Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

cbayer

(146,218 posts)
Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:08 PM Feb 2013

Scientology hides from grave allegations behind the mask of religion

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/feb/07/scientology-hides-allegations-mask-religion

L Ron Hubbard's church is under increasing attack, but by calling itself a religion Scientology is shielded from scrutiny

John Sweeney
guardian.co.uk, Thursday 7 February 2013 10.00 EST


Add religion to its treasure and power to intimidate, and the Church of Scientology may seem untouchable.' Photograph: Startraks Photo/Rex Features

Millions of Americans watching the Super Bowl were treated to a soft-voiced ad featuring knitting pattern magazine models boosting the church that L Ron built, but elsewhere the Scientology spring is gathering pace. The latest hammer blow against the church that likes to wear dark glasses is Beyond Belief: My Secret Life Inside Scientology and My Harrowing Escape – a misery memoir by Jenna Miscavige Hill, alleging that her uncle, Scientology's "Pope" David Miscavige, is evil. A charge he denies.

Add a major lawsuit in the US by aggrieved ex-members, a criminal prosecution in Belgium, a war of attrition across the internet and three highly critical books so far this year.

Fear of Britain's libel laws meant that Going Clear by Lawrence Wright was not formally published in the UK, and no big UK publisher would touch my book, Church of Fear, but all three books are now on sale and make for horrible reading for "Pope" Miscavige and his celebrity apostles Tom Cruise and John Travolta.

Yet critics who hope that the end of the Church of Scientology is nigh are probably deluded, until someone powerful and brave on the other side of the Atlantic steps in.

more at link
23 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Scientology hides from grave allegations behind the mask of religion (Original Post) cbayer Feb 2013 OP
CULT Angry Dragon Feb 2013 #1
No, its not. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #3
Buddhism Angry Dragon Feb 2013 #11
There are differences in degree. 2ndAmForComputers Feb 2013 #13
I don't think that word means what you think it means. nt ZombieHorde Feb 2013 #18
Then feel free to enlighten me Angry Dragon Feb 2013 #19
The word "cult" has no inherent negetive meaning, unless one hates religion. ZombieHorde Feb 2013 #20
These are the ones I have come across Angry Dragon Feb 2013 #21
Which dictionary are you using? nt ZombieHorde Feb 2013 #22
I don't see where it makes a difference Angry Dragon Feb 2013 #23
Scientology is a dangerous cult. longship Feb 2013 #2
No, its not. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #4
Well, we could go back and forth on this. longship Feb 2013 #5
No, we could not go back and forth on this. The only difference between a cult and a religion is... cleanhippie Feb 2013 #6
Clearly, you are correct... longship Feb 2013 #7
I'm just yanking your chain. cleanhippie Feb 2013 #8
But can't we continue to argue about the relative magnitudes? longship Feb 2013 #10
Toxicity comparisons are more important than craziness comparisons IMHO. 2ndAmForComputers Feb 2013 #14
You have any facts to back up your opinion?? Angry Dragon Feb 2013 #12
We ought to compare these celebrity apostles to the twelve: dimbear Feb 2013 #9
What's wrong with US? tama Feb 2013 #15
They out-lawyered the IRS and the IRS finally gave up. cbayer Feb 2013 #17
The CoS continues to exist, and thrive, because it takes advantage of a number of items. trotsky Feb 2013 #16

2ndAmForComputers

(3,527 posts)
13. There are differences in degree.
Thu Feb 7, 2013, 11:42 PM
Feb 2013

Like comparing arsenic, strychnine, and cyanide.

That all are poison doesn't negate the fact that some are MORE poisonous than others.

ZombieHorde

(29,047 posts)
20. The word "cult" has no inherent negetive meaning, unless one hates religion.
Fri Feb 8, 2013, 10:35 PM
Feb 2013

A cult is just a religious group. In sociology, the word "cult" is just a short way of saying "alternative religion."

Cults are smaller than major religions, but I don't remember the cut-off numbers.

