2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumBernie supporters do not support Trump.
Stop the implied racism Democratic Party. eom. You are talking about some frustrated independents only.
EdwardBernays
(3,343 posts)I mean I get what you're saying, but...
There's a LOT of Bernie supporters that WILL vote for Trump if Bernie doesn't get the nomination. I'm not sure how you've reached a conclusion about what a real supporter is, but.. I can tell you, and all the reporting and polls back me up, there's a significant number of people that will vote Sanders in a primary and then vote Trump in the GE if Hillary is the nominee.
If for no other reason than to say FU to the establishment.
And if Hillary gets the nod liberals won't have any good options... who knows what they'll do...
It could turn into a Trump landslide...
But the prospect of crossover voting between the parties still deserves attention, especially in the unique cases of Trump and Bernie Sanders, whose mutual appeal to many of the same voters has been well noted. Voters who were on the fence between the seemingly polar opposite candidates said both communicated well with working-class people and made strong cases for how they would improve the economy, The New York Times reported from Vermont last week, observing the odd phenomenon of voters who consider the two candidates quite comparable. In the words of one voter: Bernie is my No. 1 choice, and Trump is No. 2. Theyre not that different.
https://newrepublic.com/article/127442/explains-trump-sanders-crossover-vote
Donald Trump or Bernie Sanders? Some voters can't decide
http://edition.cnn.com/2016/02/08/politics/new-hampshire-primary-independent-voters/
Bernie Sanders: I can win the backing of Donald Trump supporters
Democratic presidential hopeful Bernie Sanders said Sunday that he believes he can boost his own standing in the race by swaying supporters of Republican frontrunner Donald Trump to back his campaign.
Sanders told CBSs Face the Nation that many of Trumps supporters have legitimate fears stemming from income inequality that Sanders is best positioned to address.
What Trump has done with some success is taken that anger, taken those fears, which are legitimate, and converted them into anger against Mexicans, anger against Muslims, Sanders said.
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/27/bernie-sanders-donald-trump-income-inequality
SO - If Bernie himself sees the connection you should consider to exist - unless you think Bernie doesn't know what he's talking about.
grossproffit
(5,591 posts)who knows what they'll do.
whatchamacallit
(15,558 posts)coyote
(1,561 posts)That they will support Bernie or Trump, but not Clinton or any other establishment candidate. The mood is the country is anti-establishment. Clinton cannot and will not win the GE.
PonyUp
(1,680 posts)would say yes.. me included
Codeine
(25,586 posts)Astounding that some people still haven't figured out the basic realities of a two-party system.
JonLeibowitz
(6,282 posts)For me, I would never let others' preferences choose who I vote for. That is all the two-party system is, a game of chicken where the masses determine who we vote for. I don't buy in.
Codeine
(25,586 posts)I live in this real and imperfect world.
morningfog
(18,115 posts)Codeine
(25,586 posts)But thanks for the fact-filled heads-up!
mmonk
(52,589 posts)It is not a progressive's path.
BainsBane
(53,035 posts)at least according to NH exit polls, where he did better among independents than Democrats. One state, of course, is not determinative.
EdwardBernays
(3,343 posts)that the majority of people that will vote for Trump are doing so for racist reasons...
That's a pretty big assumption...
A lot of them - in the same way a lot of Hillary supporters don't care about her being corrupt - don't care about Trump being a racist. They're voting for him for a lot of other reasons... like they despise the status quo... or they think he's honest whereas his opponents aren't.
I'm not saying those things are TRUE, but I am saying that that's what many people feel.
On top of that, look at all the polling, there's significant crossover appeal for both Sanders and Trump...
Plus assuming that all Sanders supporters are "progressive" is also a stretch. Many of them like what he's saying, but aren't livelong "progressives". Those people aren't guaranteed to just vote for a Dem if Bernie loses the race.
Zorra
(27,670 posts)There's thousands of Bernie supporters here.
Show us one, just one, who would vote for Trump.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Person here say she would vote for trump.....if Sanders gets the nomination.
EdwardBernays
(3,343 posts)Do you think all Bernie supporters are on DU?
That's an odd thing to think.
Zorra
(27,670 posts)There may be one or two Bernie supporters somewhere out in the world who would vote for Trump, but I've yet to meet one, and have not run across one on the internet.
It's a really, really odd thing to say that Bernie supporters would support Trump.
EdwardBernays
(3,343 posts)But the prospect of crossover voting between the parties still deserves attention, especially in the unique cases of Trump and Bernie Sanders, whose mutual appeal to many of the same voters has been well noted. Voters who were on the fence between the seemingly polar opposite candidates said both communicated well with working-class people and made strong cases for how they would improve the economy, The New York Times reported from Vermont last week, observing the odd phenomenon of voters who consider the two candidates quite comparable. In the words of one voter: Bernie is my No. 1 choice, and Trump is No. 2. Theyre not that different.
https://newrepublic.com/article/127442/explains-trump-sanders-crossover-vote
Donald Trump or Bernie Sanders? Some voters can't decide
http://edition.cnn.com/2016/02/08/politics/new-hampshire-primary-independent-voters/
Bernie Sanders: I can win the backing of Donald Trump supporters
Democratic presidential hopeful Bernie Sanders said Sunday that he believes he can boost his own standing in the race by swaying supporters of Republican frontrunner Donald Trump to back his campaign.
