.

I don't know how you truck drivers do it. I get really sleepy when I drive and can only do so for a few hours without a long break. I suppose one gets used to it?

I've recently started with a new firm - got out of Car Hauling - and now for the first time in years I am doing some team driving as well as working late and night trips. The worst part, no matter how well rested you are, is the 4:00 AM to 7:00 Am segment. No matter what, I want to nod out. 5:00 to 6:00 is the worst, it seems.

Of course one takes precautions to not do that - pull over and walk around the truck, get yet another coffee, etc.

Again, I and all the rest of us out there really do appreciate it when a "4-wheeler" shows us some courtesy, not to mention common sense!

I've said this in the past, but I'll say it again here;

We all wish our trucks could do zero to 60 in 5 seconds, but they can't and there isn't a damned thing we can do about it. Unless the trucker is a complete ass, and there are plenty out there, no doubt, none of us wants to hold you up. We want to get out of your way, honestly. So patience is of massive importance on the part of the passenger vehicle operator when around large trucks.

I'm sure I'm not saying anything you aren't aware of, just wanted to put it out there.

it's a "safety thing". Once you turn the lights on, they're on until you shut off the engine again. So high beams or turn signals are the only choices. I'll try to remember to use turn signals from now on.

The high beams on my Camry can be switched on for just a fraction of a second -- pull back on the lever and let go, the spring will return it to normal position. A quick flick is all it takes to signal.

Of course, with those annoying high-intensity headlamps (NOT on my car -- Escalade probably the worst on the road), the high beams are just blinding, as are badly misaligned low beams, which seem to be increasing in number as more and more cars (and trucks!) get the high-intensity headlights.

but you're right - not every car has the ability to turn off it's headlights while in motion.

I want to emphasize that even if you flash your high beams, it is appreciated, really. It does show you understand what's going on and are being courteous, so I don't want to downplay that in the least.

You are spot on re: the newer headlights though. If they aren't aimed properly they are just like high beams!

One pet peeve of mine is people driving on the interstate with their high beams on. Bugs the hell out of me! Sure, it's fine if there is no one around, but even if the median is 1/4 mile wide, high beams on an oncoming car are annoying as hell. I just study the white line on the right till they pass, but I wish people wouldn't do it. I know why they do - so they can see better, but it isn't as if the interstate is going to have a hard turn come up out of nowhere!

Bright lights decrease your night vision acuity, regardless of the source.

in some areas high beams help you see deer from farther away. I turn the beams down whenever I approach another car, going either direction. (I hate Escalade drivers who pull up to one car length behind me before passing! It's plain dangerous!)

But the last sentence of your reply is probably the most important one.

I realize the reason for wanting to run with high beams on, honestly! I've been doing a LOT of night driving recently (I'm on a 34 hour reset, so home today) and yes absolutely, seeing the deer is a plus! Here in Florida, well...like most places, I suppose, they like to stand right next to road in the early hours and munch away!

Dealing with bright headlights is one of those things that come with the territory, I suppose!

because they are the worst drivers I have ever encountered.

Why do you say that?

No...never mind. It doesn't matter.

I know truck drivers are working joes, and I support that 100%.

But after nearly getting run off the road by a drunken trucker (I saw him flip a booze bottle out his window just after the near-accident) years ago, I'm too frightened of large cargo trucks to want to go anywhere near them.

My truck is governed at 75mph, and still people get upset when I overtake another truck on I-80.

Often I will pull into the passing lane a little early to discourage drivers from accelerating to try to squeeze by as soon as I light my turn signals.

What kind of nut tries to squeeze between two trucks barely a car length apart at 70+ mph!?!

And I don't mean some momentary thing, either.

Both times it involved a semi pulling up within 10 or 15 feet of the car I was in on a 4-lane divided highway, me/us in the right lane doing at or slightly above the speed limit, while the truck flipped on its fucking high beams and tried to blind me/us. For fucking sport.

First time I was a young kid, driving somewhere with my mom. Probably New Jersey to West Virginia or back, after a visit with an aunt of mine. This shit went on for a good two to three minutes, there were no handy exits to turn off on, and no known police stations or other safe areas to stop at. I was crying, screaming in the passenger seat while my mother (who was more often than not a complete raging drunk) remarkably kept her cool. She admitted to me later that she was preparing for us to get run off the highway. I could not have been any older than 6 or 7 when this happened.

