I think I will start by going to Jackpines site now.

over the hill at the big picture like the SCOTUS.

Most Bernie supporters don't see the deep corruption of the political system and the vast (and growing) economic inequality that has left tens of millions struggling to feed and house their families and provide even basic healthcare as 'petty'.

as what they are able to get done.

Caring about the court has become a red herring for you guys. If you don't want Trump nominating Roy Moore, you'd better support Bernie.

Will eventually be campaigning for Clinton.

If we do get there I'll probably hold my nose and join in. Or vote for a real progressive like Jill Stein

When will Clinton face that reality? Oh wait: I know I know! She will face it after everyone else has, because she is always the last to take the right position! (TPP, Gay rights, you name it)

to cover up the red.

She calls it "purple", I call it bullsh*t.

Because nothing is so inviting as arrogance, or an air of entitlement.

Too much yellow snow.

Except I'm not a Hillary supporter but carry on with your assumptions!
Will you be leaving too?
Let me know and I'll post this for you as well.

has written off Bernie supporters. Bill and what he did at those polling places, and what they have done to Bernie and his supporters throughout this campaign (calling Bernie racist, calling Bernie sexist, sending out David Brock to say that Bernie doesn't care about people of color, calling us "BernieBros&quot .

And all of the cheating. In my state of Iowa alone, their behavior was so egregious and horrifying. Hillary Clinton doesn't care about who she offends, what she wrecks or the destruction that she causes. As far as the Iowa Caucuses go, Hillary was a narcissistic tornado that came in, blew everything down and left with her micro-win. How could she ever think that Bernie supporters in Iowa wouldn't have an opinion about that?

I don't think they give a flying fuck about us. In fact, their behavior and the behavior of her supporters clearly shows that they're going to try to win the nomination without us.

I've come to the conclusion that this is a fairly sound idea.

there if Hillary wins the nomination. Hillary supporters on DU most likely will be trying to goad us into saying something that will get us banned here.

Up and downticket.

To a fair amount of (hypothetical because I don't want to get banned) progressives, Hillary is no more of a progressive then Kaisch or Rubio. Why would she deserve a progressive vote just to fight 'the man'?

In the Senate Clinton and Sanders voted the same 93% of the time. Clinton was rated the 11th most liberal Senator when she was in the Senate.

Rubio is currently rated the 94th most liberal Senator by DW-Nominate scores. I'm pretty sure 11 is a significantly different number than 94.

You aren't just wrong when you say that Clinton is no more liberal or progressive than Rubio. You're really really wrong.

they voted the same most of the time. They were both in the Democratic Caucus. Duh. However, when they differed the issues on which they differed were quite major, like the War in Iraq. Neocons were for that war. PNAC was for that war. Marshall, who founded the Progressive Policy Institute and was, as was Hillary, a co founder of the DLC, signed the PNAC letter. Besides, Hillary did not merely vote for the war, she advocated for it on national TV.

Hillary didn't sign any PNAC letters/statements.

(Sorry if you were kidding. I'm tired and my joke detectors are put away for the night.)

I was just talking about this earlier today. Hillary supporters and the media *which wants to help her look liberal* refer to her stats constantly. But it comes undone when you realize some votes carry more weight than others.

seeks to enhance and exploit it. This is every bit as important to me as ANY other issue. She seeks to enhance the influence of a group who is opposed to what is best for me. Supporting her for President is every bit as distasteful to me as supporting a racist, misogynist, or a homophobe. Supporting her is akin to my giving tacit approval to America's slow decent into fascism. No, these candidates are vastly different despite a voting record that might suggest something to the contrary.

please do yourself a favor and educate yourself:

http://ontheissues.org/Marco_Rubio.htm

http://ontheissues.org/John_Kasich.htm

http://ontheissues.org/Hillary_Clinton.htm

I grieve for such days here on DU... To be a United Front against the GOP.

inside our own party.

Or maybe just share cool vids...

Oh wait- They don't have the technology

I'm almost done here to, I suspect.

Home page http://jackpineradicals.org/content.php

I will check it out and likely head over there.

DUers. It's a nice place.

Bernie, Hillary,politics or anything else interesting as long as it's not calling out Duers or DU.

And linking to posts there in my posts here. It's all good.

thanks for this heads-up.

I'll have to check it out!

Criticism of Hillary will have to be lighter than in primary, however.

'cause TOS, quoted in Reply 7.

