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Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 04:41 PM Apr 2016

My proposal to resolve voter suppression/disputable results issues so far:

Revotes in Nevada, Arizona, Iowa and Massachusetts.

Do all of them as "preference polls" rather than caucuses, with mail-in voting starting one month in advance.

Could we all live with that?

27 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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My proposal to resolve voter suppression/disputable results issues so far: (Original Post) Ken Burch Apr 2016 OP
Are you suggesting a do-over this year? SheilaT Apr 2016 #1
There was no voter suppression in Nevada, Hillary's delagates not showing up is on them. Autumn Apr 2016 #2
Ok...in that case we could say "voter suppression OR disputable results". Ken Burch Apr 2016 #3
Thank you. To call what happened in Nevada voter suppression demeans actual Autumn Apr 2016 #4
Good point. My intent was simply to deal with egregious result situations. Ken Burch Apr 2016 #5
You mean results that you dislike Gothmog Apr 2016 #11
If it was just results I dislike, I would not have included Nevada. Ken Burch Apr 2016 #18
We will see how Nevada tiurns out Gothmog Apr 2016 #24
True, but what happened on Saturday was bad. n/t. Ken Burch Apr 2016 #25
We will see after state convention and after national credentials committee review Gothmog Apr 2016 #27
State: Bill Clinton Didn’t Break Election Law on Super Tuesday Gothmog Apr 2016 #10
I'm not relying on anything, you must be confused. I said there was no voter suppression in Nevada Autumn Apr 2016 #13
I hope that the Sanders supporter who filed that pro se lawsuit is not in law school Gothmog Apr 2016 #15
I have no idea what you are talking about. I responded to the OP earlier and there was Autumn Apr 2016 #17
so do over three states Bernie lost. Convenient, that. geek tragedy Apr 2016 #6
Those happen to be the four states in which a revote would be most appropriate Ken Burch Apr 2016 #7
do overs are not appropriate absent clear evidence that corruption or other illegal geek tragedy Apr 2016 #8
Re-votes are almost never ordered in election contests Gothmog Apr 2016 #12
For good reason. geek tragedy Apr 2016 #14
Under election law case, revotes are almost never ever ordered Gothmog Apr 2016 #9
How interesting...all States that Sanders lost. brooklynite Apr 2016 #16
Nevada is a state where irregularities worked in Sanders' favor on Saturday. Ken Burch Apr 2016 #20
Except that Sanders will probably win Nevada now. reformist2 Apr 2016 #23
Lol, so revote in every state that Sanders lost, eh? Tarc Apr 2016 #19
I am not an official spokesman for the Sanders campaign. Ken Burch Apr 2016 #21
Come on! Really? wildeyed Apr 2016 #22
Just re-run the primaries with people overseeing it Rosa Luxemburg Apr 2016 #26
 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
1. Are you suggesting a do-over this year?
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 04:45 PM
Apr 2016

While that might be a good idea for Nevada, Arizona, and Massachusetts, Iowa will never go along with that as they are absolutely determined to be the first in the nation caucus, and it's hard to imagine them giving up their sacred caucus system any time in the next thousand years or so.

Similarly, New Hampshire is it engraved in stone somewhere that they get to be the first in the nation primary, and they're not about to give that up.

And for what my opinion is worth, I don't think a nationwide primary is a good idea at all. The nice thing about this current system is that people get to see the candidates and make decisions and change their mind as the season proceeds.

Autumn

(45,120 posts)
2. There was no voter suppression in Nevada, Hillary's delagates not showing up is on them.
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 04:47 PM
Apr 2016

They weren't kept away.

 

Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
3. Ok...in that case we could say "voter suppression OR disputable results".
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 04:58 PM
Apr 2016

Will amend OP to reflect that idea.

Autumn

(45,120 posts)
4. Thank you. To call what happened in Nevada voter suppression demeans actual
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 05:03 PM
Apr 2016

voter suppression which is a real and very serious problem.

 

Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
5. Good point. My intent was simply to deal with egregious result situations.
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 05:04 PM
Apr 2016

Each of the states I listed had those.

Gothmog

(145,450 posts)
11. You mean results that you dislike
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 08:10 PM
Apr 2016

Revotes are expensive and will not be ordered in the cases you listed. The pro se idiot who filed the Mass. lawsuit against Bill Clinton is going to find out that federal judges are not known for tolerating silly people trying to use the federal courts for bogus claims

 

Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
18. If it was just results I dislike, I would not have included Nevada.
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 09:45 PM
Apr 2016

which was an unjust result(in the second round)that happened to benefit the candidate I support.

Gothmog

(145,450 posts)
27. We will see after state convention and after national credentials committee review
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 12:09 PM
Apr 2016

You do know that there is a credentials committee at the national convention who gets to review this.

Gothmog

(145,450 posts)
10. State: Bill Clinton Didn’t Break Election Law on Super Tuesday
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 08:08 PM
Apr 2016

Why Mass? I hope that you are not relying on that silly lawsuit, The idiot bernie bros could not find a lawyer to files that silly lawsuitt in federal court. No attorney wanted to be sanctioned. Federal judges are not known for tolerating stupidity. Here are some facts that will guarantee that the lawyer filing this case will be sanctioned http://www.bostonmagazine.com/news/blog/2016/03/04/bill-clinton-massachusetts-election-law/

State officials do not believe former President Bill Clinton violated election law while visiting polling locations in West Roxbury and New Bedford on Super Tuesday.

After greeting voters and poll workers, Clinton posed with Mayor Marty Walsh and a man holding a Democratic ballot inside the Holy Name gymnasium in West Roxbury in a photograph first obtained by Boston magazine. Clinton later appeared outside a polling location in New Bedford with Mayor Jon Mitchell and used a megaphone to stump for his wife, Democratic frontrunner Hillary Clinton.