Second time was when I was in Minnesota, back in the early 90s. I was about 24, had just gotten my driver's license, and again was in the fucking right lane, doing about 45 in a 55 in a torrential rain storm in an old and decidedly unreliable Honda. Truck had no problem roaring up on me. Truck had no problem finding high beams when there was no opposing traffic. Truck had no problem choosing not to pass me on thar 4-lane divided highway. This went on for almost half the distance I needed to be on this highway, or about 3 miles. After I took my exit to finish the drive home from work, I had to stop the car on the side of the road until I stopped shaking and lost the nearly unstoppable urge to piss my own pants.

You're a truck driver who is responsible and not taking out your frustrations on young children with single parents, or people driving safely in horrible weather? I love you. You're some kind of demented asshole? Be glad I'm not really into firearms. You dig?

Even when I was younger.
Even when I was driving in winter.
Even when four of them boxed me in during a snow storm.
Driving a Dodge Minivan with my parents and siblings, at around 2 in the morning.

No, never flipped them off.

It did make me fearless towards trucks though.

If he fucks up, and I feel like it, I'm flipping him off.

Tough shit.

I have nothing but the utmost respect. I grew up with all the stories. Dad was a hell of a truck driver but had trouble transfering the skills to the family car. It was always hard to make a living as a truck driver but when he drove, it was a middle class salary for a family of 6.

I flash my lights too and let them get ahead of me to protect their passing. Remember-gravity trumps all.

Momentum on the other hand...

my bad. I was thinking Momentum. I was blinded and seduced by the Oscar halo effect.

Bulk cargo doesn't need to go by road.

And there are many other things that are on trucks but would do just as well in a freight train.

But we keep killing the railroads off.

Oh and I'd never flip off a trucker. If he was driving dangerously - weaving, tailgating, texting - I'd call that 800 number that many so prominently display.

Look...the railroads are never, and I mean NEVER going to be the complete answer. Not until there is a railroad siding at every mall, convenience store and every other business.

The fact is, the overwhelming majority of freight that is most economically moved by rail in this country already is.

And for every container or "Piggyback" trailer you see on a railcar, that is a trucker not getting that work. So sure, it's good for the environment. But it's not all rosey.

As far as the quality of the railroads in the US, May I suggest you look a little further into that? The amount of tonnage moved on the major corridors in this country is quite frankly mind-boggling. The BNSF line running from San Bernardino, CA, over to the AZ line, up to and through Flagstaff and East handles a long freight on average every 8 minutes. 24/7/365

One other thing - many people think the railroads are or can be faster than trucks. Not true by a long shot. You can get a truckload of fresh strawberries from Oxnard to New York in a little over 45 hours with 2 guys in the truck.

It takes the railroads about 5 days to do the same thing.

I don't eat strawberries out of season, or from California (live in Pennsylvania).

We live in a country that has forgotten the value of local goods.

I'm sorry if you think I'd want your job to go away, but if we did indeed have a bigger and better rail system - which the auto industry did its best to kill off - you might be driving a train instead of a truck. Or doing short haul from the railhead.

First of all, the auto industry primarily killed off the city trolly systems in this country. Passenger rail was killed off by the airlines, for the most part. Most rail operators did both - freight and passenger, but their passenger trains were loss leaders pretty much by the late 1950's. The idea that I might be employed by a railroad if only there were more of them is not supported by industry trends.


Do you know what industry employed the most Americans 100 years ago?

The Railroads. Why? Because they used Steam Locomotives in those days and they were incredibly labor intensive to keep up. They have gone from a minimum of ten men per train in the early days to 2 and even one and even, in cases such as some rail yards and switching duty, NONE! (remote and satellite controlled locomotives)

You know what industry employs the most people today?

Healthcare.

Fine. Strawberries was a bad example for you.

Like with anything, there are good sides and bad sides. You want to put in more rail right-of-way? What about the owners of the land that would now have a rail line running through it? You think they would be thrilled? Can we start with your property?

