Religion
Related: About this forumFrom an Occult Perspective, Atheism is a More Simplistic Belief System Than Christianity
Now, dont get me wrong, Im super conflicted about the rise of popular atheism over the last ten years or so. Lets get that out of the way right off the bat. I truly respect the way people like Richard Dawkins (and the late Christopher Hitchens) challenge the influence of the worlds dominant religions publically. I love Bill Maher and found his movie Religulous quite amusing for the most part. This critical dialogue is incredibly important because I got news for you, religion is still the great fundamental bamboozle driving the war on drugs and terror. I think organized religion can be just as nuts as these guys do. I guess I just also see that it can also be incredibly and most boringly normal. A lot of good things come out of it as well, a sense of community, drug rehabilitation, charity work, etc.
Truth be told, the majority of people Ive known or hung out with for most of my life have basically considered themselves atheists. Its become almost a badge of pride for so many teenagers and young people, but I got news for you, it isnt anything new or subversive. Kind of conformist in all honestly, just like religion. Try being an Occultist, everyone thinks youre completely batshit. You are and always will be an outsider. People have absolutely no problem insulting your spiritual beliefs publically, so most of the time you dont even bring it up. Seriously, directly insulting peoples supposed new age or mystical practices is seen as absolutely A-OK in pop culture and even in the work place, to this day. Ive seen it first hand and its pretty much why I dont talk about my writing at my job, ever. Truthfully, I dont talk about my magickal practice in 99.9% of the conversations I have in actual life (but I do on Facebook, friend me).
The reason is obvious. Its pointless. People know so little about even basic spiritual shit its mind boggling. And heres where I get weird. You know how I define spirituality? By matters of the spirit. Dreams, hallucinations, etheogen rituals, astral projection encounters, supposed alien contact? Yeah, thats spirituality to me. Stuff that takes your consciousness out of the material realm and into the realm of the soul. Crazy way of looking at it I know. And thats the problem I have with atheism. Ive never known an atheist who knows anything about this sort of thing or has experimented with it at all, outside of maybe trying mushrooms once or twice. But they all have strong opinions as to why they dont have to. Basically, if that kind of thing was important, our society would have figured it out by now. Thats essentially the argument you get (trust me, I had many of these drunken debates before I turned like 25 and realized how pointless it is).
Funny story on that front, I used to sing (yell) in a metaphysical rant metal band. All of the lyrics in the project were essentially about the spiritual ignorance of humanity, and a lot were about how this ignorance was reflected through me, which I dont think most people got. No, I wasnt necessarily ranting bout my how stupid people are, I was ranting about how stupid I am because Im a person. Actually when looking back, a lot of it had to do with my own non-acceptance of these non-physical realities which is something I didnt even understand at the time. Anywho, you know who really didnt get what I was doing? All the other guys in the band. We hung out and drank incredibly heavily together for 4 straight years, and we practiced 3 times a week so that meant a lot of debauched tomfoolery. Amazingly, we sometimes talked about things other than our dicks, but despite being in a band whose lyricist was espousing ideas completely foreign to them, nobody once bothered to read a single book I recommended them so theyd get hip. Then it got even more peculiar because as creative tension began to mount in the project, near the bands demise, I increasingly caught shit for writing lyrics that made no sense. Pretty much sums up my experience with most atheists Ive known. That song doesnt make any sense? Yeah, actually it does and its fairly coherent I must say, did you read that Rick Strassman book about DMT I leant you 2 years ago? No? Yeah, well, you just answered your question as to why that song doesnt make any sense to you.
http://www.disinfo.com/2013/03/from-an-occult-perspective-atheism-is-a-more-simplistic-belief-system-than-christianity/
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)Atheists have no dogma, no liturgy, no catechism and no priesthood.
Above all though atheists have no collection plate, can't really be a belief system with no collection plate.
LuvNewcastle
(16,855 posts)Response to Fumesucker (Reply #1)
mr blur This message was self-deleted by its author.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)Donald Ian Rankin
(13,598 posts)Arguably atheism isn't, but it's certainly not a sine qua non.
ret5hd
(20,516 posts)Silent3
(15,259 posts)...thing I've made out of all of the stuff I like to imagine is real, but can never prove is any more real than wishful (or in some cases, fearful) thinking! Anyone who doesn't fully appreciate my imaginary world is being "simplistic"!
And look, I've thrown in some stuff that might actually be good advice, a useful perspective here and there, but I'm going to insist that it's all part of "spirituality", MY spirituality, and if you reject my spirituality then all you've got left is a dull, boring, materialistic existence (don't mind me while I conveniently blur the line between scientific materialism and money-grubbing acquisitiveness), devoid of hope, devoid of art, devoid of passion!
This is nothing more than a variant of the Courtier's Reply.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)Really interesting, though. I love the dream he describes at the end.
What's even more interesting to me is that I just had a conversation about this sort of thing with friends last night.
Coincidence or not?
LuvNewcastle
(16,855 posts)It's not so much that science can't learn the answers to a lot of questions posed by those who believe in the spiritual realm -- there just aren't that many scientists trying to answer those questions. I'm grateful that they're busy finding cures for diseases and new forms of energy, but there are lots of questions that people have that so far only religion and the occult try to take on and that, of course, is guesswork. If you ask a scientist about ghosts or spirits, you're likely to hear that such things are just delusions or at any rate, they don't matter. I think a desire to learn about an afterlife and spirits are a normal part of the human condition. I also think that our experiences in life matter, and people shouldn't make fun of others who have a desire to understand their meaning, if there is a meaning we can comprehend.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)to be ridiculed or dismissed than religious believers.
But you make an excellent point about serious study. The numbers of people that report some kind of very unusual experience tend to be quite high. Before anyone blows them off, they really might want to consider looking more closely.
Anyway, thanks for the interesting article. I enjoyed it.
Iggo
(47,564 posts)Humanist_Activist
(7,670 posts)How to distinguish fantasy from reality.
MineralMan
(146,325 posts)It requires nothing. It believes nothing. It is the default.