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Bubzer

(4,211 posts)
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 10:21 AM Apr 2016

The Democrats Are Flawlessly Executing a 10-Point Plan to Lose the 2016 Presidential Election

1. Assume that Donald Trump will be the Republicans’ 2016 nominee, though it’s now clear he won’t be.
2. Nominate the only person who can reunite the Republican Party once Trump failing to get the nomination has fractured it beyond repair.
3. Fracture the Democratic Party by broadly supporting the Clinton camp’s attempts to smear Bernie Sanders and his supporters.
4. Fatally underestimate the electoral chances of the two men now most likely to be the Republican presidential nominee in November: Ted Cruz and John Kasich.
5. Fail to nominate their most popular candidate, in particular the one with the best chance of beating Ted Cruz or John Kasich in the fall.
6. Freeze one of the most popular Democrats nationally, Bernie Sanders, out of the picture altogether.
7. Reject Sanders’ call for a fifty-state general-election campaign.
8. Do nothing whatsoever to address outstanding concerns about the character, integrity, and judgment of the Party’s front-runner.
9. Over-rely on the national media to set the political narrative for the campaign season, further alienating voters who want to vote for a candidate with vision.
10. Ignore the youth vote.

Argument for each point at the link:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/seth-abramson/the-democrats-10-point-plan-lose-election_b_9605608.html
56 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The Democrats Are Flawlessly Executing a 10-Point Plan to Lose the 2016 Presidential Election (Original Post) Bubzer Apr 2016 OP
Almost seems deliberate... dchill Apr 2016 #1
Yeahup..... daleanime Apr 2016 #27
Self defeating anyway for Hillary Clinton. PufPuf23 Apr 2016 #39
exactly--her attempts to knock down the other candidate get people writing and knocking on doors MisterP Apr 2016 #47
Investors in the 'Establishment' hedge their bets and support a candidate on both sides during the sorechasm Apr 2016 #49
DLC are ENRICHED pawns. dchill Apr 2016 #51
Scorched earth to win one battle, without regard for the war. JackRiddler Apr 2016 #50
Mmmm, fresh kool-aid! CalvinballPro Apr 2016 #2
all gone! Team Hillary drank it all. virtualobserver Apr 2016 #3
The democrats can be pretty shortsighted, it is true. PatrickforO Apr 2016 #4
Most of the party apparatus is about soliciting donations... DemocracyDirect Apr 2016 #9
The thing that is truly monstrous about your post is that it is true. PatrickforO Apr 2016 #11
I'm sorry. DemocracyDirect Apr 2016 #25
I hear that.... daleanime Apr 2016 #30
Thanks. Very thoughtful eom PufPuf23 Apr 2016 #41
I chuckled at the OP's definition of the Democrats most popular candidate. Trust Buster Apr 2016 #5
Of course you did. All while ignoring her unfavorability numbers and cheating tactics to get votes. Bubzer Apr 2016 #10
Popular outside the primaries...you know, like would be the case in jeff47 Apr 2016 #21
That's not what the OP said. Trust Buster Apr 2016 #22
Actually, it is exactly what the OP said jeff47 Apr 2016 #23
and supporting a candidate under investigation by the FBI n/t Merryland Apr 2016 #6
You don't understand 3D chess Capt. Obvious Apr 2016 #7
2nd time Seth has done that to me Jarqui Apr 2016 #8
Ha! CrowCityDem Apr 2016 #12
General Elections and primarys are completely different. Bubzer Apr 2016 #13
LOL! Proud Liberal Dem Apr 2016 #14
I really don't expect that trump will be the republican nominee ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #17
I was under the impression that he is leading in delegates? Proud Liberal Dem Apr 2016 #43
Yes. He is winning; but, does not have the 50+% to make him the nominee. 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #48
Ah....I see Proud Liberal Dem Apr 2016 #53
In my G/E fantasy ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #54
That is an unorthodox way to measure most popular in #5. LonePirate Apr 2016 #15
Do you really believe what you just wrote? ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #16
Here's the thing... Hillary supporters go on and on and on about how she's been through it all. Bubzer Apr 2016 #20
No ... I asked ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #24
Yep Robbins Apr 2016 #32
I disagree ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #35
Really Robbins Apr 2016 #36
Yes, really ... 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #37
In my particular business I'm surrounded by Republicans. DemocracyDirect Apr 2016 #42
"if I really believe HRC will unite the republican party", I'm not here to tell you what you believe Bubzer Apr 2016 #55
I do nt riderinthestorm Apr 2016 #26
This message was self-deleted by its author 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #29
Shrug. I like Hillary. I'll vote for her in the GE riderinthestorm Apr 2016 #40
I apologize ... That was uncalled for on my part. 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #44
Its fine. GDP is weird. nt riderinthestorm Apr 2016 #46
When did the Democratic Party reject Sanders’ call for a fifty-state general-election campaign? 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #18
DWS has never done it before, why do you think she'll do it now? riderinthestorm Apr 2016 #28
That does not answer my question. 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #31
Ok, how about they've ignored his call for a 50 state strategy? riderinthestorm Apr 2016 #33
Okay ... Thanks. 1StrongBlackMan Apr 2016 #34
So, Progressives will support the "Blue Dog" conservadems in red states now? Proud Liberal Dem Apr 2016 #45
How is it clear... CompanyFirstSergeant Apr 2016 #19
K&R. grntuscarora Apr 2016 #38
To appeal to Kasich's supporters, Hillary would have to move very far to the right. djean111 Apr 2016 #52
PM kick riderinthestorm Apr 2016 #56

