The question is, WHY?

http://pjmedia.com/barryrubin/2012/01/16/the-three-rules-of-western-discourse-and-why-the-media-must-always-blame-israel/

proof of his status as a liberal '4 shure'

but it couldn't be that for Western media what Abbas did in Turkey just wasn't front page stuff? Naw it had to be hatred of Israel

It's like moths to a flame....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/11342838#post47

http://rubinreports.blogspot.com/2011/08/whos-right-wing.html


http://www.jpost.com/Features/FrontLines/Article.aspx?id=181832

Azurnoir, are you a leftwinger or a liberal?

actually I am both as they are quite closely intertwined when it comes to US politics, however it should be noted that on DU's home page there is a section called "The Left Column"

it always surprises me to see the liberal, leftist, progressive hairsplitting and splintering going on IMO it smacks as a divide and conquer type of tactic

eta I am sure that Rubin would be a Democrat just exactly like Dershowitz was especially in the 2010 election cycle

But do these recent articles come across as those of a Democrat?

http://pjmedia.com/barryrubin/2011/08/13/the-lefts-very-anti-pc-strategy/

http://pjmedia.com/barryrubin/2011/12/24/in-the-liberal-conservative-debate-wheres-the-common-sense/2/

If conservatives only realized what I just said and explained that to the American people they would win the next election by a landslide. Instead, people are pushing a permanent philosophy and that horrifies many historic liberals who will vote for Democrats and Obama. After all, this empowers propaganda that the Republicans want to turn the clock back a century or two. What is most needed now is not ideology but common sense.

For example, has throwing money at public schools made education better, or made it worse? How many of the spending programs justified by alleged good intentions, nice promises, and moral-sounding goals actually bettered the lot of poor and disadvantaged people, rather than created cushy jobs for decidedly non-poor and advantaged bureaucrats, inefficient unionized government employees, and recipients of grants for doing little or nothing?'''

So let’s be non-ideological serious people. Have the Department of Education, the Department of Energy, and all of the other bureaucrats and red-tape worked or not? Was the taxpayers’ money well-spent or thrown away? Are alleged good intentions and worthy causes just covers for sophisticated corruption and theft? Patriotism was once the last refuge of scoundrels. Today, that’s been replaced by claiming to save the environment, benefit the poor and downtrodden, and impose social justice through the redistribution of wealth (i.e., gimme!).

To paraphrase Obama’s key patron, unrepentant terrorist Bill Ayers, you don’t need a weatherman to tell which way the wind blows.

Thus, applying common sense does not mean that the bland centrist way is the best campaign theme. In confronting a terrible imbalance, strong measures are needed that include serious cutbacks in government, regulation, and spending. The oldest successful theme in the book is to run against corrupt Washington bureaucrats and special interests who are ripping off the taxpayers...

Yet it is vital to remember — as most American voters do subconsciously — that neither liberals nor conservatives, Democrats or Republicans are innately correct due to their membership in such categories. They are only right when the policies and ideas they propose are beneficial and workable for the country. That is how American voters should judge in 2012. If they do so there will be a new president in the White House. If they don’t it’s because you haven’t explained things very well.'

Etc.

Anyone, who especially at a time or recession, calls for 'strong measures that include serious cutbacks in government, regulation and spending' is a:

MONSTER

OF

PURE

INDESCRIBABLE

EVIL!!!!

(Sorry to those such as Pelsar who oppose demonizing one's political enemies; but I have seen what Thatcherism and the Economic Right did to my country, and I can never forgive!)


Note that he is not saying this even in the context of Israel, which at least has a much better social safety net than America. He is saying this in the context of America, where 45000 people a year die prematurely due to lack of healthcare; where there has never been a proper welfare state at all.

Moreover he clearly wants a conservative president to replace Obama, and thinks that if the public don't choose one, it is because the Republicans have not 'explained things well'.

Anyone who holds such views is NOT a liberal. Whatever his views may be on the Middle East. I also have noted his views on Europe, where he has swallowed the 'Eurabia' myth of the likes of Melanie Phillips, hook, line and sinker. I have a complete distrust of him. Like a broken clock, he may be right twice a day; but he is no liberal, if he ever was.

Because some members of this forum are *mainly* interested in I/P, a lot of you seem to think that anyone who objects to a right-wing source does so just to divert from the message.

As someone who objects to right-wing sources on *any* side of the I/P issue, this is not the case for me. I just think that right-wing viewpoints are intrinsically evil, and poison all discourse! At least if you said, 'Rubin is a bad man, but he's right about Abbas' or whatever, one could begin to debate the issues. But the whole concept of calling someone a 'liberal' when they want Obama replaced by a Republican, support massive public spending cuts, and accept Melanie Phillips' views on Muslims in Europe gets in the way of taking anything else about him seriously!

