And I'll wait for Number23 to respond - because her analysis of these 'as they come incidents' has been pretty spot on.

In some circumstances, such as what you've mentioned, it may matter much more than race. I don't know for sure, because I can only speak from my perspective as a white woman.

I will say this: 45 years ago I was quite young and very naive about race issues, but I knew I was a feminist and cared about women's issues A co-worker, a black man twenty or more years older, was very kind and patient with me, explaining things that needed explaining to me. He also got women's issues better than any man I knew then, almost any man since them. He knew exactly what it was like to have someone look at you and dismiss you because of your skin color, and he easily transferred understanding what it's like to have someone look at you and dismiss you because of your gender.

He taught me a lot, and I'm very glad I got to work with him.

I am a Sanders voter after all.

The employees not respecting him was probably that combination, both race and class, which was my whole point. But now I'm extrapolating and wondering if the whole "it's all class and not race" (and I did not say the other choice is "it's all race and not class&quot movement includes people who resent African Americans who make more money than they do - if that is an element of it. Not necessarily everyone who feels that way, but I'm getting a feeling that it's part why they can't see how racism is a problem for people who aren't poor - and that fixing class issues won't solve everything.

Last edited Tue Jul 21, 2015, 04:43 PM - Edit history (1)

Notice how many attempt to use my relative affluence as a club!

was one of the things that made things click.

I'm slow sometimes. It seems really obvious to me now that I've put things together.

They think it is a matter of personal feelings, perhaps writ large in our institutions, but that feelings of superiority and hate are at the root of it.

They probably don't believe in unconscious bias, and also don't really really perceive structural racism, so for them, it doesn't really exist.

They think that we all function in the same economic and social environment, and that personal hatred from whites is the only real racism.

But your country doesn't end up with about 1/4 of its Black population in jail because of the poor attitude of racist cops. That's part of it, of course, but people in power hire those cops, and cities that want those hires--vote for the politicians that foster that environment.

Now, you could try to outwait all the racists by seeing if they have a change of heart--or you could create voting laws and protections for Black voters, and then enact anti-racist legislation to reign in the cops. And look at what else in your community that is creating racial inequality, and fix it.

In CA we've reduced non-violent felonies to misdemeanors, are reducing school suspensions, and banned the box for felons seeking jobs, because having those things in place was biased against people of color. For that, you have to have a political environment where reducing racial bias is a priority.

WITHOUT DOUBT, THIS TRUE. sorry, didn't notice the caps button hit....

there. Respect.

This is why the whole "it's not class, it's race" is the calling card of the loon. I have seen black folks with PhDs get treated like crap. I have seen black folks in Armani get treated like crap. The issue is not wealth or education. It's COLOR. Do black people in Armani get treated better than black people in rags? Yes. But do they still have to deal with racism every single day of their lives? Yes.

All the damn money in the world won't change a thing or get white people who have been trained their entire lives that they are INNATELY superior to you in every way, to treat you with respect. To not fear you. To not see you as automatically inferior.

dart square into center of the target.

I think that's why StrongBlackMan gets so much sh*t. He says he's upper middle class, and it's specifically the racial injustice that affects him. I can relate. My grandparents were wealthy, and educated. I am middle class to the utmost. I have not known poverty, although I've been broke! Doesn't stop me from worrying that one of my loved ones will be killed by cops.

Some white people don't get this. And helping them see it will be a tough sell. There are some white people who are only "sympathetic" to black people as long as we need lifting and they do the lifting.

And yet, I fear for his safety on a daily basis.

All the money in the world won't protect you from people who hate and resent your very existence; if anything, wealthy, publicly prominent and relatively influential persons of color are treated with MORE hatred and resentment by racist white people, because they don't "know their place" or "respect their 'proper masters' and 'social betters'."