PufPuf23

(8,813 posts)
39. Self defeating anyway for Hillary Clinton.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 12:29 PM
Apr 2016

Recall Hillary Clinton started seemingly ahead in 2008 and the campaign harmed itself by negative campaigning.

I am so annoyed at the situation that my posts are more frequent and I am angry at Hillary Clinton, the DNC, many Clinton supporters and neo-liberals and neo-conservatives in general.

Some of my recent posts have been negative having posted in sex scandal threads (about Bill Clinton repeatedly flying by private jet to a private island as the guest and friend of Jeffery Epstein, the convicted sex criminal billionaire post-POTUS).

Hillary Clinton reminds me of Richard Nixon in policy and manner.

Hard to judge who is in more disarray, Democrats or GOP.

Good article.

MisterP

(23,730 posts)
47. exactly--her attempts to knock down the other candidate get people writing and knocking on doors
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 01:24 PM
Apr 2016

and volunteering their time because they don't want to be in the party that nominated all THAT

sorechasm

(631 posts)
49. Investors in the 'Establishment' hedge their bets and support a candidate on both sides during the
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 01:39 PM
Apr 2016

primaries so that they can openly put their weight behind their favored horse during the GE, having promoted the flawed opponent during the primaries. So therefore, it may well be deliberate by the 1%. The DLC are just pawns in that game.

This is hardly a far-fetched scenario after the 2008 crash by 'hedge' fund managers.

 

JackRiddler

(24,979 posts)
50. Scorched earth to win one battle, without regard for the war.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 01:40 PM
Apr 2016

And yes, it is very possible that Trump will be turned back by convention time. He's obviously peaked and media is bored of him.

PatrickforO

(14,586 posts)
4. The democrats can be pretty shortsighted, it is true.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 10:32 AM
Apr 2016

Basically you have thousands of egos at all functional levels of the party apparatus and whatever meme they put out forms a sort of group think.

I don't think it's deliberate. It's just that no one knows how to deal with Bernie. Someone who is honest, speaks truth to power, doesn't have super PACs, isn't beholden to big lobbies...they are having a heck of a time getting their heads around that.

Plus, Bernie has been independent and is now running as a Democrat. That probably ruffled a few local feathers, too.

This fellow, for instance, is a well known Democratic party functionary in a western state...

