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Mosby

(16,328 posts)
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 04:45 PM Mar 2015

Don't let Netanyahu's win fool you: Israel shifted to the left

-snip-

... In the last elections, the combined strength of the right-wing parties – Likud, Yisrael Beiteinu, Habayit Hayehudi, Shas and United Torah Judaism – was 61 seats. In these elections, these same parties together dropped to 57 seats. In the last election, the center – Yesh Atid and Kadima – tallied 21 seats, the same number as the center received in this election (this time split between Yesh Atid and Kulanu). In the last election, the left received 38 seats, and in this election rose to 42 (if one counts Hatnuah as left, given that this year it sat in the center-left Zionist Union). Admittedly, drawing clear distinctions between left, right and center has grown ever more complicated in recent years, and complexity is elided in this back-of-the-envelope analysis. Still, these elections, though they are being described as a landslide victory for Netanyahu, actually saw a shift to the left.

And that is not all. These elections also saw the emergence of Herzog as the undisputed leader of the left, which has wanted for leadership ever since Ehud Barak's disastrous tenure ended 14 years ago. Herzog continued a process of rebuilding begun by his predecessor, Shelly Yacimovich. These elections also saw the emergence of the Joint List, under the remarkable leadership of Ayman Odeh, and a Palestinian-Israeli electorate that seeks, more than ever in the past, to join Israeli political discourse in a meaningful way. These elections also repudiated the xenophobic hate-mongering of Eli Yishai's Yahad party. To conclude from Wednesday's elections that “the nation must be replaced” and that Israeli politics is broken beyond repair, is to misunderstand them.

All this matters, because concluding from the elections that the electorate is hopeless dismisses and disparages precisely the people we need to persuade to bring the change we seek. Many have accused Netanyahu of schnoring votes by manipulating the fears that Israelis feel: fear of Iran's ayatollah's, fear of the Islamic State group, fear of bloody chaos in Syria, fear of Hamas in Gaza, fear of a Europe in which we are told it is no longer safe to travel in T-shirts with Hebrew lettering, fear that the leadership of the Palestinian Authority is playing us. He did, disgustingly, and it is right to blame him for that. But it is wrong to blame Israelis for fearing these things. Instead of dreaming of “replacing the nation,” what we on the left need to do now is listen, understand, and create a new leftist politics that addresses the real and justified concerns of Israelis, for security, for decent schools and hospitals, for a living wage and all the rest.

-snip-

http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.647797#

32 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Don't let Netanyahu's win fool you: Israel shifted to the left (Original Post) Mosby Mar 2015 OP
Wishful thinking or worse. Israel is becoming more and more right wing. BillZBubb Mar 2015 #1
Definitely not true oberliner Mar 2015 #2
What counts as 'left?' nt geek tragedy Mar 2015 #5
Depends, are we using "left" as defined by Netanyahu, or "left" as defined by reality? Scootaloo Mar 2015 #8
Which just voted for Likrud and right wingers. Sorry, Ober. You're not being honest. R. Daneel Olivaw Mar 2015 #14
You continue the apartheid propaganda.. android fan Mar 2015 #19
Your un-depth analysis is...well just sad. R. Daneel Olivaw Mar 2015 #23
* sigh *... Israeli Mar 2015 #24
The numbers speak for themselves Mosby Mar 2015 #3
And the left lost again TO THE RIGHT! BillZBubb Mar 2015 #12
we don't know that yet Mosby Mar 2015 #13
BillZBubb is correct Mosby.... Israeli Mar 2015 #27
Not exactly android fan Mar 2015 #20
That's wishful thinking FBaggins Mar 2015 #28
* sigh *... Israeli Mar 2015 #25
What does this man believe constitutes a viable state for the Palestinians and does he Jefferson23 Mar 2015 #4
How about Palenstinians offering to sit down directly with Israel android fan Mar 2015 #21
Israel's agenda is peace? Not so when reading the documented record and you did not answer Jefferson23 Mar 2015 #22
the numbers point to a majority of Knesset seats going to parties geek tragedy Mar 2015 #6
This is not true oberliner Mar 2015 #7
"support the two state solution" has been proven to be a phrase so elastic geek tragedy Mar 2015 #9
Putinyahu. Perfect comparison. R. Daneel Olivaw Mar 2015 #15
Yisrael Beiteinu supports a Palestinian state as long as Israeli Arabs become citizens of it azurnoir Mar 2015 #10
Lieberman's past history of bolting the government because they actually geek tragedy Mar 2015 #11
i hope it shifted left samsingh Mar 2015 #16
Israel is an open Apartheid state now. R. Daneel Olivaw Mar 2015 #17
They aren't fooled. aranthus Mar 2015 #18
Perhaps they did... LeftishBrit Mar 2015 #26
Weimar republic shaayecanaan Mar 2015 #29
Another not-so subtle way to associate Israel with Nazi Germany oberliner Mar 2015 #30
Keep on limping along with Godwin. R. Daneel Olivaw Mar 2015 #31
Message auto-removed Name removed Mar 2015 #32