Sanders told CBSs Face the Nation that many of Trumps supporters have legitimate fears stemming from income inequality that Sanders is best positioned to address.
What Trump has done with some success is taken that anger, taken those fears, which are legitimate, and converted them into anger against Mexicans, anger against Muslims, Sanders said.
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/27/bernie-sanders-donald-trump-income-inequality
SO - If Bernie himself sees the connection you should consider to exist - unless you think Bernie doesn't know what he's talking about.
tularetom
(23,664 posts)If I weren't going to vote for him I wouldn't tell anybody that either.
I won't tell anybody who I intend to vote for. Ever.
My vote is my business.
I don't even tell my wife.
GreatGazoo
(3,937 posts)Red Knight
(704 posts)Trump is hoping to get the support of Reagan Democrats.
I kinda doubt that describes Bernie supporters.
I do think there's a possibility many Bernie supporters stay home if Hillary is the nominee--but I seriously doubt they would vote for Trump. It doesn't make any logical sense. Bernie supporters aren't "cult of personality" type supporters. They use "we" and "us" and support ideas.
Bernie wants single payer.
Trump wants to rip up the ACA and replace it with some sort of "buy across states" insurance scam.
Trump wants to "build a wall" I haven't heard Bernie say that one yet.
I haven't heard anything--really, that Trump wants that Bernie would support--and by extension--his supporters.
The only possible reason would be spite.
And his supporters care too much about these ideas to do that.
While staying home could be seen as a vote for Trump--it can also be seen as someone screaming as loudly as they can that they won't support business as usual within the party anymore. because make no mistake--Bernie supporters who vote for Hillary will be holding their nose and saying that they WILL accept "business as usual"--for now.
But they don't want it getting any worse.
I can't see them voting for Trump.
But I wouldn't tell you no single voter will do it. Everyone is different. I'm speaking to the movement as a whole--the majority of his supporters.
EdwardBernays
(3,343 posts)of voters in NH who were deciding between Trump and Bernie at the last minute.
In the words of one voter: Bernie is my No. 1 choice, and Trump is No. 2. Theyre not that different.
https://newrepublic.com/article/127442/explains-trump-sanders-crossover-vote
People seem to be viewing Sanders through their own prism and then trying to understand how someone that felt the way they do could possibly vote for Trump, but that's not the type of people we're talking about.
yourpaljoey
(2,166 posts)Seems many Independents are voting anti-establishment.
They will write-in Bernie, vote Trump... or stay home.
In a Trump vs Hill matchup... Trump wins.
blm
(113,065 posts)Unfortunately, it's from both sides. I have been cautioning people to show discernment, and, sometimes it falls on deaf ears. I expect it from newer posters, but, am generally shocked when I see it from long timers.
I think they don't realize how difficult it is for us purple state Dems working GOTV when we also have to fight the misperceptions nurtured in the primary.
Orsino
(37,428 posts)mmonk
(52,589 posts)We come from the left, not the right.
blm
(113,065 posts)I added to it based on my observations of what is going on here. On Trump, people aren't separating Independent Bernie supporters from Democratic Bernie Sanders supporters. implying there is no difference. To me that's using a broad brush. Something that is increasing here, and, from both sides.
LexVegas
(6,067 posts)Hmmm.
BainsBane
(53,035 posts)insisting he is to the left of Clinton.
mmonk
(52,589 posts)BainsBane
(53,035 posts)Seriously, but someone posted an OP claiming Trump would attack Hillary from the left in the general. I think it had to do with Iraq and TPP. But believing Trump on trade takes a complete suspension of logic. The guy makes millions from goods manufactured in China.
karynnj
(59,504 posts)I doubt he would challenge HRC from the left, as the majority of the left is completely disgusted with his racism and other problems. Not to mention., HRC being the nominee means she beat Bernie, who really is to the laft. This means even within the Democratic party, there is not enough mass to her left - so it could not be a good ploy in the general.
Not to mention, he was taped as being for war the month before the IWR vote. I do not think HRC said we should go to war.
EdwardBernays
(3,343 posts)but that's not related to what voters are using to base their votes on...
dirtydickcheney
(242 posts)I don't hear Hillary saying we should bring all those jobs lost to NAFTA, CAFTA, Korea, etc. back to the US.
If I did I might change my stance on her.
"Hey, I work 50 hours a week an live in a tent-by-the-river... but at least I think my president may not be a xenophobe!"
ladjf
(17,320 posts)he is a self-centered wild man, unsuitable to be President.
uponit7771
(90,347 posts)... that the establishment members have when they have to share power with the marginalized.