The article seems to mourn the presence in churches of...nurturing? And men don't like nurturing? If a man is soooo "manly" that he can't embrace that as part of his spiritual self, then it seems to me he's more pretending at being manly, fearfully rejecting things he doesn't see as manly. And that sounds like an individual's problem more than the church's.

There's also complaints about what I see as fundamentalism rather than femininity (being against dancing etc.), and when I think of fundamentalism I definitely don't think of it being driven primarily by women.

Then there's this paragraph: "But try to see church through the eyes of a typical guy. It’s intimidating for a man to hold hands in a circle, to cry in public, or to imagine falling deeply in love with another man (even if his name is Jesus)."

C'mon, that's just weak. It's easy to find a church that doesn't hold hands if that's a huge deal. And all men love other men. Fathers, brothers, friends, etc. That's just macho bull.

As for being polite and restraining the baser part of being male, it's like an hour a week. We can tell fart jokes later. I just don't see the big deal.

and I don't understand where this article is coming from. At my church we shake hands. We break bread. (yep, as a potluck but guess who talks about them for days before, with a tone of heavy anticipation? Yep, the men in the congregation. They are the ones asking the older women if they'll be making a certain dish and they are the first to volunteer for the bbq.)

We mill about for a bit before and after service, drinking coffee, talking about sports. (Always talking sports and about the games airing after service.)

A number of men in my congregation are active duty military. They seem more then happy to be at services and seem to delight in taking a more active role in activities.

I feel like the article is an attempt at excusing others for not attending services. If a person doesn't want to attend then don't-it's not a big deal. What I don't like are the excuses involved.

I'm much more likely to want to sleep in on a Sunday than my husband. Not to mention, even in the south, while more women are in attendance, everything is still run by males. So, if other males are unhappy, they have only themselves to blame.

Potluck dinners were cooked by women, eaten by everyone, but made it easy to feed a lot of people with less money. Many churches didn't have the resources to cater. As for tea parties, etc...Men were running everything else. So, women ended up doing what interested them at the time and didn't intimidate men in their roles.

Now, today some churches are more progressive than others. But, those are my memory of churches in older times. I think the reason some men don't like attending church is the same reason some women don't like to attend. Down deep, they don't think God will mind and they simply want to do something else with their time...sleep, scratch, play golf, whatever...

I know that the men at my church tend to be quite happy to attend. The older men see it as a chance to get out of the house and catch up with others. The vets at the local vets home and the residents at the local nursing homes, men and women both, are waiting for the bus to pick them up for services. The younger men are just happy to hang out and talk to others their age. Many of them are newly married, new to the area, or new fathers and they don't have many people their age to talk to.

I just don't see it as being anything other then they don't want to get out of bed. The men I see at church are really happy to be there and don't seem to have the complaints in the article.

and the author of the article is trying to sell his book on making Christianity more "masculine" according to his personal criteria of that.

http://churchformen.com/tools/ideas-for-your-church/ten-ways-to-man-up-your-church/

a woman, wouldn't be accepted by him.

What a jackass.

would not be interested in attending services, no matter what.

Wait-that's not true. If churches offered services dropping people off at the front door in the monster truck of their choice, gave away free cheap beer, and installed a cage for fighting then yes, those kind of people would attend church.

You know, I can think of more than a few guys who would be into that, sadly...

would love that church. They'd be glad to tithe for the cause!

but not at my Quaker Meeting. More than half of us are men.

especially when I'm a Democrat and don't like being insulted with jokes by some minister who isn't a better man than I am. Mostly, they are men and they have become republicans in recent years and made a mockery of religion itself. I can pray in complete honesty and sincerity at home away from the distractions of an audience. These desecrators of the faith have made church irrelevant to the belief in Christ. I happen to believe that their rightwing tendencies are an affront to Christ's teachings. Besides that, the fundies now seem to worship Paul instead of Christ Jesus. Born to a Southern Baptist belief and baptized within that church, I find myself questioning my own salvation now and it does disturb me plenty. Does a person need to go to church for salvation in the afterlife? I wonder but I certainly don't know. It concerns me deeply.

I should probably add that churches have changed significantly over the years. I recall a time in childhood long before fundamentalism and evangelicals and the moral majority were ever mentioned or created, which says alot coming from a Southern Baptist.