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
1. Wishful thinking or worse. Israel is becoming more and more right wing.
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 04:50 PM
Mar 2015

Netanyahu's last minute uber-right tactics won. There is a reason for that--a receptive populace.

This piece is a propaganda effort to paper over the continued rise of the right in Israel. It's just like Netanyahu claiming after the election he is really for a two state solution. Fortunately, outside of Israel, people aren't buying this crap any more.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
2. Definitely not true
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 04:55 PM
Mar 2015

Have you ever been to Israel?

It is one of the most left-wing countries in the world.

 

Scootaloo

(25,699 posts)
8. Depends, are we using "left" as defined by Netanyahu, or "left" as defined by reality?
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 07:16 PM
Mar 2015

if the former, then yes, "the left" gained, since 'the left" consists of every party more moderate than Likud.

If the latter, then Meretz and Hadash. In this election, technically just Meretz, since Hadash got folded into the JAL. And Meretz actually lost a seat.

 

R. Daneel Olivaw

(12,606 posts)
14. Which just voted for Likrud and right wingers. Sorry, Ober. You're not being honest.
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 10:29 PM
Mar 2015


But let's take Netanbigot's quote and change some of the characters to see how racist this really is.

The Republican leadership is in danger.
Black voters are coming out in droves to the polls
Left wing organizations are busing them out.

Get out to vote, bring your friends and family, vote Republican in order to close the gap between us and the Democrats.

With your help and the help of God,
We will build a nationalist government that will protect the United States of America.


Let's face reality-based reality, and not hasbara 101.

Israel is a bigoted, apartheid state, and a majority of its citizens just voted for right wingers.



Come back to reality, ober.

 

android fan

(214 posts)
19. You continue the apartheid propaganda..
Tue Mar 24, 2015, 04:18 PM
Mar 2015

Palestinians are not Israelis.

They can work for Israelis if they chose to do, but they aren't Israelis by any means.

And yes, they can apply to become one.

 

R. Daneel Olivaw

(12,606 posts)
23. Your un-depth analysis is...well just sad.
Tue Mar 24, 2015, 04:36 PM
Mar 2015

Israel is the rogue state that continues the apartheid blight, and I only report on it.

Mosby

(16,328 posts)
3. The numbers speak for themselves
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 04:56 PM
Mar 2015

The right lost votes compared to the last election, and the left gained votes.

Mosby

(16,328 posts)
13. we don't know that yet
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 08:13 PM
Mar 2015

Bibi still has to put together a coalition and he can only do that with non-right parties.

Israeli

(4,154 posts)
27. BillZBubb is correct Mosby....
Wed Mar 25, 2015, 02:48 PM
Mar 2015

...." the right has moved farther to the right. "

" Bibi still has to put together a coalition and he can only do that with non-right parties. "

Its a done deal .

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4640975,00.html

The surprise victor of a March 17 election, Netanyahu looks well set to assemble a heavily right-leaning cabinet that will control 67 of parliament's 120 seats - a large majority in a country where no one party has ever been able to rule by itself.

Netanyahu will have up to six weeks to put together his new coalition.

Two far-right parties - Bayit Yehudi, which won eight seats, and Yisrael Beytenu, with six - have already pledged their support for Netanyahu in consultations with Rivlin.

In addition, centrist Kulanu, with 10 seats, ultra-Orthodox Shas, with seven, and United Torah Judaism, with six, have also backed Netanyahu, whose Likud has 30 legislators of its own.

Although the horse trading for cabinet positions has yet to start, Likud announced that Netanyahu will name Kulanu's leader, Moshe Kahlon, as the next finance minister, replacing the centrist Yair Lapid, who has refused to join the new government.
 

android fan

(214 posts)
20. Not exactly
Tue Mar 24, 2015, 04:19 PM
Mar 2015

Likudniks has a very very thin line, and Bibi has to submit the coalition for approval which each MK has to affirm its vote, and it's likely he won't have enough.