Though a representative for Sen. Bernie Sanders’ campaign told Boston he received a dozen complaints that Clinton’s speech blocked voters from reaching the polling place, Brian McNiff of Secretary Bill Galvin’s office said the polls were “never inaccessible.”

Massachusetts election law prohibits any person from distributing “campaign material intended to influence the vote of a voter in the ongoing election” within 150 of a polling location. In addition, “no person shall solicit votes for or against, or otherwise promote or oppose, any person or political party or position on a ballot question, to be voted on at the current election,” the law reads.

McNiff told the New Bedford Standard-Times via email Thursday “there was no violation,” despite Clinton and Mitchell standing, by the paper’s estimate, 85 feet from the polling place. “The Secretary of State has already said it’s not looking into the matter any further. That office has made its decision,” Mitchell told the Standard-Times.

There was no voter suppression in Mass

Autumn

(45,120 posts)
13. I'm not relying on anything, you must be confused. I said there was no voter suppression in Nevada
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 08:12 PM
Apr 2016

and there wasn't.

Gothmog

(145,450 posts)
15. I hope that the Sanders supporter who filed that pro se lawsuit is not in law school
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 08:47 PM
Apr 2016

The petition was horrible and if a law student drafted that petition, then they will soon flunk out of law school. If the pro se idiot who filed that law suit is in law school and does not flunk out, being sanctioned by a federal judge will keep her from taking the bar in most jurisdictions

Autumn

(45,120 posts)
17. I have no idea what you are talking about. I responded to the OP earlier and there was
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 08:50 PM
Apr 2016

nothing in it about a lawsuit.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
6. so do over three states Bernie lost. Convenient, that.
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 05:10 PM
Apr 2016

Also, the end of the campaign is two months. Primaries can't be thrown together in one month.

 

Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
7. Those happen to be the four states in which a revote would be most appropriate
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 05:42 PM
Apr 2016

It most likely wouldn't change the results in AZ(though they might be somewhat closer).

For all we know, HRC might do BETTER in those states in a revote.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
8. do overs are not appropriate absent clear evidence that corruption or other illegal
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 05:53 PM
Apr 2016

activity materially affected the outcome.

there's no time left for do overs. primaries take months and months to plan.

not only that, but doing an election over means voiding every single vote that was cast.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
14. For good reason.
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 08:14 PM
Apr 2016

This is like the Republicans who want to put an asterisk by Obama's name in the history books. If they can't win they try to delegitimize.

Gothmog

(145,450 posts)
9. Under election law case, revotes are almost never ever ordered
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 08:04 PM
Apr 2016

The ordering of a revote is a very rare remedy that will not happen in this case. I volunteer in voter protection efforts and have worked with the Texas Democratic Party on vote id issues. I have been following the Texas voter id case very closely and that case would not give you much hope for this remedy. The DOJ sued Texas on the voter id law. Even though 7 federal judges have ruled against the Texas voter id law, we were stuck with in during the March 1 Texas primary. The DOJ and the Texas Party tried to get the 5th circuit to rule on this law before the primary but the court ignored their filings. See http://moritzlaw.osu.edu/electionlaw/litigation/documents/SupplementalAuthoritiesFiledbyAppelleesMsImaniClarkandTexasLeagueofYoungVotersEducationFund1.pdf

Right now, the DOJ and the private plaintiffs are asking the SCOTUS to lift the stay of the 5th Cir See
http://moritzlaw.osu.edu/electionlaw/litigation/documents/Veasey-ApplicationToVacateStay03252016.pdf In addition to the DOJ, one of the lead plaintiff attorneys, Chad Dunn, also happens to be the Texas Democratic Party outside counsel (Chad is representing Congressman Marc Veasey in this case)

It is not that easy to fight voter suppression. The remedy of a revote is not going to happen

brooklynite

(94,667 posts)
16. How interesting...all States that Sanders lost.
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 08:48 PM
Apr 2016

But if you'd like to convince me, tell me which of those results Bernie Sanders has challenged.

 

Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
20. Nevada is a state where irregularities worked in Sanders' favor on Saturday.
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 09:49 PM
Apr 2016

My candidate may have benefited from misinformation(for which our campaign was clearly blameless) which seems to have reduced turnout among HRC supporters.

Tarc

(10,476 posts)
19. Lol, so revote in every state that Sanders lost, eh?
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 09:48 PM
Apr 2016

Riddle me this; why has there not been an official challenge by the Sanders camp in any of these states? So far it's just twitter and blogger hysteria.

If Sanders generally feels he was shafted in a stat election, ten let him step up and file accordingly.

 

Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
21. I am not an official spokesman for the Sanders campaign.
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 10:30 PM
Apr 2016

And I mentioned Nevada BECAUSE this weekend their were irregularities that worked in Sanders' favor. Nevada and the other three states are the only primary results about which any degree on controversy exist.. All Sanders victories are indisputable and won fair and square...we know this because every state in which Bernie prevailed was a state in which the party leadership was at best neutral(in Vermont, Howard Dean has a bit more power within the state Dems than Bernie)and in general strongly anti-Sanders.

wildeyed

(11,243 posts)
22. Come on! Really?
Sun Apr 3, 2016, 10:35 PM
Apr 2016


No, they don't do mulligans in politics without some really compelling evidence of fraud. And sure as shit not going to change the entire structure of the primary to suit you and/or your candidate.

I also think your guy does worse now than he did at the beginning. He has less momentum and everyone who isn't a true believer is bored and ready to move on to the GE.
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