Religion
Related: About this forumWhat is "a certain belief"?
I read the following in a post recently:
or the certain belief that no deities exist. The two things are incompatible, by definition.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1218287061
So the question is, what is meant in this instance by the phrase "a certain belief"?
My view is that the author meant that this certain belief is a strong belief, meaning that the author strongly believes that this particular belief is correct. And in this post, that certain belief refers to atheism.
What proof does the author present for this certain belief? None, because as a belief, it requires no proof. Belief exists in the absence of any proof.
But in each case, and in each definition of atheism, the author defines atheism as a belief. The difference is that the first is expressed as a negative, and the second is expressed positively.
Thoughts?
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)constantly at Christian funerals.
You seem oddly fascinated with one word in my post. This is the second thread you have started about that post of mine. Perhaps a new hobby would be appropriate.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)MineralMan
(146,317 posts)Voltaire2
(13,061 posts)My guess is slim to none. Once again this poster thinks he has some Major Gotcha.
sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)Thank you Linda Richman/Mike Myers.
sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)funeral service for the newly departed those/that words/phrase are/is not spoken.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)Gee, thanks for the perspective of the 1%, had I wanted to be equally dismissively sarcastic.
sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)Fix The Stupid
(948 posts)sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)'Honk! Honk!
Move your crate, bub!
Hey lady, get outta the way!"
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)I have poor comprehension with double speak.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)And you have yours. Gil must be the president!
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)Who can say? Flattery, however, will get him nowhere.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)I'd say it's cute, but perhaps it's bordering on unhealthy obsession.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)However, I decided a bit ago to engage with him only infrequently here. I'm hoping that will ease down his interest without causing too much pain. I don't think he's my type, really, anyhow.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)Please go to the nearest abused atheists shelter. They have counselors available 24/7. We can even get a restraining order from the Heavenly Court.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)Is that still the number?
No, I'm in no danger, I'm sure. I have a CERTAIN BELIEF about that.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)trotsky
(49,533 posts)sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)hoodwinked, bamboozled.
Oh my DOG, my head.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)YMMV.
sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)Voltaire2
(13,061 posts)are two basic positions for atheism:
1) absence of belief in the existence of any gods.
2) belief that no gods exist.
The first position has been characterized as soft atheism, the second as hard atheism.
The difference can also be expressed as agnostic atheism vs gnostic atheism.
Certain belief that there are no gods is indeed unprovable, just as I cannot prove there are no Santa Clauses, Easter Bunnies, or Unicorns. In my experience most atheist are soft or agnostic atheists.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)All atheists reject belief in deities. Some just take it one step farther.
Whats telling is the false equivocators want to focus on the subset and pretend the overlying qualifier doesnt exist.
Voltaire2
(13,061 posts)I can hardly wait for the op to spring his clever trap.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)Hi Guillaume,
Un vrai sage sage!
Je suis captivé par toi.
Bonne Bon-Bon
💙🇺🇸🌊
imposters outta the people's house!
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)So your first premise is false.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Pew disagrees with you.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Confirming my observation.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)Not uncommon.
Voltaire2
(13,061 posts)the poster attempts a diversion by referencing one of his prior disasters.
sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)Voltaire2
(13,061 posts)So technically the answer is yes.
sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)I do like order in arranging stuff and unfortunately, bc professing I am of the Christian Way, I have a tendency toward perfectionism in a lot. Which is to say I put a lot of performance on MYSELF, not others.
'We' Christians should only strive in 'excellence' when doing or performing anything for Him, in His Name and in His Spirit. We are asked to do these as being done unto Him. Even menial things like mopping the floor, doing laundry or cleaning yucky stuff.
Why'd I even say that.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)Missionary and Cowgirl?
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)Seems like that would be a logical contradiction.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)who introduced that position for intercourse to some indigenous peoples and insisted that it was the only righteous way to boink, I just consider it to be an adjective with a historical meaning. I won't discuss my own use of it, however, which has always been minimal.
Docreed2003
(16,863 posts)marylandblue
(12,344 posts)I believe the earth is round. I am certain of it. I can prove it too.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)Belief in deities is a good example of not.
Voltaire2
(13,061 posts)marylandblue
(12,344 posts)sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)As is quipped on the internet tubes, "saw what you did there". 😊
Somebody that resides with me just rolled in from MD earlier.
When I'm able to divulge, I may. 🦀🦐
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)You subtle, but elicit smiles and a heheh.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Alternatively, you misread my post.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)I read your post, but canned responses are always appreciated as they demonstrate your intellectual laziness.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)I understand.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)You dont
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)It always did. One may order either a salad or fries with that particular menu item. I have stated very clearly that I disbelieve the existence of deities. I do not believe they exist.
I do not say that I believe deities do not exist. The position of the word determines its meaning. "or" is like that. In my sentence it is an exclusionary word. Had I wanted an inclusionary word, I would have written "and."
How many times will I have to explain that to you>
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Specifically:
or the certain belief that no deities exist. The two things are incompatible, by definition.
Let us all know who wins that argument.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)Why are you so focused on the second part?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)That is why.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)And have defended that position. But the definition acknowledges the existence of hard atheists. Those are the ones with "certain belief." The atheists on this site, including MM, do not take that position. So where is the contradiction?
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)Now you claim hes contradicted by other unidentified forum members.
When you get your merde all in one sock, do let us know.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)Last edited Thu Jun 21, 2018, 11:24 AM - Edit history (1)
Bye, now...at least until you call me out again as you have done in this thread. You know, of course, that callouts are frowned upon in discussion forums. Please don't continue to be rude. I will see them.
Mariana
(14,858 posts)Maybe this will help Gil understand you better:
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)...and unbelievers are actually believers.
sprinkleeninow
(20,250 posts)Voltaire2
(13,061 posts)Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)trotsky
(49,533 posts)Gotta admire the guy's persistence if nothing else. And given his consistent behavior, there might actually be nothing else.
Act_of_Reparation
(9,116 posts)Eko
(7,318 posts)That it will work.
Eko
(7,318 posts)Proof.
Eko
(7,318 posts)So, a certain belief can be proved.
Voltaire2
(13,061 posts)There is no certainty that it will work the same next time. So inductive reasoning leads to belief but not certain belief.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)just like he abandons ALL his failed threads where he thought he FINALLY found something to make atheists shut up (his life-long dream).
Rather than stay and engage in dialog and LEARN about what atheists actually think (or believe!!), he runs away to start a new thread when the laughter at his latest humiliation fades away.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)The name calling, the avoidance of any real dialogue, and the fact that this has been your demonstrated pattern for years.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)MineralMan
(146,317 posts)Lordquinton
(7,886 posts)The "no u!" Replies, "I'm rubber you're glue" "I'm not hitting you!"
Did I leave any out?
trotsky
(49,533 posts)You can successfully predict that I will call you on your bullshit 100% of the time, yup!
Speaking of name calling, might want to remove that plank from your eye before you criticize the motes in others.
Snackshack
(2,541 posts)In the context provided above Certain belief is an Oxymoron.
The use of Certain implies an absolute known.
Belief implies a lack of an absolute known.