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21st Century Poet

(254 posts)
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 02:49 PM Mar 2016

Does Bernie Sanders have a realistic path to victory?

Yesterday's three wins were impressive and to see a previously virtually unknown candidate come this far is truly impressive. Nonetheless, no matter how many states or by how big a margin Mr Sanders wins, the general consensus in the media seems to be that he can never catch up with Mrs Clinton.

Can anyone explain if this is true using the delegate math (not bias or personal feelings)?

I thank you beforehand for taking the time to answer my question and explain this issue.

34 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Does Bernie Sanders have a realistic path to victory? (Original Post) 21st Century Poet Mar 2016 OP
Try subtracting super delegates from the count the MSM is using. It's not only doable it's probable. onecaliberal Mar 2016 #1
It is doable but hardly probable MadBadger Mar 2016 #6
Perhaps you should STOP listening to the media and do a little math while you're looking at what's onecaliberal Mar 2016 #8
I'm not listening to the media, I'm looking at the schedule MadBadger Mar 2016 #10
Time will tell? California is the biggest prize of all in June. onecaliberal Mar 2016 #11
She doesnt need everybody (just most) to change. And anybody who doesnt knows where the door is MadBadger Mar 2016 #12
Thanks for proving your OP is full of it. I thought so, but you were way too easy onecaliberal Mar 2016 #13
I am a democrat and will support the democratic nominee. What about you? MadBadger Mar 2016 #16
Try this Perogie Mar 2016 #2
Thanks for the link MadBadger Mar 2016 #15
Thank you for that link. 21st Century Poet Mar 2016 #17
The problem with your question is swilton Mar 2016 #3
Of course he can. Dozens of superdelegates switched from Clinton to Obama Liberty Belle Mar 2016 #4
The Hillary bird is a vulture capitalist / FlatBaroque Mar 2016 #7
If you're going to argue based on the "popular vote"... CalvinballPro Mar 2016 #22
Actually I think if he won either the popular vote or the most pledged delgates awarded by voters, Liberty Belle Mar 2016 #24
No. States containing 25% of the U.S. Population vote in the next three weeks. onehandle Mar 2016 #5
Yes. It's called "votes". cherokeeprogressive Mar 2016 #9
It's statistically unlikely, but it's still possible. gollygee Mar 2016 #14
Yes, but it won't be easy nadinbrzezinski Mar 2016 #18
Bernie has to win out by an average of 57.3% to win a majority of the pledged delegates DrDan Mar 2016 #19
Thank you. 21st Century Poet Mar 2016 #20
That depends ibegurpard Mar 2016 #21
In order for Sanders to win he needs to win the large population hrmjustin Mar 2016 #23
he has a severely improbable one. geek tragedy Mar 2016 #25
"and then win 75% of the vote in California" Cali_Democrat Mar 2016 #33
Bernie needs 56.5% of remaining pledged delegates to win a majority. jg10003 Mar 2016 #26
there is no way in hell that the superdelegates would help Sanders steal the nomination geek tragedy Mar 2016 #27
If after Trump is nominated and before the Dem convention starts.... jg10003 Mar 2016 #28
No, if Clinton has a majority of pledged delegates, Sanders will formally endorse her. geek tragedy Mar 2016 #29
I remember a lot of anger about superdelegates here a few weeks ago. athena Mar 2016 #34
Realistic? No. Garrett78 Mar 2016 #30
Depends on what you mean by "realistic" Recursion Mar 2016 #31
the general consensus from the M$M that are all in for Hillary. What do you think they're litlbilly Mar 2016 #32

onecaliberal

(32,895 posts)
8. Perhaps you should STOP listening to the media and do a little math while you're looking at what's
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 03:36 PM
Mar 2016

Ahead.

MadBadger

(24,089 posts)
10. I'm not listening to the media, I'm looking at the schedule
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 03:39 PM
Mar 2016

And the schedule tells me Wisconsin is a tossup, Bernie wins Wyoming by similar margins as Idaho, Utah.

He then loses New York, Connecticut, Delaware, Pennsylvania, and Maryland, and possibly Rhode Island.

onecaliberal

(32,895 posts)
11. Time will tell? California is the biggest prize of all in June.
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 03:44 PM
Mar 2016

You're entitled to your opinion and I'm entitled to my vote. If you think everyone will change from Bernie to her. Good luck with that. She will NEVER be POTUS because 67% of the country think she's a liar. Those #'s don't elect presidents.

MadBadger

(24,089 posts)
12. She doesnt need everybody (just most) to change. And anybody who doesnt knows where the door is
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 03:45 PM
Mar 2016

Same for those who don't support him if he wins.

 

swilton

(5,069 posts)
3. The problem with your question is
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 02:53 PM
Mar 2016

the embedded assumption that 'truth' will come from the mainstream media general consensus....

You can wait for general consensus in the mainstream media to recognize that Sanders has a chance until hell freezes over and it will never happen.

Liberty Belle

(9,535 posts)
4. Of course he can. Dozens of superdelegates switched from Clinton to Obama
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 02:54 PM
Mar 2016

in 2008 after he won the popular vote.

Bernie can do the same if his momentum continues, such as winning California by a large margin and some other states. He is only behind by around 250 delegates or so if you discount the superdelegates.