As I said, the overwhelming majority of freight that can be economically moved by rail, already is moved that way and it is increasing. You want to know what the railroads are best at carrying? Coal. Coal and similar bulk materials in open "Hopper" type cars. The reason is because an entire train of modern, open top hoppers can be loaded, moved and unloaded by 4 people. No other commodity the railroads handle comes even close. Containers take a lot more personnel, as do automobiles, any and all boxcar freight etc.

We may live in a country that has "forgotten the value of local goods" (though I don't buy that) we are also a nation that kind of likes being able to get strawberries in February, among other things, even though we may be hundreds or thousands of miles from where they are produced.

I have NEVER seen such a poorly run business in my life.

Waste of resources every time you turn around. Lost freight. Many many deadhead miles.

You cannot do with a train what you can with a truck, period.

Education is what is needed. The motoring public needs to know how to deal with trucks.

There is a new breed of trucker out there that really doesn't impress me much. It's sad to see the "road knights" turn into a thing of the past but it seems to be leaning in that direction.

There is a horrible shortage of good drivers out there. Men and women who take pride in what they do.

Many dispatchers would do well to really know the job that they are doing and not expect miracles from the drivers.

Trains will NEVER EVER replace trucks. Education will make the road sharing easier.

I firmly believe that part of the driver training for car drivers should include the view from a truck cab.

If you could see what I've seen ....

aA
kesha

Everyone should have to work as a waiter for six months or in retail.

And trains haven't always had the problems you detail.

They have had trouble for a LOT of years.

aA

Serious question: given where we are with gas/oil issues on the planet..
how do you see the trucking biz having to adust ?
Do you see a time when it all goes away?

Last edited Fri Mar 7, 2014, 12:53 PM - Edit history (1)

BUT....

I predict that in as few as 25 years, probably sooner, while the trucks may look somewhat similar, the powerplants will be almost unrecognizable.

There is nothing stopping the evolution of the diesel internal combustion engine being coupled with Hybrid technology. The solutions already exist to build a virtually electric heavy truck, it's just that the battery technology has to improve from a weight perspective.

But it's coming, I have no doubt whatsoever.

Actually, the improvements in emissions alone have made tremendous strides. You really don't see too many trucks belching out thick black smoke anymore and if you do, it is either a very old engine or a new one with something seriously wrong.

Fuel economy has come a long way as well. When I drove my first tractor trailer in 1978, getting 5 MPG in a highway truck was VERY good. Most got 4 or less.

2 weeks ago I drove a 3 year old truck out to LA and back and averaged over 9 MPG and that was moving around 70,000 pounds. Newer engines are doing even better. 25 years ago, 9 MPG was unheard of.

Electricity is the long term answer, and there are plenty of technologies available that just need the right improvements to become 'roadworthy' so to speak. Things like flywheel concepts, where a large, heavy, extremely efficient flywheel is used to store energy to start the truck moving and to capture energy when slowing down, things like that.

But no, I honestly don't ever see the need for heavy trucks going away. Not until we get to a "Star Trek" type of technological level where we have anti-gravity and/or the transporter!

Beam me 40,000 pounds of coffee beans!

I never flipped off a truck driver, but I do sometimes get irritated when I have to slow down while they pass another vehicle. In general I have a lot of respect for truck drivers, they're just trying to make a living. I also think they tend to be good drivers. It's the other folks on the road I worry about.

SIXTY TWO! On interstates where the prevalent speed limit is 70. Some will do 64 or 65. A few will do 68 or 69.

So....you're driving along with the cruise set at the max and you come up on a guy doing 61 1/2. You caught him. You want to pass him, but there is just no way to get that thing to go any faster.

Trust me when I say this...it is frustrating as hell!

in the C.B. shop while I was in electronics school.
Most truckers have the biggest hearts you will ever meet.
They stick together.
More working people should be like that.


Jim Croce tells us about cruise control in it's more primitive, "experimental" days...

plus the fucker has a Rand Paul bumper sticker in his window. A little birdie is the least this shit has coming to him.

never have, never will.
However, the dickless cowboy wannabe in the Ram pickup tailgaiting my little Subaru, you know who you are, just let me get to work at the hospital in this 8 inches new snow at 4 am, so I can piece your ass together after you roll that tank, asshole, ok?

thoroughly enjoyed this informative OP. I've always favored certain personality red flags to watch out for with new acquaintances, and how they behaved around 18-wheelers was a major tipoff. You can imagine how many doomed relationships that spared me.