Angry Dragon

(36,693 posts)
21. These are the ones I have come across
Fri Feb 8, 2013, 10:45 PM
Feb 2013

Followers of an unorthodox, extremist, or false religion or sect who often live outside of conventional society under the direction of a charismatic leader

Followers of an exclusive system of religious beliefs and practices

A religion or sect that is generally considered to be unorthodox, extremist, or false

A system of religious beliefs and rituals

An interest followed with exaggerated zeal


These cover a greater definition than what you expressed

Angry Dragon

(36,693 posts)
23. I don't see where it makes a difference
Fri Feb 8, 2013, 11:29 PM
Feb 2013

took them off of Word Web and Merriam-Webster has about the same

longship

(40,416 posts)
2. Scientology is a dangerous cult.
Thu Feb 7, 2013, 07:33 PM
Feb 2013

John Sweeney has been covering them for years in Britain. This is a good article.

What's not to despise about Scientology? They do no good. Not now. Not ever.

longship

(40,416 posts)
5. Well, we could go back and forth on this.
Thu Feb 7, 2013, 08:25 PM
Feb 2013

But let's not. Regardless, Scientology was set up as a money-making religion by L Ron, a scam.

Today, they are nothing but a thuggish, dangerous cult.

cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
6. No, we could not go back and forth on this. The only difference between a cult and a religion is...
Thu Feb 7, 2013, 08:28 PM
Feb 2013

the size of the congregation.




Couldn't the argument be made that they are ALL money making scams?

longship

(40,416 posts)
7. Clearly, you are correct...
Thu Feb 7, 2013, 08:46 PM
Feb 2013

However, my intent was to invoke "cult" in the more pejorative sense of the word. Because Scientology is cur-ay-zee as they come. (I mean other than possibly the House of Yahweh and their nuclear baby.)

But you are making a rhetorical argument here and I am making a cultural one. That's why I don't wish to go back and forth with you on it.

Everybody knows what I mean when I call Scientology a dangerous cult and that was the intent of my little post.


BTW, friend. Have you looked at the Rick Ross Site. That seems to be the clearinghouse for all things cultic. There's encyclopedic information and support for what society considers a cult... or not.

Regardless, Ross is the guy who researches this stuff and gets it out there.

Thanks for the response, my friend. But let's not get in a rhetorical disagreement here.

cleanhippie

(19,705 posts)
8. I'm just yanking your chain.
Thu Feb 7, 2013, 08:52 PM
Feb 2013

We are in complete agreement.

Although, I would disagree that Scientology is any more "crazy" than any other religious belief system. I always find it amusing when a person that believes in some absurd nonsense, say, like a dead person coming back to life, calls another persons absurd belief "crazy."

longship

(40,416 posts)
10. But can't we continue to argue about the relative magnitudes?
Thu Feb 7, 2013, 09:12 PM
Feb 2013

Darn! I was hoping to be able to begin the chair throwing.

2ndAmForComputers

(3,527 posts)
14. Toxicity comparisons are more important than craziness comparisons IMHO.
Thu Feb 7, 2013, 11:44 PM
Feb 2013

(I agree with you that the craziness is about the same.)

dimbear

(6,271 posts)
9. We ought to compare these celebrity apostles to the twelve:
Thu Feb 7, 2013, 09:04 PM
Feb 2013

Travolta is a highschool dropout, Cruise actually spent a little time in a Franciscan seminary before being invited to depart.

Just like the original apostles, not well educated.

 

tama

(9,137 posts)
15. What's wrong with US?
Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:42 AM
Feb 2013

Finland and AFAIK most other countries don't give scientology the official status of religious organization. Why does US?

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
16. The CoS continues to exist, and thrive, because it takes advantage of a number of items.
Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:22 AM
Feb 2013

Some of them are legally established, like the rules about churches and taxes, etc.

However some of them are thanks to the cover of moderate believers who admonish atheists for being so rude for criticizing religious beliefs, and being upset with the lack of critical thinking applied to said beliefs.

Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Religion»Scientology hides from gr...