Those who oppose Hillary but wish to keep posting at DU should watch out for baiting. Lists of opposers have been made and peopole are just waiting for her to win the primary before they start baiting, including the ever popular demand to know who you will be voting for. Take the bait at your own risk.

There is no reason whatsoever that I would read or post here after the Convention if Hillary is the nominee.

I meant I would not be here for somebody to bait me.

As Susan Sarandan's character says about several subjects in Bull Durham, "You can look it up."

Also excluded many demographics from their policies.

That was Jim Crow state laws.

Tactics like that post.

P.S. It was Truman, very much a New Deal Democrat, who appointed a Civil Rights Commission and integrated the military.

You can always go start your own message board with different rules.

agreed to the current terms. Just did not like the attitude of the comment. If CLinton gets the nomination I will be leaving except to come back and gloat when she loses to Trump. Which she will. She can not win the general election. America hates her.

Here are some other "red states" she is on pace to win:



HRC is + 29 in Florida:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/fl/florida_democratic_presidential_primary-3556.html

HRC is +21 in New York:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/ny/new_york_democratic_presidential_primary-4221.html

HRC is + 19 in Pennsylvania:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/pa/pennsylvania_democratic_presidential_primary-4249.html

HRCis + 21 in Ohio:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/oh/ohio_democratic_presidential_primary-5313.html

HRC is + 19 in Illinois:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/oh/ohio_democratic_presidential_primary-5313.html


HRC is + 19 in North Carolina:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/nc/north_carolina_democratic_presidential_primary-5175.html


HRC is +14 in California:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/ca/california_democratic_presidential_primary-5321.html

HRC is +19 In Michigan:


http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/mi/michigan_democratic_presidential_primary-5224.html

it is sad that so many support RW ideas

If you don't like the Democratic Party then fuck off.

Not rocket science.

or candidate, since votes are private. the main point of that clause is to not come here and trash dem candidates in non primary races, or to advocate for alternative candidates.

our votes have been, and will be at least for the short term, our own.

i plan to focus on the downticket races and discuss non presidential race matters. house and senate will be hugely important. will the format of du change? like will gdp be broken into "presidential election" and " house and senate seats"? i really can't remember from previous years

but it would be good to have a forum just focused on congressional races

GD: P, despite its name, is restricted to posts about the Democratic presidential primaries. Posts about the downticket races (which are indeed hugely important) go in GD.

It would be logical that, after the Democratic National Convention, General Discussion: Primaries would be changed to General Discussion: Presidential. Like you, though, I can't remember if that was how the admins did it in, for example, 2008.

are certainly going to depend on who gets the nom. i may end up spending a lot of time in gd....also, do you know if the protected groups will stay? (bernie group, hillary group etc)

We still have a Dennis Kucinich Group, and it's still protected per its SoP: "Comments by individuals who do not support Congressman Kucinich are not welcome."

I expect that, regardless of the outcome of this year's nomination and election fights, both Clinton and Sanders will continue to be in the public eye. It would be logical for their supporters to continue to have a safe haven, even if, like that for Kucinich, it doesn't get much traffic.

There is an easy solution to that dilemma.

But, I hope not to have to take shelter of a third way purge cycle. The primary season is still young.

I read it on the Internets.

"Senator McCain and I are ready for that 3 am phone call. Senator Obama is not."

Vote for Democrats.
Winning elections is important — therefore, advocating in favor of Republican nominees or in favor of third-party spoiler candidates that could split the vote and throw an election to our conservative opponents is never permitted on Democratic Underground. But that does not mean that DU members are required to always be completely supportive of Democrats. During the ups-and-downs of politics and policy-making, it is perfectly normal to have mixed feelings about the Democratic officials we worked hard to help elect. When we are not in the heat of election season, members are permitted to post strong criticism or disappointment with our Democratic elected officials, or to express ambivalence about voting for them. In Democratic primaries, members may support whomever they choose. But when general election season begins, DU members must support Democratic nominees (EXCEPT in rare cases where a non-Democrat is most likely to defeat the conservative alternative, or where there is no possibility of splitting the liberal vote and inadvertently throwing the election to the conservative alternative). For presidential contests, election season begins when both major-party nominees become clear. For non-presidential contests, election season begins on Labor Day. Everyone here on DU needs to work together to elect more Democrats and fewer Republicans to all levels of American government. If you are bashing, trashing, undermining, or depressing turnout for our candidates during election season, we'll assume you are rooting for the other side.

all they can do is enforce the rule that one not come here and advocate for alternative candidates.

votes belong to the voter. its that simple.