Religion
Related: About this forumPeace Sign Satanic? Dutch Christian School Destroys 3,000 Calendars Over One Image
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/14/dutch-school-peace-sign-satanic_n_3915627.html?utm_hp_ref=religionPosted: 09/14/2013 8:46 am EDT
A Christian school in the Netherlands, Pieter Zandt Scholengemeenschap, was horrified to find an allegedly satanic symbol in its latest student agenda, asking parents and students to return the planners for shredding.
That symbol? A peace sign.
School board chairman Johan van Puten told Dutch newspaper Trouw that a Google search revealed that the peace sign allegedly contains a Nero cross, which was used in Roman times to represent the torture of Christians, and now apparently has Satanist connotations. It also has connotations with Nazism, as the Teach Peace Foundation writes that it was used as the symbol for Hitler's 3rd Panzer Division.
Blog Goedgelovig reported that in order to prevent students from using inappropriate planners, Pieter Zandt requires all students to use the official, school-published agenda, though it allows for some creativity by allowing a few students to design it each year. They added tips, jokes, quotes from scripture, and pictures, but now it seems their work was in vain.
more at link
gopiscrap
(23,762 posts)rug
(82,333 posts)cbayer
(146,218 posts)When I read this, I thought there might be some mass hysteria going on.
rug
(82,333 posts)The only thing I vaguely remember was that in a litany of abuse during Vietnam demonstrations.
"Dirty happies! Communists! Satanists! Traitors!", etc. To be fair, 2 out of 4 were incorrect.
Who knew there's some nutty scholarship around the peace sign?
cbayer
(146,218 posts)appealed to me, I never heard anyone relate it to satanism.
Mariana
(14,858 posts)I learned that in Sunday School.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)Mariana
(14,858 posts)It was about the same time I first heard about the reversed Satanic messages in popular songs.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)Peace symbols were an important part of my church during the Viet Nam era. The church was very focused on efforts to stop the war.
It's interesting how different churches saw it in such different way.
struggle4progress
(118,319 posts)"peace sign is a symbol of devil worship" was most common. It was crazy bullshit back then and it's crazy bullshit now
louis-t
(23,296 posts)Mercedes. (1st Panzer)
cbayer
(146,218 posts)louis-t
(23,296 posts)cbayer
(146,218 posts)louis-t
(23,296 posts)cbayer
(146,218 posts)louis-t
(23,296 posts)struggle4progress
(118,319 posts)a webpage making such claims
It's not clear how standardized division markings were. A number of site claim and inverted Y with two bars || as the 3rd Panzer symbol, but it's not standardized even when I find it:
The Mercedes-Benz tristar dates from the earliest days of the company
and the tristar-in-circle was in use in WWI
Since Hitler was ferried about in a luxury Mercedes-Benz, and since the company did actually manufacture tanks during the war, it's easy enough to imagine that a tank crew here and there might have jokingly placed a cartoon of the company symbol on their tank -- or converted an inverted Y into the now more-recognizable Mercedes-Benz symbol by drawing a circle around it -- and made comments like "Hitler has a Mercedes, and now he's given us one too!"
struggle4progress
(118,319 posts)there were several of them
Wikipedia gives the following symbols for the Wehrmacht's 3rd panzer division:
But the SS also had its own 3rd panzer division "Deaths-head"
msongs
(67,429 posts)cbayer
(146,218 posts)Or an X?
MADem
(135,425 posts)And then some!
It's nice to know we aren't the only crew with idiots among us!
Journeyman
(15,036 posts)Nothing separates a fool from his money quicker than a reprint of a perfectly fine project.
As a caring adult, and long-time graphic designer, I feel for the students who will now have to deal for the first time with a fickle client. But better they learn now, and on the customer's dime (or Euro, as the case may be), than to learn so later, when conceivably the customer holds them (or their employer) responsible and they have to pay for the reprint.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)Do you look at things with an eye to warning clients that they might have a problem with the product or do you just do what they ask?
Journeyman
(15,036 posts)My philosophy (as both a broker and designer) is to give the client what they want, not what they've asked for.
I would have definitely questioned the peace sign as a symbol capable of being perceived as anti-Christian, especially given the nature of the client (a religious school). I was unaware of the association with the Panzer divisions, but that would now be another point I'd bring up in any future discussion with this symbol in a project.
After the proofs are signed off, however, and a project is printed (and especially if the client has gone against my advice), I'm more than pleased to reprint it. Usually at a lesser cost, if possible, since these situations are always a sore point for everyone involved at the client's office, and the more we can ease that pain the better they'll think of us when the next project comes up.
My snark was addressed more to the "adults" in this situation who didn't completely proof their students work. Whenever you're dealing with students, especially young students, it's best to err on the side of over-analysis than it is to blithely approve whatever they hand you.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)It amazes me how many things get printed with misspellings or phrases that could be completely misinterpreted.
I would have seen the peace symbol as innocuous. Not sure what the context was in these books, though.
trotsky
(49,533 posts)Others believe that contraception is against god's will and they refuse to dispense it.
And some think certain articles of clothing are too revealing for church. (Few of them, if any, would draw that line in the same place, of course.)
As long as religious beliefs are special, as long as we continue to protect them from real criticism and analysis, someone will always try to play the trump card of "These are my beliefs! I don't need to justify them!" and if that person is in a position of power or influence, they'll affect others.
hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)DJ13
(23,671 posts)cbayer
(146,218 posts)..... kinda creepy!
dimbear
(6,271 posts)(Mickey Mouse on the nose of a Messerschmidt)
I don't think they ever used Pooh. Too peaceful.