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Eugene

(61,910 posts)
Mon Nov 10, 2014, 02:36 PM Nov 2014

L’Aquila earthquake scientists win appeal

Source: The Guardian

L’Aquila earthquake scientists win appeal

John Hooper in Rome
The Guardian, Monday 10 November 2014 18.23 GMT

A court has upheld the appeals of six scientists and an official against their convictions for having given criminally negligent reassurances to the population of the city of L’Aquila before it was devastated by an earthquake five years ago.

But the judges endorsed a conviction and two-year sentence passed on one of the defendants, Bernardo De Bernardinis, on a connected charge.

The announcement of the verdicts was met with cries of “Disgrace” from members of the public in court.

The original verdicts had sparked worldwide condemnation as scientists protested that it was impossible for even the most experienced seismologists to forecast an earthquake. The seven men – members of an official major risks committee – each faced six-year jail sentences on charges of multiple manslaughter and negligence leading to grievous bodily harm. They had also been ordered to pay more than €9m (£7m) in damages to survivors of the disaster, which left 309 people dead.

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Read more: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/nov/10/laquila-earthquake-scientists-win-appeal-seismologists

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L’Aquila earthquake scientists win appeal (Original Post) Eugene Nov 2014 OP
Thinking earthquakes can be predicted, let alone SheilaT Nov 2014 #1
Or does not happen at all. longship Nov 2014 #3
Actually, in China in the mid-70's SheilaT Nov 2014 #4
so people who choose to live in an earthquake zone are surprised earthquakes occur nt msongs Nov 2014 #2
Yeah, I've noticed that also. SheilaT Nov 2014 #5
 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
1. Thinking earthquakes can be predicted, let alone
Mon Nov 10, 2014, 02:39 PM
Nov 2014

averted, is idiocy at its finest.

Sometimes, but only sometimes, animals act strange right before an earthquake strikes. And often the strange behavior is at best minutes before. Not days, certainly not weeks. And again, that behavior doesn't reliably happen.

longship

(40,416 posts)
3. Or does not happen at all.
Mon Nov 10, 2014, 03:00 PM
Nov 2014

The animals can predict earthquakes narrative is always and necessarily an anecdotal, post hoc rationalization, which means that it is scientifically worthless.

Earthquakes are not predictable by any science we currently have. So any study using animals must necessarily be post hoc.

Is there any prospective study at all which correlates animal behavior to earthquakes?

I think not.

I would gladly change my mind about this if such studies can be produced. I just do not believe they do, and certainly not prospective studies, meaning before the fact.

Just want to flesh out your post.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
4. Actually, in China in the mid-70's
Mon Nov 10, 2014, 03:45 PM
Nov 2014

they took the stories of animals as predictors very seriously, and set up a country-wide system to monitor such behavior. Supposedly one such major earthquake was predicted ahead of time (by a few hours I think), and lives were saved. But then some other major earthquake hit with no such animal predictions, and they abandoned that effort.

You are right, mostly it doesn't work at all. It is possible that looking back in the minutes right before an earthquake many animals behave oddly, but animals are often doing that, so there's just no consistency. Plus, even more to the point, it's not a decent ahead-of-time indicator.

The best scientists can do today, and probably the best they will ever be able to do, is give a particular probability estimate within a time frame, such as a 40% chance of a magnitude 6 or greater earthquake occurring along a particular fault within the next thirty years.

We all know that someday The Big One will happen on the west coast. But exactly when, and exactly where are the huge unknowns. Plus, as I understand it, new fault lines are discovered all the time.

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