Despite the technology advances, you guys have a tremendously exhausting and dangerous job.

Back when I drove my moving van from AZ to where I retired in the remote areas of flyover country, it was a terrible trip for me since the man who bought my little ranch turned out to be a drug dealer who tried to run me out early, etc. I was half dead from exhaustion and stress before I even started to drive here. Because I was also pulling a trailer with my van on it behind the biggest Penske available, I looked for truck stops along the way. People were friendly but not in a way to concern me at all. And every single time I went to pay my check, the lady at the register always said it had already been taken care of by 'someone'. There seemed to be a great concern that I was fleeing a bad situation - which was true, though not like they probably supposed.

The only personal trouble I encountered? Once in the ladies room, a couple of lot rats dissed me and I felt an extremely rare but genuine desire to thrash them within an inch of their lives. Always been proud of myself for holding back, because even though I've never been over 5' tall, those 2 b's were in stilettos and never would've stood a snowball's chance in hell. I was wearing boots, and my last nerve was about to snap.

I drive a lot of miles in a year almost all personal trips. When I am on a 4 lane highway, I either will accelerate to get past a truck so as to not cause him to break or slow down so he can get out there, depending on how close he is to passing or where I am.

I sometimes get aggravated by the shuffling trucks seem to do going down the highway, but I realize, this is the nature of the beast.

When I see a truck, I think of that is his job and he has a schedule to keep, I am on a personal trip and if it takes me a couple of minutes longer, oh well.

I've said this before, but people tend to notice the few trucks that get in your way.

Most people pay little to no attention to the vast majority that are in the right lane, staying out of your way!

I know I do.

Also, If I am along side you and see your turn signal come on, I step on it.

And over the years there have been many threads on DU about driving in the left lane. It always amazes me that there are those that think it is perfectly alright to just get out there and stay there!

Ahh well..

Good idea to step on it!

Another thing that not only annoys me but is dangerous (DAMMIT! WILL THIS NEVER END?!? LOL) is "sidegating" or pacing me or another truck.

If you have never been near a heavy truck when one of the tires has a catastrophic failure, it is something you won't forget!

If you are passing a big truck, just get on with it! The last thing you want is for one of his tires to let go right next to you. It will scare the hell out of you! They can be as loud as a cannon shot.

Now, having said that...and even though we have all seen tire husks on the road, compared to the number of miles driven, tire failures are relatively rare. But they can happen at any time, even to a properly maintained and inflated tire.

So don't dilly dally when passing a truck!

I have seen them come apart and seen the damage it does to the truck and any other vehicles in the vicinity.

I think I initiated one of those threads on left lane squatters after my last road trip. It is unbelievable the way people justify their actions.

Stay safe on the road and maybe our paths will cross on the road. Heading out in one week for two plus weeks from Ohio to Florida then to Northern Vermont.

Really early or very very late depending how you see it. Trying to make Clearwater by 7:00 am.

I will keep you in mind if that changes.

I'm not far from the I-295/I-10 interchange. If you're coming down I-95, taking 295 around to 10 and then over to 301 south, you'll be passing about 1 mile from my place.

I'm sure you have it all figured out, but 301 down to Ocala then jump on 75 is the quick way from here.

Just watch Lawty and the other towns on 301! They love to feed the town coffers with speeding tickets!

If you plan on being in the T- bay area by 7 AM, it probably won't work out, but that's OK.

I'd love to meet another DU'er so if on your return you want to grab a coffee and I'm not on the road, it's on me!

Drive it safe, and have a fun trip.

And it does avoid the Orlando mess. Many times we on down to I-4 to make a couple of stops in St. Augustine and even Disney Marketplace. Not this trip though.

