2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumMaddow is out to lunch lately
On her show she is basically calling out Sanders saying he is not getting the voter turnout he says he needs to win. Her basic argument is that so far turnout in the primaries is lower than 08 and GOP is having higher turnout so far.
What she is not putting into context is
1) 08 was record year. Obama was once in a generation talent. You don't need to necessary replicate his turnout to consider it success
2) 08 was after 8 years of Bush / Iraq war. Dems were naturally more motivated
3) 08 had 3 credible candidates, while this year its only 2. More candidates = More voter turnouts
4) Primaries are going to be different from general, especially when there is going to be huge distinction between the two candidates. Imagine Bernie vs Trump, and how that is going to drive interest.
And most importantly, 08 resulted in massive Dem congressional advantage. If we can get even close to that, it will be the revolution Bernie is talking about. Hell even if Bernie revolution just results in White House win, that would be great considering this cycle should belong to the GOP.
CentralMass
(15,265 posts)Dem2
(8,168 posts)must be something going on there, amrite?
ScreamingMeemie
(68,918 posts)If one is going post glibness, it should be properly spelled.
And before you go all "pro-whomever-it-is-you're-supporting" I'm whatever with the two candidates.
Iggy Knorr
(247 posts)she wants to keep her job and stuff!
Uncle Joe
(58,366 posts)during his victory speech after New Hampshire and in last night's debate in Wisconsin.
You won't see Bernie criticizing the corporate media in snippets of last night's debate or the other occasions on television, those parts are always edited out but the corporate media has taken notice.
Bernie has plenty of good reason to do so, our media is dysfunctional and dominated by the almighty mega-dollar just as the government is, but I have no doubt the bosses in the ivory towers of the six corporate media conglomerates which control 90+ % of everything the 300 million American People see on television, hear on radio and read in printed publications have made their opinions known and even if they haven't the well paid pundits no matter the network knows who cuts their checks.
Nanjeanne
(4,961 posts)I crack myself up sometimes.
CentralMass
(15,265 posts)Jester Messiah
(4,711 posts)And who knows, maybe she's on board with them. We're in a Democratic Party civil war.
The River
(2,615 posts)She feeding at the corporate trough just like the rest of the shills.
Duckhunter935
(16,974 posts)Now highlighting one poll and saying how Bernie is not tied. I would rather see the BIG DNC story. But that might not look good for Hillary of DWS.
farleftlib
(2,125 posts)Putting things into historical context? Not just cherry picking the one thing that could diminish Sanders historic win in NH and making it the center of a biased agenda?
That's called journalism and you're doing it but highly-paid Rachel Maddow chooses not to. I wish we had peeps like you covering the primary season.
kristopher
(29,798 posts)In a very real sense she is reporting the results of her station's efforts.
bigwillq
(72,790 posts)Why do people still watch cable news? Just to complain? Turn it off. Problem solved.
Wilms
(26,795 posts)I turned it off and that didn't solve any problems I'm aware of.
bigwillq
(72,790 posts)Wilms
(26,795 posts)Rachel is well respected. And there have been a few post critically examining her program of late and raising reasonable questions.
That is actually a tremendous service we are afforded here on DU. Please try not to complain about it.
DirtyHippyBastard
(217 posts)Before the firing, you could tell she was pro-Sanders. After, she didn't mention his name unless she had to. I guess I can't blame her for wanting to keep her job, but I do.
Iggy Knorr
(247 posts)I'm sure she thinks she's doing the greater good but she never seemed bothered by the MIC after her embedded(?) press tour of Afghanistan.
Mike Nelson
(9,959 posts)...correct. Iowa and NH had record turnout - for the Republicans. Democratic turnout was down.
wildeyed
(11,243 posts)argument has been that only Sanders can turn the dems out and unify the base. Right? The yuuuuuge voter turnout!!11!!1 Which is not happening.
Wait, is Maddow under the bus now too? Cool. I always liked her. It's a partaaaay under here now
Response to wildeyed (Reply #15)
Name removed Message auto-removed
jillan
(39,451 posts)Infomercial the night before New Hampshire ? That Rachel?
left-of-center2012
(34,195 posts)MSNBC seems in the tank for HRC.