 

DemocracyDirect

(708 posts)
9. Most of the party apparatus is about soliciting donations...
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 10:39 AM
Apr 2016

... and getting their cut.

If they lose some people will be more desperate to donate for next time around.

If Bernie gets the nomination a lot of the party apparatus will be looking for new jobs.

And even the few who don't have to get new jobs will be playing under a whole new rule book of responsible governance to the people.

That's the nightmare they face.

PatrickforO

(14,586 posts)
11. The thing that is truly monstrous about your post is that it is true.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 10:45 AM
Apr 2016

Imagine looking at responsible, non-corrupt governance as a nightmare and there you have what a twisted, corrupt society we've become.

We've been in serious trouble since our politicians quit doing the right thing in favor of doing the thing that will please lobbies and so get them elected yet again.

 

Trust Buster

(7,299 posts)
5. I chuckled at the OP's definition of the Democrats most popular candidate.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 10:32 AM
Apr 2016

And here I always assumed it was the candidate with millions of more votes. Silly me.

Bubzer

(4,211 posts)
10. Of course you did. All while ignoring her unfavorability numbers and cheating tactics to get votes.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 10:41 AM
Apr 2016

Of course she's the most unpopular. She's consistently polled dammingly high unfavorability. In fact, of all presidential contenders, she ONLY beats trump!

jeff47

(26,549 posts)
21. Popular outside the primaries...you know, like would be the case in
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 11:18 AM
Apr 2016

a general election where independents and Republicans get to vote too.

jeff47

(26,549 posts)
23. Actually, it is exactly what the OP said
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 11:23 AM
Apr 2016

since that point was explicitly dealing with the general election.

Jarqui

(10,130 posts)
8. 2nd time Seth has done that to me
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 10:37 AM
Apr 2016

I wondered if it was HA Goodman when I read #3 but normally, Goodman is blindly oblivious and wildly optimistic.

I do suspect they're going for someone like Kasich or a candidate parachuted in rather than Trump or Cruz. The GOP are ruthless. They'll do whatever to get power.

All they need is a half decent candidate and I think they'll clean Hillary's clock. Independents will not support Hillary if they have a reasonable alternative. (although we Dems may not agree, someone like Kasich is approaching semi-sane compared to the other two GOP candidates).

 

CrowCityDem

(2,348 posts)
12. Ha!
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 10:48 AM
Apr 2016
7. Reject Sanders' call for a fifty-state general-election campaign.


Maybe that wouldn't elicit a giant laugh if Bernie had run a fifty-state PRIMARY campaign. His people have shown to be completely comfortable writing off an entire region of the country when it suits them.

Bubzer

(4,211 posts)
13. General Elections and primarys are completely different.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 10:50 AM
Apr 2016

The GE is a face-off against the GoP... not an attempt to see who's going to represent this Democratic party.

Proud Liberal Dem

(24,426 posts)
14. LOL!
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 10:54 AM
Apr 2016


Those are some pretty wild statements IMHO, especially the one about how it's (somehow) clear that Trump won't be the nominee.
 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
17. I really don't expect that trump will be the republican nominee ...
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 11:08 AM
Apr 2016

unless he gets to the delegate number before the republican convention. But I fully expect (or perhaps, hoping) that should he come close, he will mount a third party run.

And that would not make me angry.

Proud Liberal Dem

(24,426 posts)
43. I was under the impression that he is leading in delegates?
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 12:46 PM
Apr 2016

Did I miss something? And I agree. I would not get angry if he does a third-party run. In fact, I would pull out the popcorn!

Proud Liberal Dem

(24,426 posts)
53. Ah....I see
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 02:22 PM
Apr 2016

Thanks for explaining. I'm honestly not sure if I'd rather have Trump or Cruz (or somebody else). I don't want any of them, of course, but I would imagine that, when put up against Hillary (or Bernie), I can't imagine that many people (including Republicans) would seriously entertain voting for Trump, resulting in a (likely) electoral blowout for the GOP. The Republicans would be more likely to unify around a more *conventional* candidate like Cruz or Kasich, both of whom could present a more formidable challenge (though Hillary or Bernie still win IMHO).