Churches, denominations, religious people, etc...are so different. I find it impossible to consider them a cookie cutter group. Although, some DUers seem to suggest it. I believe what I believe. I don't challenge anyone else's belief system. If someone sincerely wants to talk to me about my faith. We can have a conversation. I try really hard not to be judgmental, but I fail daily at that task. I go to church because I want to be around other people who believe the same thing I believe. I believe Jesus Christ died for my sins. I don't go to church to be saved. I recognize that there are others who believe differently. No problem. I learn a lot when I talk to other people about what they believe. I'm fascinated. As for politics in church, I also don't like to discuss politics in church. I prefer not to know the political persuasion of the pastor. I find it a complete turn off. I also don't like it when politicians come to church to "visit".

my personal point of view. It certainly doesn't have anything to do with feminine influence. I approve of female pastors and the feminine participation and leadership. I do get bored sometimes with drawn-out services, but the political preferences drive me away and make me feel justified in not being there at all. I think the subject of politics should be taboo in all churches. It's the most irreverant thing you could do. There is no telling how many thousands have left organized churches for this one reason. Maybe even millions. There is no way of knowing for certain.

Social justice issues, not so easy to remove from church. That's where the lead-in with politics can easily blur the line. I've heard it happen at more than one bible study group.

Also, sometimes the church becomes involved in politics not by its choice. A personal example is just a couple of years ago my church was dragged into the political circus. A member of my congregation (a liberal Democrat) was running against a conservative Republican from the Southern Baptist church across town for state representative. One day I received a robocall, stating that the congregation member from my church belonged to (and I quote) "a cult-like church that wants to give elementary kids condoms" and teach kids to "spit at vets". This was sponsored by a group closely tied in with the other candidate. The calls made the local and some regional news because of how vicious they were and how widespread. (Quite a few people I personally know received the calls.) There were reports of children whose parents wouldn't allow them to play with the kids from our church after the calls.

That's just an example of the dirt and filth of politics intruding into what is supposed to be a loving community of worshipers. Politics isn't anything nice. Everybody knows that.

But I do not abide any church of any denomination taking shots at Democrats, even in a light-hearted way. I would never think of doing that sort of thing toward a repub. If this trend continues, then maybe we need designated Democratic Presbyterian Churches and Republican Presbyterian Churches, etc.

I don't think that politics from either side should enter the church. Could we possibly see a designation someday? That wouldn't be surprising, though you could say there already is one right now. (Example: I'm a Methodist. If you're a conservative you'll quickly realize that a Reconciling Methodist church is not for you and if you're liberal you'll realize that some congregations in the same faith are not your cup of tea.)

Oh, and to end the story about the phone call? Guess who won? Yep, the guy supporting the calls. He won nearly 70% of the vote. When asked in polls one of the top reasons was because he "represented strong Christian values."

prior to the Civil War.

The Southern Baptists are one legacy of that era.

The post just made me think. I also wonder about drawn out services. I feel guilty. But, sometimes I find myself wondering...you know, I have to go work tomorrow. It would be good to have some time this Sunday afternoon to do something else. But, then I feel ungrateful. Definitely no politics in church. When politicians of any persuasion walk in right before an election and want to talk...it just makes me feel uneasy.

in which the husband is religious and the wife isn't.

It's impossible to generalize.

A grandmother had said to her that her son was not religious. She had prayed for all these years that her son would become more religious. Well, he had a conversion experience and became very religious. So religious that the visits from her son, his wife, and her grandchildren became a lot less frequent because her son's family got really involved in church and stopped coming to see her on a regular basis. This grandmother had went to the priest about this and the priest said that she got what she was asking for, for him to become more religious.

Boredom is not hatred.

It's all about "love" and stuff.

But nearly every story in the bible was of men, and women standing up for their rights, and fighting for them. Even Jesus fought for his beliefs. I hope that as people of God,we don't stop fighting for the rights of all people,animals, and our planet. And soon we will be discussing this in the sense of the universe and beyond.

...there is NASCAR on sunday. End NASCAR and maybe they will go to church.

I'm having a hard time going to church....for the exact opposite reason that the author claims men won't go to church. Very little has been said about helping others in the churches I 've been to. Yes plural. I keep searching and searching for some church that thinks about others. Nowadays it seems as if all the argument is about grace versus deeds. People have been led astray into thinking that grace is the only answer. As long as "being male" is seen as not having soup kitchens or other ways to help others, the "means" goes into the pocket of the minister. That is seen as being male because everyone must take care of themselves, according to the author of the article.

Christianity spread because it was a mystery religion that laid out the tenants out in the open. The true mystery was that God could love you and you alone as the acme of his creation. God, he/she/it does not need you buts wants your love, respect and devotion.
If so powerful an entity asks you only for that, then how hard can it be to treat our fellow Man?



Remember, there were two prominent trees in the garden...the second is not mentioned often: the tree of eternal life, which is the messiah.
He had his purpose, which was to deliver everyone.
Go forth and do you likewise, love one another, that they may know you are of The Way.

I was started a thread by this title on another website which was strictly right wing.

The pundits in it made over 300 posts. Almost none addressed the issue I started. When I pressed them on why they disregarded the issue it became only too clear that it was their admission that churches only want married men, women (both married & single), and children in their fold. Single men are not welcomed.

Small wonder why so many men avoid churches.