Gun Control & RKBA
Related: About this forumFirearms industry benefits from America’s gun violence
Declines occurred after the passage of specific legislation designed to prevent gun-related deaths. Gun homicides dropped after the passage of the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act (1993), the Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act or so-called Assault Weapons Ban (1994), and the FBIs National Instant Criminal Background Check System (1998). In the absence of significant federal legislation over the past, further reductions in gun violence have stalled.
It is worth putting the United States exceptional gun violence problem into perspective. The country´s firearm homicide rate is over six times higher than neighboring Canadas, and 45 times as high as Englands. With the highest rates of gun homicide, suicide and accidental death in the industrialized world, it is not surprising that Americans also feel afraid.
The percentage of Americans who fear walking alone at night has increased since 2001 to nearly 4 in 10 in 2011. And yet national authorities have consistently refused introducing measures to curb gun violence. Strangely, Congress has opted instead to undermine gun control legislation, curb gun safety awareness, and abandon violence prevention programs, including some that registered positive results.
http://baltimorepostexaminer.com/firearms-industry-benefits-americas-gun-violence/2014/03/10
gejohnston
(17,502 posts)More recently, a 2013 Congressional rider stripped the ATF of the authority to compile data on the very gun stores it licenses data that the authors have made use of to estimate US-Mexico arms trafficking. Making matters worse, the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) is prohibited since 2003 from gathering data for the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) that it is mandated by law to administer on behalf of gun stores.
I deleted the paragraphs with the usual scapegoat "mentally ill" and video games nonsense.
ileus
(15,396 posts)SecularMotion
(7,981 posts)Last edited Tue Mar 11, 2014, 03:22 PM - Edit history (1)
But I imagine most gun nuts have me on their Jury Blacklists anyway.
And I won't waste time responding to the same old tired NRA arguments that suicides by gun are not gun violence, background checks do not keep keep criminals from getting guns, and more guns = less crime.
beevul
(12,194 posts)Cite just one incident of that ever happening on DU.
Just 1 incident of someone posting that "suicides by gun are not gun deaths".
You wont. Because you can't. Because that has never happened. And you know it.
Bookmarking.
SecularMotion
(7,981 posts)is a gun lobby tactic to lessen the statistics of gun violence.
You're right. I should have written "suicides by gun are not gun violence."
gejohnston
(17,502 posts)it is a prohibition lobby to inflate them. Otherwise, South Korea, Greenland, and Japan have a rope and train violence epidemic.
beevul
(12,194 posts)"You're right. I should have written "suicides by gun are not gun violence."
Oh, I get it. Looking at suicides for what they are, rather than lumping them into the general term "gun violence" in an effort to misrepresent the truth, is a gun lobby tactic...
You better start calling mental health clinics and professionals, and let them know they're using gun lobby tactics, by not including gun murders into it when they talk about suicide stats.
oneshooter
(8,614 posts)I expect you, and all other DU members, to judge a post on it's content. Not to look at it through the glasses of your own prejudice. Am I asking, or expecting too much? Maybe, bu it is the way I look at them, and I expect nothing less from others.
freebrew
(1,917 posts)have NOTHING to do with common law.
It used to be a hanging offense to shoot an unarmed person or to shoot them in the back. With SYG, not so.
I don't like Concealed gun permits. Some people don't have the sense to have a gun and those are the idiots making all the problems.
An argument says that they have to take a course and pass a test. My response is that the same is required for a driver's license. Have you driven lately? 'Nuff Said?
Personally, I own guns. I live in Missouri, in a rural area with coyotes, wild pigs and squirrels that can eat you out of house and home. I see nothing wrong with responsible gun-ownership, but that is not what the NRA is promoting. The NRA works for the gun manufacturers, not for the people. They have a vested interest in arming as many people they can, safety be damned. I wish they were as protective of the 4th amendment.
gejohnston
(17,502 posts)sounds like your source makes Palin look like a MENSA member.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_law
California is a SYG state based on its common law. Wyoming has a duty to retreat based on its common law.
BTW, while the folks at MSNBC correctly point out that John Bush signed the SYG law, they forgot to tell you that it passed with large bi partisan majorities that was veto proof.
Token Republican
(242 posts)Suicides by guns is of course gun deaths? Is it gun violence? That answer depends if you view suicide by non guns as a violent death.
There's lots of yapping about suicides in the USA. But lets look at numbers, shall we? Seems that the USA ranks 33 in the per capta rate of suicides, and a lot of the countries that have a higher rate have far more restrictive gun laws. So it seems that gun laws are unrelated to suicides. Of course, I've seen some people actually say it doesn't matter if people kill themselves by other means, just so long as its not a gun. How comforting.