FBaggins

(26,754 posts)
28. That's wishful thinking
Wed Mar 25, 2015, 04:47 PM
Mar 2015

His hand has actually been improved. It's almost impossible that he won't get a coalition at this point.

He already has 67 seats that recommend him as the next PM.

Israeli

(4,154 posts)
25. * sigh *...
Wed Mar 25, 2015, 07:10 AM
Mar 2015

The numbers sure do Mosby....

Likud got the most votes of any party in Israeli history, 985K, beating Likud 2003, which got 925K.

The OP you posted did you read all of it ?

The morning's gloom reflected not just the disappointing realization that we must go on living with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's noxious and unsteady leadership, but a deeper dismay that there is no longer a place in Israel for the ideals and values that matter most to us. Waking up to the news that Netanyahu controlled six more seats in the Knesset than Isaac Herzog, many on the left took the election results to mean that “something is truly broken, possibly beyond repair,” and that "the nation must be replaced," as Haaretz's Gideon Levy put it.

Noah Efron's attempt to booster moral amongst the Left ....

What needs to be replaced is the entitlement that allows some leftists to complain that the country has been “taken away from us.” What needs to be replaced is our a-pox-on-thee despair. What needs to be replaced is the impatience that leads us on the left to see every election loss as final proof that our democracy is a sham, our past is a lie and our future is lost.

....is falling on deaf ears .

Netanyahu won ...Israel is about to shift more right than it was before these elections .

The Left did not gain votes Mosby......the true Left lost .

Its The End of the Liberal Zionist Façade ...

http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/03/20/the-end-of-the-liberal-zionist-facade/

The outcome is clear: the people of Israel have voted for Apartheid.

It is now extremely likely that a spate of anti-democratic laws that had been shelved will soon resurface. These include laws that monitor and limit the financing of human rights NGOs, restrict freedom of the expression, reduce the authority of the Supreme Court, cancel the official status of Arabic, and, of course, bring to a vote the nation-state law. This bill, which was originally drafted by a Likud member, defines Jewishness as the state’s default in any instance, legal or legislative, in which the state’s Jewishness and its democratic aspirations clash‫. This means that Laws that provide equal rights to all citizens can be struck down on the pretense that they violate the state’s Jewish character. Moreover, this law reserves communal rights for Jews alone, thus denying Palestinian citizens any kind of national identity.


Alongside anti-democratic legislation, we can also expect an array of discriminatory policies to be enacted. The new government will likely implement some variation of the Prawer plan, which intends to forcefully relocate thousands of Palestinian Bedouins and take over their land. It will continue pouring billions of dollars on Israel’s settlement in the West Bank and Golan Heights and expropriate more houses and land in East Jerusalem. And it will probably imprison thousands of refugees and “illegal” migrant laborers from Africa currently workers in Israeli cities.

There is, however, one clear advantage to the election results: clarity. At least now there will be no liberal Zionist façade, camouflaging Israel’s unwillingness to dismantle its colonial project. The Israeli refrain that a diplomatic solution with the Palestinians cannot be achieved because the Palestinians lack leadership will ring even more hollow. Finally, the claim that Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East will exposed for what it is: a half truth. While Israel is a democracy for Jews it is a repressive regime for Palestinians.


Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
4. What does this man believe constitutes a viable state for the Palestinians and does he
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 04:56 PM
Mar 2015

respect international law on the topic of the OPT?

Herzog and Livni were not going to go that route, so what is liberal minded there?

 

android fan

(214 posts)
21. How about Palenstinians offering to sit down directly with Israel
Tue Mar 24, 2015, 04:22 PM
Mar 2015

for starters?

First and foremost on Israel's agenda is peace. They can co-exist with Palestine. They just have to find the path to peace.

Oh, and how about free and fair elections for the Palestinian Authority? Abbas is overextending his stay in the PA leadership role...

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
22. Israel's agenda is peace? Not so when reading the documented record and you did not answer
Tue Mar 24, 2015, 04:30 PM
Mar 2015

my question, btw. An agreement that does not result in a viable state for them will not bring
peace.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
6. the numbers point to a majority of Knesset seats going to parties
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 06:02 PM
Mar 2015

that are on the record opposing negotiations for a Palestinian state.

Including the supposedly moderate Kulanu and its head Kahlon, who have ruled out negotiations with Abbas (as if someone better will come along) and instead view the current situation as already having achieved a "two-state situation."

So, the plain fact is that Israel voted against negotiations for a Palestinian state.