No wonder Hillary is ducking a debate in New York. Bernie has his sparrow, Trump his eagle, and Hillary has shown what her "bird" symbol must be:

 

CalvinballPro

(1,019 posts)
22. If you're going to argue based on the "popular vote"...
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 07:17 PM
Mar 2016

...are you prepared to acknowledge that Sanders is over 2 million votes behind, and that victories in small caucus states don't positively affect the popular vote total for him?

Liberty Belle

(9,535 posts)
24. Actually I think if he won either the popular vote or the most pledged delgates awarded by voters,
Tue Mar 29, 2016, 11:25 PM
Mar 2016

The Superdelegates should switch.

I also agree that if Clinton holds onto leads in those categories, the Superdelegates should support her.

At least this should be the case in each superdelegate's specific state, reflecting the will of the voters, not themselves.

onehandle

(51,122 posts)
5. No. States containing 25% of the U.S. Population vote in the next three weeks.
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 03:04 PM
Mar 2016

Most of which are closed Democratic primaries that Hillary leads up to 30% or more.

No path.

gollygee

(22,336 posts)
14. It's statistically unlikely, but it's still possible.
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 03:48 PM
Mar 2016

Weirder things have happened. He has momentum. We'll know before too much longer.

DrDan

(20,411 posts)
19. Bernie has to win out by an average of 57.3% to win a majority of the pledged delegates
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 05:11 PM
Mar 2016

any state below that raises that target - any state he wins by more than that lowers his target.

So that means he has to average winning by a minimum of 14.6 points per state as of now.

When the committed supers are figured in, that grows to 67.3% - or average winning by over 34 points!

A real mountain to climb.

ibegurpard

(16,685 posts)
21. That depends
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 07:15 PM
Mar 2016

On how many people he is able to get to the polls and whether opinion polls are accurately reflecting actual voter sentiment. In other words...it's not math.

 

hrmjustin

(71,265 posts)
23. In order for Sanders to win he needs to win the large population
Sun Mar 27, 2016, 07:18 PM
Mar 2016

states and by solid margins.


He is not going to carry NY.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
25. he has a severely improbable one.
Tue Mar 29, 2016, 11:28 PM
Mar 2016

He needs to fight her to a deadlock in all of the following states:

New York (closed primary)
Pennsylvania (closed primary)
Maryland (closed primary)
Delaware (closed primary)
Connecticut (closed primary)
New Jersey (closed primary)
New Mexico (closed primary)
Kentucky (closed primary)

and then win 75% of the vote in California.

jg10003

(976 posts)
26. Bernie needs 56.5% of remaining pledged delegates to win a majority.
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 12:04 AM
Mar 2016

Although a simple majority of pledged delegates will not clinch the nomination, it will make it very difficult for the super-delegates to deny him the nomination.

Path # 2:
Currently Bernie has won 45% of the pledged delegates. If he maintains this rate he will not win a majority but he will prevent Clinton from reaching the 2383 pledged delegates necessary for clinching the nomination without super-delegates.

The super-delegates are politicians, their first and overriding concern is winning. The GOP has its convention first. If after the GOP convention the polls show that Bernie is a significantly stronger candidate against the GOP nominee then is Hillary (as most polls now indicate), The super-delegates may decide to go with the best candidate.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
27. there is no way in hell that the superdelegates would help Sanders steal the nomination
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 12:07 AM
Mar 2016

per Path #2.

If Clinton wins a majority of pledged delegates, that's the end of the conversation. Superdelegates won't even return Tad Devine's calls.

If Sanders wins a majority of pledged delegates, you would see a bunch cross over to him.

jg10003

(976 posts)
28. If after Trump is nominated and before the Dem convention starts....
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 12:31 AM
Mar 2016

polls show Hillary with a 5 point lead over Trump and Sanders with a 15 point lead (along with being the only candidate whose favorability rating is over 50%).

The primaries will be ancient history by then. Politicians are loyal when its convenient, and fairness doesn't win elections. And since winning is the only thing that matters, super-delegates would likely place their bet on the horse with the best odds.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
29. No, if Clinton has a majority of pledged delegates, Sanders will formally endorse her.
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 12:34 AM
Mar 2016

The superdelegates are not going to steal the nomination for a guy to whom they owe absolutely nothing, who isn't even a Democrat.

athena

(4,187 posts)
34. I remember a lot of anger about superdelegates here a few weeks ago.
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:00 AM
Mar 2016

So superdelegates are unacceptable if they go for Clinton but acceptable if they go for Bernie?

Do Bernie supporters not realize how biased they are, and how obvious this is to anyone who is not similarly biased?

Garrett78

(10,721 posts)
30. Realistic? No.
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 01:42 AM
Mar 2016

Clinton does much better in large, diverse states. And in closed primaries. Unless those patterns suddenly get flipped upside down, Sanders has no chance.

A month from now, I expect Clinton to lead by about 350 pledged delegates. The final pledged delegate count will likely be in the ballpark of 2200-1850.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
31. Depends on what you mean by "realistic"
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 02:12 AM
Mar 2016

He needs to win the second half of the primary season by roughly as much as Clinton won the first half of the primary season (WA/AK/HI was the start of the second half, delegate-wise). That will take posting the kinds of wins he got in WA in states like WV, KY, and IN, and slogging to narrow victories in places like NY and PA.

So, yes, that's "realistic" for some value of the term, but it's a long shot.

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