DefenseLawyer
(11,101 posts)Reported there was a poll showing the race tied but then, surprise! Turns out it's a totally unreliable poll by a republican pollster commissioned by a right wing website. Uh, okay. Why did you report on it at all?
kstewart33
(6,551 posts)Or should the media only report news that favors Bernie? Is that your idea of a fair media? How about if media reports all of the news, and (geez, I know this sound like the Fox news slogan) let the voters decide?
floppyboo
(2,461 posts)questions? And the claim of 2.9% accuracy? Something was very fishy. Inquiring minds need to know.
TTUBatfan2008
(3,623 posts)as far as Bernie goes is that MSNBC, CNN, and the rest of the media put a blackout on him pretty much all through 2015. A lot of people around the country are trying to get to know him. Almost all of the coverage has been for Trump and Hillary.
Logical
(22,457 posts)CentralMass
(15,265 posts)Logical
(22,457 posts)Skwmom
(12,685 posts)mythology
(9,527 posts)Rachel Maddow isn't being biased because you don't like what she's saying.
But yes Sanders does need to replicate Obama's success given that Obama didn't beat Clinton by much and in theory she and her team learned from that experience. So Sanders needs to be at or above the Obama level to beat Clinton. So far he's 1 for 2 in that regard, but he's also facing less favorable upcoming states. For whatever reason, Sanders has lagged in polling with minority groups. Given how important it was for Obama's ability to win the nomination, it does impact his ability to edge out Clinton.
We aren't going to get close to the majority in the House that we had in 2008. The House is substantially gerrymandered such that Democrats won a majority of the votes in House races in 2012 but only won 46% of the seats. By one estimate, Democratic candidates would have to win 55% of the vote to take the majority. That is exceedingly unlikely to happen.
kcjohn1
(751 posts)Her whole segment was just about Iowa/NH. We have yet to see other states, so its not fair to comment.
In terms of house. 08, Dems won 52% of total votes & 233 seats. 12, GOP won 52% of total votes & 244 seats. The whole point of Sanders revolution is to reach voters who typically say the two parties are the same. No matter who GOP put up, there will be clear and distinctive differences between the two. Obama was all about hope and change, and he was not specific about anything. Bernie is putting 1) Single Payer Health Care 2) $15 minimum wage 3) Free Tuition 4) Increase in SS payments, etc.
I don't see a scenario in which voters vote for Bernie and his "radical" ideas, and also vote for GOP congressman who is taking opposing view.
Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)AzDar
(14,023 posts)Arazi
(6,829 posts)One this current trajectory
Please read this thread .There's trouble ahead
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511210373
moondust
(19,993 posts)In her segment on "low turnout" she failed to mention that Bernie garnered the highest number of votes ever in New Hampshire primaries. Apparently someone else's voters didn't show up or something.
I'll pretend it was an oversight.
Bernblu
(441 posts)Bernie, if you include his 2000 Republican write in votes, received 38,000 more votes than anyone else in a New Hampshire primary ever! To say that he didn't bring out the vote is journalistic malpractice.
Gothmog
(145,321 posts)No one has seen any evidence of the so-called Sanders revolution https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/02/10/sorry-bernie-sanders-there-is-zero-evidence-of-your-political-revolution-yet/
To succeed, Sanders might have to drive Americans who don't normally participate to the polls. Unfortunately for him, groups who usually do not vote did not turn out in unusually large numbers in New Hampshire, according to exit polling data.
https://img.washingtonpost.com/wp-apps/imrs.php?src=&w=1484
...As for Sanders, he credited his victory to turnout. "Because of a huge voter turnout -- and I say huge -- we won," he said in his speech declaring victory, dropping the "h" in "huge." "We harnessed the energy, and the excitement that the Democratic party will need to succeed in November."
In fact, Sanders won by persuading many habitual Democratic primary voters to support him. With 95 percent of precincts reporting their results as of Wednesday morning, just 241,000 ballots had been cast in the Democratic primary, fewer than the 268,000 projected by New Hampshire Secretary of State William Gardner last week. Nearly 289,000 voters cast ballots in the state's Democratic primary in 2008.
To be sure, the general election is still seven months away. Ordinary Americans might be paying little attention to the campaign at this point, and if Sanders wins the nomination, he'll have the help of the Democratic Party apparatus in registering new voters. The political revolution hasn't started, though, at least not yet.
Without this revolution, I am not sure how Sanders proposes to advance his unrealistic agenda
kstewart33
(6,551 posts)Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)Being objective and not agreeing with DU Sanders supporters is not mutually exclusive. Sometimes both can be absolutely true FACT.