I ask the question because of reception Bravenak's apology thread received; but more, a hide I received as a result.

This crap has gone way too far. Brave's apology, a decent, mature, honest act has unleashed vile crap unlike anything I've seen here - and that's saying something.

While I don't have access to the back end, I am pretty certain the cowardly alerter is the same asshole that has been following me for years, making the same accusation.

If you happen upon the coward, please tell him I would tell him to KMBA; but, he might see that as me asking him out on a date.

Do not want an apology. They want abject submission, and a complete silencing of Bravenak - a very public humiliation where THEY can be proven to be superior to her. NOTHING will ever satisfy them.

As I recall, so much of the flame war around this goes back to the BLM demonstration at a Bernie rally last year. Some Bernie supporters were tremendously indignant that these two black women had the temerity to go up on stage during a Bernie rally, thus preventing him from speaking that day. The posts were outraged that they interrupt some one who was so plainly acting in the interest of black people. It reeked of calling them "uppity" - really short-sighted and ignorant on their part.

Bravenak tried to help them see the world from her point of view - then was insulted, belittled, berated, humiliated for her troubles, and effectively told how and what she should think. It was so sad, foolish, condescending (and racist, really) on their part. It was anything but a lesson in Dale Carnegie.

It would seem that when really smart people have a much different opinion or point of view, it is best to listen to them, although not always easy to do, and Bernie's supporters really need to listen to both you and Bravenak. We have much to learn from both of you - and so many others. One learns nothing from those with whom we completely agree, we most commonly learn more from those with whom we disagree.

I would like to think that so many of those people are just trolls, but I am afraid that a large number are not. So much of politics is affirmation and domination, and we need grow beyond this.

Also, non-sequitor, Bravenak, if you read this, a while back you took a maths test. How did it go?

Those who continue to be offended are looking for a reason, we all know that. They are gleeful at the chance to attack some more. Bravenak has covered herself in sackcloth and ashes and paraded around the public square in atonement. What more could she do?



I vaguely remember HamdenRice, that he was one of the more gifted writers on this site..... Didn't know that he was tombstoned or anything about anti-semitism. That makes me sad.

I tried to search the old DU to figure out what happened, but search is unavailable right now. We were not friends, exactly, but I enjoyed his posts immensely because his writing was so far above the average. I don't recall anything disturbing in its content, either. Oh well. I will go back and look later....

response from Teh Crew is to attack us EVEN WORSE.

The coordinated attacks against bravenak would be funny if they weren't indicative some truly sinister, scary shit. The howling hordes crowding around determined to shut this black heffa up AT ALL COSTS look like something out of Birth of a Nation -- the first one, not the current one.

A group here has determined it is their mission to run us off of DU. And if they have to lie, distort and make themselves look like Grand Wizards in the process, it's clear they are perfectly happy to do so. I cracked up when I saw that one of bravenak's biggest cheerleaders is Flagged for Review after she has spent the better part of the last three days doing nothing but posting bravenak's post on that other board over and over and over again. But we all know there are many others all too happy to take her place while she's on her little vacation.

It's sad and pathetic they feel they have to silence Bravenak.

I hope you alerted on the jury results. Are you able to? I wish I'd been on that jury.

... I kept my distance until several gestures of apology were made (we're never going to hear the actual phrase "I'm sorry&quot ; and I checked with my husband (who was the injured party), and what he said was: "It was last October. She was in pain and on drugs. Time to let bygones be bygones."

The relationship will never be totally what it was before our neighbor had her meltdown, but I'd hate to develop what my sister calls Irish Alzheimers: "Where you forget everything but the grudges." Time to have her back over for some coffee.

The people who are the most bothered don't care about her apology. That's not the point for them. They're still looking for a way to silence her and they hope they've found it.

I stand by my hidden post.

and admittedly, I had no idea why bravenak felt the need for an apology until I read the thread, those who were truly upset for personal reasons accepted her apology and moved forward. Those who enmesh themselves in the middle of the latest Internet feud are offended as a reason to lash out.

and the sad thing is that the thoughtful replies were drowned out by the clatter.

she was apologizing to are never going to be satisfied because she didn't address them...because there was no reason to. Most of the crap I saw was from her many "fans" who would jump her if she simply posted "have a nice day." She can do no right as far as they are concerned.

I liked your post.

My husband is a grandchild of the Jewish Diaspora. His father was well into his 50's when he had him--old enough to have fought in WW2. With a German accent. He died when my husband was 14, died of alcoholism, chain smoking and PTSD. By all accounts, he was a decent man. My husband, now well into his 50's himself has grieved all life for the early loss of his father, and for the loss of culture and religious connection the diaspora stole from him. His two brothers--both racist shits, ignore that part of them. My husband wants to be genetically tested to find out who he is via ancestry. One time, I remember a friend of ours, the kind of friend who can tell on joke after the other started on "Jew" jokes. My husband let him get to about five of them, and said, "you know I'm Jewish, right?" Much awkward apologizing ensued

So I put your question to him, because there is more to the story. At one time, before we ever met, my husband was a racist shit himself. It took one heartfelt conversation with a angry Native American friend to change him--the telling of which would make this story far too long. Let's just say my husband agreed to stop saying racist shit about black people and our NA friend agreed to hating white people as far as he could.

My husband says a honest and heartfelt apology, especially one that takes courage to make, in the face of adversity cleans your side of the street, the side we are responsible for. By Accepting that apology, that cleans the side of the street of the offended. Not making an apology when called for and not accepting it because of falsity make for filthy mental streets.

thank you for sharing it.

It's the beginning to make things right again. What a beautiful mind your husband has.

Thank you for sharing and thank him for me.

her, and some wont and that is their right.

I think most who wont accept her apology are not Jewish and are the same ones who have no time for BLM until they are doing what they want them to.

In other words, they use either group for their end game.

We all say shit that we regret from time to time.
She owned it, so I say accept and move on.
I think we can all disagree without the vitriol.

And people would do well acknowledging and practicing that quote.

And I trust my sisters/brothers ability to make their own informed choice about dealing with whatever took place to cause the offense.

I think that plays a big part in this situation.

Hate to be short here, but I had to respond while finishing up a very late dinner.

Appreciate this post, as well as many of the others you've made.

in the Charleston church. A heartfelt apology is grace and accepting it is grace.

We do have examples around us on how to be better people as it is always a work in progress. One we can look to is the President. I wish more could have heard his messages of character and grace these last seven years. He did call on us to be better people but was drowned out by hatred. I wish people on DU would remember his example this election season.

I wholeheartedly agree with your last sentence!

He grew up in Hawaii and I posed your question to him because we've discussed how the Ho'oponopono prayer mirrors my particular African tradition. So as far as we're concerned, Bravenak is in a state of grace because she went beyond apology and is absolutely contrite. She is in a state of grace and so are you for defending her. And that is sacred space that nothing can spoil. All others refusing the process at this point are outside of that state and many others are in disgrace, using this opportunity continue to slam her.

Ho'oponopono prayer for making things right is a multi stage process. The four parts of the core prayer, "I'm sorry. Please forgive me. Thank you. I love you."

Repentance, Forgiveness, Gratitude and Love.

However, I also don't think people can claim to "accept" an apology which wasn't meant for them either.

Sorry, 1Strong.. at least Skinner took away their tyrannical rights to suspend us with 5 of those hides.

unless it involves physical or psychological violence. I accept most apologies and give them freely for selfish reasons. It helps remove static. Racist bullying toward our brothers and sisters confounds and disturbs me. Mercy gratifies me and helps me enjoy the day and sleep better at night.

The apology is always due to the person hurt or offended. To me, anyway.