Last edited Tue Jan 17, 2012, 10:21 PM - Edit history (6)

Read this:

http://warped-mirror.com/2012/01/14/when-the-mainstream-left-embraces-the-rhetoric-of-the-far-right/

That's pretty much the case. If you read the link I provided, you'll find that the same people crying "rightwing" are among the last to speak out about the left embracing batshit insane extreme rightwing rhetoric and viewpoints. WRT the I/P debate, it's not just rightwing antisemitic rhetoric which is bad by itself, but also denying, ignoring, and explaining away the extreme rightwing behavior and views of Palestinian as well as Arab leadership (like the MB). They take away all accountability Palestinians have (Israel is always to blame / Palestinians are never responsible). That's the racism of low (or no) expectations. In addition, they're sanctimonious rightwing humanitarians as the causes they fight most vehemently for are propaganda for far rightwing authoritarian regimes.



WRT the I/P issue, if we were to exclude every single source that employs rightwing rhetoric and POV's, this forum would practically be empty. We'd have to discard just about every single source.



Depends on what you believe is a right-wing viewpoint. I seriously doubt you'd label leftwing views that mimic extreme far right viewpoints as being evil and poisonous - or admit this is a significant problem with the left. Any leftwing source WRT the I/P issue that excuses, ignores, denies, or explains away antisemitism and extreme batshit insane rightwingery is doing propaganda for extreme right-wingers. Talk about intrinsically evil...



I'm with you on the part about voting in a Republican. Single issue liberal voters wanting a Democrat replaced by a Republican is a betrayal of liberal values. The feeling is that the liberal votes in a Republican on 1 issue hoping he causes less damage (overall) than the Democrat he's voting against. If on that one issue the Republican holds more of a liberal view than the Democrat, how do you account for the other 100 views where the Democrat is more liberal than the Republican? What do liberal values really mean to you if you're willing to sacrifice nearly all of them for 1 issue.

WRT what you believe about Rubin's views on spending cuts and Eurabia, I disagree. I think you're reading more into Rubin than what's actually there in his writings.

Are You Left-Wing or Right-Wing? Hopefully, I’m Honest-and-Accurate Wing
http://pjmedia.com/barryrubin/2012/01/20/are-you-left-wing-or-right-wing-hopefully-i’m-honest-and-accurate-wing/

I think that's an excellent article that sums it up perfectly. I can't imagine you disagreeing with it, even if it is written by Barry Rubin.



It's an appeal to honesty, accuracy, and rationality. IMHO, only propagandists could possibly have a problem with this article.

That’s why the theme of portraying the opposition as greedy, rich, fat-cat, corporate chieftains and simultaneously hillbilly, gun-toting, religious fanatic racists who think Obama is a Muslim-born in Kenya and want to reinstitute slavery is so incredibly effective in shoring up its base of support.

well that is how some 'liberals or 'leftists' view the Republican leadership vs some of the followers of that leadership albeit "hillbilly" does not exactly fit the type but it does wonders for the mental image Rubin is creating

Even the simplest points of fact — that the Tea Party is a group of people opposed to big government, high taxes, tight regulation, and large deficits — barely appear amidst the propaganda aimed at discrediting any opposition as illegitimate.

yes Mitt Romney pays an incredible 15% of his income in taxes, he said so recently the nerve of big government charging him that much and of course tight regulation is exactly what led to the current mess in the mortgage market in the US isn't it?

If you can persuade people that anyone is insane if they want to cut economically unproductive government spending and not raise taxes at a time of massive depression and growing deficits, then you have a pretty good propaganda machine.

define economically unproductive government spending would that be things like the Iraq war or health care in Mr Rubin's mind, and oh we do want to raise taxes on especially those paying 15% like Mittens

The hardcore Obama supporter is not watching unemployment levels, the economy, the mess in Egypt and Libya, or the effectiveness of health care reform. His concern is that if he decides Obama is a terrible president it means he is one of “them.” This is a horror he can never accept. For the Jews among them — which explains their higher membership in this group — these factors are reinforced by the image of becoming the very Nazi Cossack Klu Klux Klan monster that is their worst nightmare.

oh but Mr Rubin we do pay attention to those things, that is why we support Obama we also understand that it was the Republican party that stood in the way of effective health care reform and have fought tooth and nail every economic stimulus that Obama has tried to pass, hence the saying the GOP- keeping millions unemployed in the hope of getting one man fired and as for Jews please explain the large Ron Paul ad in the middle of your article?

so in short LB I agree with you Barry Rubin is neither a Democrat or a liberal

And of course, rather than responding substantively to Rubin both Rightwingers and Leftists resort to name calling, guilt by association, diversion, etc.

Not impressive.

If Netanyahu did what Abbas routinely does WRT inciting, glorifying and celebrating terror, there would be saturation media coverage of it. For some reason, most Western journalists aren't interested in the Arabic Press where there's mountains of evidence of Abbas' support for terror and hatred vs. Jews.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/index.php

note the subheadings