67 votes for the apartheid right is still 67 votes for the apartheid right.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
7. This is not true
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 06:58 PM
Mar 2015

Neither UTJ nor Shas are on the record opposing such negotiations. And Yisrael Beiteinu is explicitly on the record supporting the creation of a Palestinian state.

Every single poll of Israelis show that the majority supports a two-state solution.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
9. "support the two state solution" has been proven to be a phrase so elastic
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 07:18 PM
Mar 2015

it has no meaning, except in the negative.

Avigdor Lieberman favors it so long as it means he gets to ethnically cleanse Israel of Arabs, for example.

Yes, Israelis support the two-state solution, so long as it doesn't mean negotiating with the Palestinians with the goal being a sovereign Palestinian state with control over its own borders, airspace, immigration, power to make treaties, and ground water.

And, of course, they don't want to deal with it now.

It's something Israelis say they favor in order to avoid getting in trouble with the US and Europe.

As was perfectly illustrated by Putinyahu last week.

Bibi's economic record is a disaster. So why did they keep him?

Because they want him handling the Palestinians and the Iranians and the US.

azurnoir

(45,850 posts)
10. Yisrael Beiteinu supports a Palestinian state as long as Israeli Arabs become citizens of it
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 07:21 PM
Mar 2015

Shas also supports a Palestinian State as long as Jews who left Arabs countries are compensated for the property they left behind

and United Torah Judaism has no opinion either way

Shas demands and endorses a compensation package for those Sephardi and Mizrahi Jews that were forced to leave their host countries and their property behind, making it a condition for its being willing to accept any peace deal with the PLO and bilateral peace agreements with Arab Countries.[citation needed]

Shas opposes any form of public expression of homosexuality, including Gay Pride parades, especially in Jerusalem. Shas MK Nissim Ze'ev accused the homosexual community of "carrying out the self-destruction of Israeli society and the Jewish people", calling homosexuals "a plague as toxic as bird flu".[13] However, it officially condemns any form of violence against gays and lesbians.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shas

United Torah Judaism (Yahadut Hatorah - UTJ) is a coalition of two ultra-Orthodox parties, Agudat Israel and Degel HaTorah, which submitted a joint list in the 1992 election, in which it won four Knesset seats. In the 1999 elections, UTJ won five Knesset seats. UTJ wants to maintain a status quo relationship in regard to religion and state issues. UTJ has no opinion on the issue of increasing settlements in the occupied Palestinian territories.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Torah_Judaism

It takes a strong line towards the peace process and the integration of Israeli Arabs, characterized by its 2009 election slogan "No loyalty, no citizenship".[16] Its main platform includes a recognition of the two-state solution, the creation of a Palestinian state that would include an exchange of some largely Arab-inhabited parts of Israel for largely Jewish-inhabited parts of the West Bank.[17] The party maintains an anti-clerical mantle and encourages socio-economic opportunities for new immigrants, in conjunction with efforts to increase Jewish immigration.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yisrael_Beiteinu

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
11. Lieberman's past history of bolting the government because they actually
Mon Mar 23, 2015, 07:41 PM
Mar 2015

started negotiating for a Palestinian state indicate that his support for a Palestinian state is less than sincere. He also wants to re-occupy Gaza.

Shas has a long history of really, really nasty bigotry towards Arabs. Worse than Lieberman even.

aranthus

(3,385 posts)
18. They aren't fooled.
Tue Mar 24, 2015, 02:32 PM
Mar 2015

They're just hateful and looking for a hook on which to hang Israel. How many of these people excused the election of Hamas?

LeftishBrit

(41,208 posts)
26. Perhaps they did...
Wed Mar 25, 2015, 01:50 PM
Mar 2015

but until the voting system is reformed, it won't translate itself into anything practical in terms of government.

The UK is IMO going down the drain because of a lack of proportional representation, and Israel because of an excess of it.

shaayecanaan

(6,068 posts)
29. Weimar republic
Thu Mar 26, 2015, 08:30 AM
Mar 2015
Instead of voting for an MP, like we do in Britain, Weimar Germans voted for a party. Each party was then allocated seats in the Reichstag exactly reflecting (proportional' to) the number of people who had voted for it. This sounds fair, but in practice it was a disaster - it resulted in dozens of tiny parties, with no party strong enough to get a majority, and, therefore, no government to get its laws passed in the Reichstag. This was a major weakness of the Republic.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/schools/gcsebitesize/history/mwh/germany/weimarstrengthweakrev_print.shtml

Response to Mosby (Original post)

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