Environment & Energy
Related: About this forumHow low can oil go? I'm betting $36 per barrel.
In fact, prices are being forced down not by any action (or inaction) of the Saudis but by the American shale producers, who are simply producing all the oil they can to maximize their profits. Collectively, theyre not the most sophisticated folks, especially when it comes to world markets, says Charles Ebinger, a senior fellow in the Energy Security Initiative at the Brookings Institution.
With apologies to Ebinger, the shale producers dont need to be sophisticates. Each operator is so small, it can increase production without pushing down the market price. That makes them price takers, not price setters. And because shale wells are short-lived, producers dont have to plan far ahead, says Karr Ingham, a petroleum economist in Amarillo, Texas. Singly the shale busters are nothing. Collectively, their breakneck production is breaking OPECs neck. This is the remorseless, leaderless free market at work.
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For a shale well the costs are mostly upfront. Drilling and fracking the well itself, of course. Once that has been done theres minimal cost in collecting the resultant production. This means that pretty much whatever the oil price youre going to keep in production a well that youve already drilled. Say, just to invent a number, it costs $5 million to get a well going. Once youve done that whether the well is going to be profitable overall is entirely irrelevant. Youve got large sunk costs there, sure, but the relevant number for whether to keep collecting the oil is whether the price you get for it is higher than the costs of collecting it, not higher than the costs of drilling in the first place. Further, you dont produce enough to change the price you receive (well, not quite, each barrel of production does change the global price infinitessimaly, weve a Sorites Paradox here, but no individual producer is going to notice by how much they change that global price). Thus the sensible option is, once youve drilled the well, simply to keep pumping whatever the price.
According to Reuters, the OPEC chief said the groups decision to leave its output levels unchanged last month was not aimed at any other crude producer: Some people say this decision was directed at the United States and shale oil. All of this is incorrect. Some also say it was directed at Iran. And Russia. This also is incorrect.
At the same Dubai event, Suhail Al-Mazrouei, the energy minister of the United Arab Emirates, said OPEC will not immediately change its Nov. 27 decision to keep the groups collective output level at 30 million barrels per day, Bloomberg News reported. We are not going to change our minds because the prices went to $60 or to $40, he told the news agency. Before calling an emergency meeting, he said, We need to wait for at least a quarter.
Looks like the good old free market is poking at the cartel and there ain't nothing nobody can do about it.
belzabubba333
(1,237 posts)it has to be about something pointless like circumcision, something with the importance of that will have upto 300 responses. smart topics and facts are gonna get you nowhere.
According to Reuters, the OPEC chief said the groups decision to leave its output levels unchanged last month was not aimed at any other crude producer: Some people say this decision was directed at the United States and shale oil. All of this is incorrect. Some also say it was directed at Iran. And Russia. This also is incorrect.
do you know who says this is incorrect. because the us was on track to be one of the if not the largest supplier so opec dropping the price (or letting it drop_) seems to be reasonable ((from a business standpoint) to drive out competition
joshcryer
(62,276 posts)It's obvious that this is about oil sands and tar sands, that is plain as day, I was just quoting the article. OPEC has lost its mind.
louis-t
(23,295 posts)Plain and simple. There is no history of them doing anything else when the price falls. They have stated no legitimate reason to keep output the same.
joshcryer
(62,276 posts)Posted about this craziness in Nov: http://www.democraticunderground.com/112778360
louis-t
(23,295 posts)They can and will hold out long enough to sink the shale business in this country. It might only take them a couple of quarters.
Let me add, the shale companies are small enough that they may be able to weather a few months of low prices without producing anything. When oil starts going up again, they may be able to resume where they left off. It will be interesting to see what happens. Meanwhile, enjoy reasonable prices.
joshcryer
(62,276 posts)A lot of the shale companies are small time, they'd take their equipment, put it in storage, and sit on it. They can wait out the price war for a good decade.
louis-t
(23,295 posts)Great minds......
joshcryer
(62,276 posts)The main thing are the leases which they can sell at will, so sit on those leases as long as possible and sell them off as the market crunches. The bigger companies could probably buy leases in that intervening time, though, because the lease price is sure to drop.
FogerRox
(13,211 posts)These companies are heavily leveraged, some will fail. When the price is back up, banks may not make loans under the same conditions as before.
Alberta tar sands is likely different, larger players. Though some have been getting out over the last 2 years, we're seeing some consolidation in Alberta. Non in situ costs are $85-$100, theres some indication they've been shutting down recently. Bakken just closed its first operation.
Saudi crude production has been flat for 5 yrs, US crude production has increased over 60% in the same 5 yrs. I keep asking myself why has the KSA kept production at these levels, not even trying to modify the price decline. It may be they think the can sink the Bakken.
Bad news is the shortage of skilled labor in the Alberta tar sands has driven up wages, thats likely to be derailed quite soon.
FogerRox
(13,211 posts)They've made no attempt to modify the price decline.
hunter
(38,317 posts)... and the financial wizards and insiders who drive this old bus are trying to bump-start it with cheap oil and crazy financial instruments reeking of utter desperation.
GliderGuider
(21,088 posts)The same thing that happened to the housing market in 2000 to 2006 has happened to the oil market from 2009 to 2014, contends well-known trader Rob Raymond of RCH Energy. And he believes that just as we witnessed the popping of the housing bubble, we are in the midst of the popping of the energy bubble.
"It's the outcome of a zero interest rate policy from the Federal Reserve. What's happened from 2009 to 2014 is, the energy industry has outspent its cash flow by $350 billion to go drill all these wells, and create this supply 'miracle,' if you will, in the United States," Raymond said Thursday on CNBC's "Futures Now."
"The popping of the credit bubble in the energy industry as a result of the downside volatility in oil is likely to result in a collapse of the U.S. rig count," Raymond said. "From a longer-term standpoint, what it does is it really impairs the industry's ability to invest capital."
That said, when it comes to the price of a barrel of oil itself, Raymond expects to see a rebound once U.S. production dries up. "We live in a $90 to $100 world," he said. "We just don't live in it today."
I'd agree with your guess of a bottom under $40.
IDemo
(16,926 posts)and the number is being accepted as gospel by virtually everybody.