I don't mind having to come off cruise control, at least not a whole lot. I can understand slowing down from 70-80 (depending on condition and traffic) down to 55-65. What really gets me is going uphill on multi-lane roads. You head for a incline with trucks in front of you. The first truck in the line starts dropping in speed so the second one in line, rather than slow down himself pulls into the next lane, KNOWING that he will be beside the first truck and running at the same speed before the top of the hill. Sure enough 30 percent of the way up the hill the nose of the second truck is just behind the cab of the first truck and they are both running 52. What happens next? The third truck in line, because he is in a special, magical truck, pulls into the third lane. Now we are half-way up the hill, all three trucks are running, at best, 40, side by side, and there is no way to get around them. I still wont flip them off, run up on them or anything like that. I will still be polite and most likely even slow down to let the next truck I see that's trying to pass out into the lane. Because it is hard to pass with that much trailer. But when they know what is going to happen they need to leave a lane open for the rest of us.

There is a couple reasons, but first I will say that in your scenario, truck number 3 is an asshole and likely breaking the law in most states these days. Left lane restrictions for trucks are almost universal now, so that kind of behavior is just dopey on his part.

The overwhelming majority of truckers are paid by the mile. So if you're making ...say....forty cents a mile, your hourly rate at 60 MPH is $24/hour. Keep in mind they don't make a penny waiting for a load or doing the many other things that are required that don't involve driving down the road. Now, the reason most drivers are reluctant to "slow down himself" as you mention in your scenario is that really, there is no way to know whether or not he will be able to pass that truck. If he can, he wants to because it means he can keep his speed up and therefore his rate of pay. The other thing is that, as I am sure you've noticed, we take a long time to get up to speed. Any time the driver has to lift off the gas, it adds to the time it will take to get back to the speed he was running at.

I know that might sound ridiculous, but compound that one single lift off the gas pedal thousands of times over the course of the year and it can add up to quite a lot of lost miles and money.

The reason I say he has no idea if he'll be able to pass that truck is for this reason;

Lets say both trucks have similar running gear, ie; same 450 HP engines, same transmissions and same rear end final drive ratios. BUT.....they are carrying different freight and one weighs 20,000 pounds less than the other. The lighter truck will climb the hill faster. The guy driving the lighter truck really has no idea how heavy the guy in front of him is unless he has been following him up hills for a while. We all (well most, anyway) have the incentive to keep as steady as speed as possible to get where we are going as quickly as legally possible and to maximize the income.

As I said in post #12 above, we all wish our trucks would do zero to 60 in 5 seconds. Also, we all wish we could do 60 MPH fully loaded up 5% grades, but the laws of physics just simply don't allow it.

It is just frustrating as hell to have to sit behind a heavier truck and climb a hill at half throttle because I can't get around him. But it happens. It also happens that there are idiot truckers out there who just simply don't give a damn if they are holding you up.

And on behalf of the rest of us who DO care, I offer my apologies. It sucks, I know. I drive a car too.

One small solution would be to pay drivers by the hour, something I am in complete favor of. For the first time in a long time, I am driving trucks and being paid by the hour and I love it. It doesn't matter to me anymore if I lose ten miles a day because I have to lift off the throttle. I think every driver should be paid by the hour but that probably won't ever happen.

Again, I know my explanation might sound silly or absurd, but trust me, that's what is going through their minds. "I don't want to lift because it will cost me money"

Hubby drives Gravel Trains. This truck has 42 wheels. People under-estimate big vehicles. They need more room for stopping distance and need more time to get to road speed. This time also varies if loaded or unloaded. Which can also impact the stopping distance. I travel south quite frequently. I don't know if you know the spot but in Kentucky on I-71 is a downgrade fog adventure. I give big trucks their room. Not too far from there is the sign where there was a bus crash. which in my opinion means be very careful while driving these mountains.

These guys are earning their livings.
I'm just on a road trip.

If I see a trucker gaining on traffic in the right lane, I'll put the hammer down to get by him and give him room to pass the slower traffic.
Sometimes I get a short 'honk' in thanks.

Thanks, man!

.... but the truck drivers of today seem to operate way more professionally than they did say 20 years ago. I don't know if it is regulation, or weeding out the pricks or what, but I rarely see a truck driving stupid these days and back then they were all over the place.

"And he can't fudge his federally mandated driver log, because he no longer does it on paper"

That sounds like a complaint. I'm supposed to feel pity for truckers because they can't fudge their log (i.e. cheat) anymore?

Loves it!

I'm working with.

Oh, and the ones who try to run me off the road while I'm doing my job.

The rest of the time I give the big rigs all the room they need.