I know and I am related to gay people who go to church regularly. Ironic since I don't attend church because I dislike their hate speech against certain groups. The answer I always get is the same one this guy gives. They feel going to church is a good thing and has positive influences on the community. Personally I think it is a desperate attempt at acceptance by organizations with a lot of influence. To me it is like a black person attending klan rallies.

Churches preach hate against gay people. I cannot understand why any gay person would want to belong to any organized religion. I have had this argument with gay people I know.

Graber seems to have found a congregation where he feels at home. His other possible options include the Episcopal Church, the Metropolitan Community Church, the United Church of Christ, and several independent groups.

They all either preach it openly or condone the hate silently. Obviously it wasn't as welcoming as he thought.

Find a source where the United Church of Christ or the Episcopal Church preaches hate against gays. Or the MCC--which you obviously know nothing about.

They preach tolerance and that is not the same as full acceptance. This is why I can't stand religions. You all lie.

the Episcopal Church has two openly LGBT bishops, one of whom is now married (or "civil uniioned&quot to his life partner. I suspect the other will marry hers as soon as Prop h8 falls. The UCC has LGBT clergy and ran a series of television ads a few years ago specfifically welcoming LGBT persons. And the MCC was founded by and for LGBT Christians who lean toward the evangelical side of the spectrum.

But you're the one who made the statement that all churches preach hatred toward gays. It's still your obligation to prove your statement.

leaders of both religions. There is still major opposition to their appointments and refusal to accept them. You point out some tokens and claim that is full acceptance? I bet you think the republicans are inclusive because they have Hermain Cain and put Uncle Thomas on the Supreme Court

Reality proves my statement and you have to be extremely deluded to pretend they don't preach hate towards gay people. All of them. Stating you can tolerate them but still consider their life a sin is just a more subtle form of hate. Like I said before religious people are good at lying and presenting their alteration of reality.

Carry on.

Talk about Fantasyland.

I'm a pagan.

Or not?

And they don't call themselves Episcopalians. The Episcopal Church is part of the Anglican Communion, but the national churches--such as the Nigerian Anglican Church--are independent of each other, and to a large extent, from Canterbury.

Nice scam that is - disown your bad family members and voila, they aren't my responsibility any longer. Get me in on that one.

The national churches are independent of each other. The American Episcopal Church has no way of influencing the African national churches except by expressing its profound disagreement with their anti-gay policies. There is no Pope in the Anglican Communion; the Archbishop of Canterbury is "first among equals" but has no dictatorial powers and cannot excommunicate Peter Akinola and his ilk.

And by the way, they're not "mine." I'm a pagan.

Happy Samhain to you.

I am so sure.

Are we talking about something other than your own lack of knowledge?

Happy Yule to you, anyway.

or put to death people who work on Sunday, eat shellfish or pork, or commit adultery? That's in the Bible too.

These cretins who cherry pick the Bible to suit their own prejudices piss me off like no other.

Cotton & polyester leisure suits are a sin

Beware of false prophets, as the saying goes. Surely some are not haters, but they bear the guilt of abdicating their rightousness to the wing nut variety of ersatz christians

are surprised when that organization acts on its intolerance. Surely he knew the church didn't tolerate being gay. It's like coming out in the boy scouts and then being shocked when they kick you out. If a group openly expresses their dislike for you, don't be surprised when they don't welcome you with open arms.

These type of sociopathic organizations deserve to be taxed at triple Mitt. Romney's rate for 100 years and then back down to, ahem, normal taxation. Their take on homosexuality is sooooo dated and anti- human. Anti- kindness. Anti- loving that it's hypocrisy for those types of masses to gather to worship. They need an economic kick in the teeth, nothing else will wake them up. Tis buy was at risk to start drinking again and needed a support group, not stupid, dated and wrong judgment.

why would anyone choose to associate with one that's not?