Numbers and hidden secret lore were always considered to be part and parcel of the Hebrew Bible.

I hope you can feel me yawning through the internet, because I'm doing it as hard as I can.

Of course, that wasn't done before Greek influence in the centuries just BCE. Before that, they had separate symbols for numbers.

It's part of the same thinking that had the current Hebrew alphabet always being the Hebrew alphabet, even though there was decent evidence (forcibly overlooked by some) that this wasn't the case. Most of the Kabbalah sounds more like Greek- and Persian-influenced wisdom literature than anything older than 400 BC from west of the Euphrates, and it makes sense in the post-Maccabean period that being foreign-influenced it would be suppressed. It also makes sense that it would continue, and in search of legitimacy claim deep antiquity.

You literally decontextualized my "quotation" in pulling words out of a single brief sentence.

Except when it doesn't, of course.

Didn't know you were into numerology, gil.

And understanding that a story can have many layers.

and in no way automatically suggesting any actual connection to reality or history.

And we agree. And THAT is where faith enters.

As I, and others, have repeatedly written.

Faith that the white "race" is superior and ordained by god becomes just as valid as the faith that all people are equal in the eyes of god.

You put yourself in very uncomfortable territory with your weak reasoning, gil.

When speaking of the Bible, it is helpful to be aware of things that relate to interpretation and analysis.

Agreed?

something MEANS something in your bible - it automatically becomes highly problematic. You've admitted it's not about proof at all - no verification of anything is necessary. So all assertions (including yours) are both equally true and equally false.

I'd like to continue this discussion respectfully.

Please explain where your confusion lies.

I noted that it isn't always true.

And then I expressed curiosity about your interest in numerology (belief in the special meaning or significance of numbers).

and the number refers to a period of testing and/or reflection, it can be reasonable to assume that the number is metaphoric.

Except when it isn't. As I said.

so it is balderdash to suppose that god would view a racist pond scum in the same light as someone who loved their fellow humans

Do all Christians agree on exactly what those moral teachings are?

Please answer yes or no.

Now, yes or no, does that make any difference?

There is no one Christian, or group of Christians, who can definitively say "THIS is what Christianity means."

As a result, we have no way to live by "Christian principles" or "Christian ideals." No one knows for certain what they are.

So when you say, as you did:

That is clearly a "Yes" answer.

Yes.

LOL

Happy now?

Sorry to be a prick.

But you insisted INSISTED I give you a one word reply. Then when I asked the same of you, you preached a sermon

LOLOL

So long and thanks for all the fish!

Can we start paying attention to how many Americans Trump and his policies have murdered and will murder. Why say things like "Trump's Tax bill will cause 13 million Americans to lose their insurance." What are we? A part of his public relation's team? The evil truth is that it will deliberately murder ten thousand men. women, and children a year. We should keep a running account posted everywhere. For instance: "Thump's X number of islanders murdered brings his murdered American total to X Americans murdered since April 6th.

Let's stick on message, people. Billboards should read things like: "Trump's executive order allowing Republican donors to dump raw sewage in our yards brings X number of murders of Americans to XX number of murdered Americans, which is expected to rise to XXXXXXXX murders when Trump and his Republican murderers murder Social Security and bring XXXXX emaciated murdered childen crying at heaven's gate.

Please don't think i'm kidding about any of this.

Robert P. Arthur

director, and a professor at Wilkes University????

Do we know each other?

I am so glad you've joined us here! Welcome!

And additionally, some of us recognize how the thought process of faith (believing despite evidence) helps support the Trump phenomenon - and we'd like to address that.

Thanks for your post, Robert.

People zipping by at 60mph aren't going to be able to read it all. It may be better to place an ad in your local Republican-leaning newspaper, if you have one.

just like everything else in the Bible.

40 days and 40 nights in a story meant some long period of time not positively but figuritively.

Like in the song Billy Jean

For 40 days and 40 nights the law was on here side.

Not only in the bible

And often, as in the Exodus story or when Jesus went into the wilderness, it was a time of reflection and testing.

don't put much stock in what I say.

Well, interestingly enough, it was exactly, or figuratively, 40 days and 40 nights.

Did the armor rust?

I filed a notice to show cause against a member of Operation Rescue who was violating an injunction preventing her from being on Planned Parenthood property. After a hearing for contempt, the Court originally sentenced her to 40 days in the county jail. When I got back to the office the judge called and said he was reducing the sentence to 37 days. His reason was that he was troubled by the biblical connotation of the 40 day sentence.

Pontius Pilate. Forty lashes less one for mercy's sake.

My view.

Usually in reference to taking a dump, as in "Goest thou and take a 45, Jehosephat". I think it's in Artesians or Galoshes, but I"m not a Bible expert.

Probation

of Western culture.

It is inescapable because the history of humanity includes religion. Language, stories, the influence is everywhere.

it's inescapable the influence is everywhere.

Perhaps we should try to evolve beyond these things.

All this sophistry is so tiring. I need a nap.

40 is an interesting number in a lot of ways. Here's an entire article on those ways:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/40_(number)

You won't find this exclusive information on Wikipedia:

40 is an XL number, to be sure.
Counting to 40 is so difficult, it requires two people to have enough digits.
40 is an irregular number in some languages, and doesn't follow the pattern of other multiples of ten. For example, Russian.
40 is the most popular size for young men's suit coats and blazers, as well as tuxedo rentals for weddings.
40 is the new 25.
Amazingly there is no $40 Bill or 40-cent coin. The reason for this is a closely guarded secret.
The square root of forty is simply irrational.
In base 3, 40 is written as 1111, therefore four ones equals 40. Four tens is also 40. Go figure. In base 8, however, 40 is 50.

There's more magic in the number 40, but that's enough for now...

Wanna know more about those numbers?

http://www.biblestudy.org/bibleref/meaning-of-numbers-in-bible/introduction.html

Now, mind you, I can't verify the accuracy of the information on that page, but it is on the Internet and it's a Bible Study website, so...

Feel free to return to the topic, or to digress into other areas. I do not mind if people do either.

Also, the link I supplied above has additional information regarding the biblical significance of the number 40 as well as other number of significance. You may find that of interest.

And as I said, I believe that posters should reveal whatever is currently occupying their minds. If it is relevant, so much better.

Regardless of what you think of Christianity or religion, discussion of the bible's contents is useful and interesting (subjective, I know). For better or worse, the bible was hugely influential in all aspects of European and American culture, so its discussion makes complete sense even for atheists like me.

but discussion of the metaphoric aspects apparently irritates some of those who insist only on a literal interpretation.

Be the change you want to see, gil.

the "jawbone of an ass" I think.

we discover the answer to life, the universe and everything.