Rank Country Male Female Average Year
1 Greenland[2][3] (more info) 116.9 45.0 83.0 2011[4]
2 Lithuania[5] (more info) 54.7 10.8 31.0 2012
3 South Korea[6] (more info) 38.2 18.0 28.1 2012
4 Guyana (more info) 39.0 13.4 26.4 2006
5 Kazakhstan (more info) 43.0 9.4 25.6 2008
6 China China[7] (more info) 22.23 2011
7 Belarus[8][9] 20.5 2012
8 Slovenia[10] 34.6 9.4 21.8 2011
9 Hungary[11] 37.4 8.5 21.7 2009
10 Japan (more info)[12] 21.7 2012
11 Sri Lanka (more info) 34.8 9.24 21.3 2011[13]
12 Ukraine (more info) 37.8 7.0 21.2 2009
13 Russia[14] (more info) 19.7 2013
14 Croatia[15] 30.2 10.0 19.7 2002
15 Latvia 20.8 2010 [16]
16 Moldova 17.4 2008
17 Serbia 24.9 9.0 17.3 2011[17]
18 Belgium[note 1][11][note 2] 17[18] 2009
19 Uruguay[19] 16.5 2012
20 Bhutan[20](more info) 16.2 2011
21 Finland[21] 24.6 7.9 16.0 2012
22 South Africa[22] 15.4 2005
23 Poland 27.8 3.8 15.3 2010
24 Taiwan[23] 20.5 9.7 15.1 2011
25 Estonia 27.3 4.5 14.8 2010 [16]
26 France (more info) 22.8 7.4 14.7 2010 [16]
27 Suriname 23.9 4.8 14.4 2005
28 Bosnia and Herzegovina[24] 13.3 2011
29 Austria 23.8 7.1 12.8 2009
30 Czech Republic 12.8 2010
31 Cuba 19.0 5.5 12.3 2008
32 Bulgaria 18.8 6.2 12.3 2008
33 United States[25] (more info)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate
This one's going to be fun. Once again, lack of any critical thinking shows. I suggest you look at the graph of the expansion of CCW rights since the 1980s.
[img][/img]
Looks like the expansion of CCW corresponds with the same time frame. But wait there's more! After the assault weapon ban expired in 2004, gun violence continued to drop.
Want more?
Here's a very telling picture.
[img][/img]
Notice anything? Those big red blotches, thats where there are the most gun deaths. If you did your homework, then you'd see they are in the locations with the most restrictive gun laws.
Oh but I know the next answer. Its because there are weak laws elsewhere and we need to restrict people who live in places where they obey the law.
Right.
Note - I realize this post is not in response to the quote. Comments are not directed to the person I am responding to.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)spin
(17,493 posts)such as another assault weapons ban.
Comparing the firearm violence rate in nations which do not have a constitutional right for civilians to own firearms and without the gun culture that exists in our nation is unrealistic.
Such nations have never had the number of firearm owners and the quantity of firearms that our nation has. When only a few number of people in a nation own firearms it is definitely far easier to pass laws to basically ban most all civilian ownership of such weapons and even to confiscate them.
When at least 80,000,000 people legally own firearms and there are over 300,000,0000 such weapons in a nation it is virtually politically impossible to ban and confiscate them. You also have to consider that while a firearm may be owned by a husband, his wife and children may enjoy shooting and value such weapons for self defense, hunting and target shooting. Those of age to vote may show up at the polls to protect their right to own firearms. The only aids the Republican Party as the Democratic Party is becoming viewed as the party of gun control.
It is definitely true that firearms cause tragedy. However crime statistics show that firearm violence in our nation has decreased to levels last seen in the late 1960s. Both sides of the gun control debate chose to ignore this fact as insinuating that gun violence is on the rise helps both gun sales and the gun control movement.
In m opinion it is far better to push for laws that help to ensure that firearms can be bought and owned by those who are honest, responsible, sane and trained in firearm safety. While that would not totally eliminate all firearm violence it would definitely help and would have far more effect on gun violence than banning and confiscating all rifles and shotguns including those that resemble military weapons.
If the gun control movement was actually serious about reducing firearm violence it only seems logical that they would push for banning and confiscating all handguns as handguns are the prime weapon for gun violence in our nation. That was basically tried by the organization known as Handgun Control, Inc. back in 1980 and was an abysmal failure. Handgun Control, Inc. then morphed into the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence which adopted a more incremental approach to banning the civilian ownership of firearms in our nation and turning our nation into one with gun control laws such as exist is Canada or better yet Great Britain. The Brady Campaign had far more success than Handgun Control Inc. It even managed to push the first Federal Assault Weapons Ban through Congress. That law was so unpopular and unsuccessful that it was allowed to sunset.
The choice that the gun control movement faces is if to continue the noble but futile effort of gradually eliminating gun civilian gun ownership in our nation or to try to improve our current gun laws but still allow civilians the right to own firearms including those which are called "assault weapons." I see little hope that this will happen so consequently I see little chance of our federal gun laws improving in the near future.
Spin, gejohnston and Token Republican... (my new favorite people here on DU)
Very happy to see intelligent people discussing this issue and providing real facts without the normal BS and Bias that all to often infest the pro/anti gun issue.
I don't consider myself Pro-Gun, although I am NOT anti-Gun either. I am an American that owns Guns. A firearm (gun) is merely a tool no different then a hammer, screwdriver or any other tool and possess absolutely NO danger unless used or handled improperly.
I do believe that anyone owning a gun should under go firearms training, practice and care. And start at an early age like I was.. rural farm boy. This training should be voluntary, NOT imposed but encouraged. I don't see a need for restrictions on type or capacity of firearms (since the ATF has been doing a fine job of this thru Class I, II & III weapons stamps/permits).
Yes guns need to be out of the hands of criminals (not likely to ever be 100%), without punishing the legal/honest people of America.
I am former military/LEO, Gunsmith, Firearms Instructor and father of several children in the Military and LEO's.
Yes I am a Democrat, just a common sense conservative democrat from back when the party made sense.
Seriously... Guns are not the problem, it's people and their mentality that are the problem.
spin
(17,493 posts)DashOneBravo
(2,679 posts)Last edited Thu Mar 13, 2014, 02:28 AM - Edit history (1)
Another thread in the RKBA.
A few facts. DU now has this for us.
Gun Control: 323 with 6,047
RKBA: 2,761 and 139,682
No wonder why you post here.
Normally I don't have time for the slow targets. But you're mildly abrasive and I'm bored.