So it won't be discussed in any meaningful way. I made this point in a thread on debate topics a few days ago.

I'm afraid it's all over. I just watched the first stage of the Tour of Beijing bike race, and out of disgust for what I saw in the surrounding city, I simply turned it off. Massive new architectural wonders.

And while looking for a new place to call home, in the surrounding Portland area, brand new mansions that are monuments to materialism make me feel ill and full of disgust.

In only a few years we went from fields to concrete. Forests to tree farms. And it's not going to stop. It's increasing with every new baby born.

edit- Shit, I wasn't going to post my environmental thoughts on DU any more. Oops, I blew it.

if the summer sea ice melt made no impression ...
if the drought in the US and consequent crop failures made no impression, ...
if the drought then soggy cloud cover over England and northern Europe ...
if none of this deserves even a whimper from the supposed environmental party during an election year, well it is obvious maintaining human consumption is a more politically expedient perception than maintaining a habitable environment for future generations.

At this point I no longer mourn the human plight on this planet, I rather, laugh at the perception that humans are thought to be the highest form of intelligence.

But that gets harder to do as the shape of the future emerges.

but humans perception of humans as an elevated specie by means of intelligence, is black humor that can't be denied. The tragedy is so many people see what is happening today in human terms with human blinders. Like this life and planet is all about them. Being a small part of a whole, is an alien concept, right up until their human ingenuity and intelligence snuffs their own candle.

But I agree, watching it all happen on a daily basis is a head shaking affair. The only thing that makes it easier for me is realizing, that for the planet it is only cause and effect relationships, changing to a different state. The earth will survive just fine, it just won't be a pleasant playground for many of the species that exist today. Any emotions that evolves from this evolution, well, they are simply human.

I've been working with a brilliant man on what may very well be the next generation of energy conversion devices. This is a fuel cell technology. He and I have been getting patents ready as we build up a group of scientists and engineers to get this thing going. Our conversations are wild in that we discuss everything from whether there's a god, to whether reversing global warming is going to even make a difference. We have heated arguments.

At this point in time I feel that the rate of change in a big variety of things combined with the severity of the problems indicates that we're too late. And then we argue very heatedly regarding trying versus just rolling over. And we also argue about whether changing technologies will result in a more biological form of human technology that will reverse and even allow us to survive.

And then there's the notion of people jettisoning off to other planets, which I think is absurd considering how bleak these other planets are. No birds, fish, wind, trees, butterflies.

I think earth is it, and we're very close to changing it to a point where the quality of life is poor. That's about all. It is maddening that so many people are seemingly blind to this quality idea. I like peace and beauty. It's as if most people don't even know what that is.

Believe it or not, it may sound odd, but I'm beginning to think that mistreatment of young children is the biggest problem we face. There would be no Mitt Romneys and George Bush's and Hitlers if we changed the way we raise children.

good luck with your cutting edge fuel cell technology, and always make the time for the diversity of thought, through discussions in you two person chowder society. Pure brain food.