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
54. In my G/E fantasy ...
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:06 PM
Apr 2016

1) cruz and trump succeed in getting Kasich kicked out of the race based on their "8 Primaries" rule.

2) Kasich's delegates split evenly between cruz and trump.

3) trump misses the majority number by less than 100. Cruz misses the number by 200+

4) No delegates move to trump or cruz.

5) the republicans jump trump and pick cruz (or, pick someone that hasn't been in the primary races).

6) trump's ego rules and he mounts a third party.

And, oh yeah ... Democrats and the left awake up to the horror that would be a republican win AND realize that if we work hard (down ticket), Democrats could flip the Senate and close in on the House; so, we kiss and make up and rather than depressing the less politically engaged with talk of how the parties are both the same and how corrupt Democrats are.

(Regarding the last point ... Hey! I DID say, it's my G/E fantasy. )

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
16. Do you really believe what you just wrote? ...
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 11:00 AM
Apr 2016

particularly, that HRC will unite the republican party, more so than the "angry, tax raising, grow government bigger, SOCIALIST" Sanders will? That's what the republicans will label Bernie (using his own words) to unite their party.

Or, that the Democratic Party is under-estimating Cruz or Kasich?

The OP just seems to be more sour grapes.

Bubzer

(4,211 posts)
20. Here's the thing... Hillary supporters go on and on and on about how she's been through it all.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 11:17 AM
Apr 2016

She's well recognized...and a known quantity. She's had ages to build all kinds of enemies in Washington... including conservatives. You ask if I really believe she will unite republicans, if she's the nominee, like it were even in question. It's not. Republicans view her they way we view bush Jr... and that's not even hyperbole.

Not sure how many conservatives you've talked to, but all the ones I've talked to universally hate Hillary... I've heard more than a few say they'd vote for trump before her...and, except for a few, they don't like trump much better. They'd rather vote for Bernie over trump any day.

If you think that's just sour grapes, you're more welcome to stick your head in the sand and pretend there's no sky.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
24. No ... I asked ...
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 11:30 AM
Apr 2016

if I really believe HRC will unite the republican party, more so than the "angry, tax raising, grow government bigger, SOCIALIST" Sanders will?

Robbins

(5,066 posts)
32. Yep
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 11:48 AM
Apr 2016

they hate clinton because she is woman.then there is myth of clinton they have sold to their base and public.

Bernie is seen as honest guy.he even gets crossover support.there is anti-establishment snetment.if gop can deny trump
nomination only thing saving them would be clinton as nominee.kasich would beat her.even cruz has shot at beating her.

Inless trump preveils at convention Clinton likely loses in november.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
35. I disagree ...
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 12:08 PM
Apr 2016
Bernie is seen as honest guy.he even gets crossover support.


Maybe, for the moment. Should Sanders get the Democratic nomination, the gop establishment will turn they guns on him ... for the first time in his political career.

And, tarnishing his image, won't be that difficult ... From his calling himself a socialist (they will leave off the Democratic part) to his admissions that he will raise taxes on everyone to his calls to expand government ... the campaign hit commercials write themselves and will be using his own words.

None of those things are endearing to independents or cross-over voters.

Robbins

(5,066 posts)
36. Really
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 12:13 PM
Apr 2016

after years of calling obama a socialist to no good results that has lost meaning.

Independents are voting for him.your assuming they are all stupid and heard nothing.

Your supscribing to faulty notion that only clinton can beat republicans.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
37. Yes, really ...
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 12:23 PM
Apr 2016
after years of calling obama a socialist to no good results that has lost meaning.


No it hasn't ... and it won't be republicans calling Sanders a socialist ... it will be Sanders calling Sanders a socialist.

Independents are voting for him.your assuming they are all stupid and heard nothing.


No. I'm not.

Your supscribing to faulty notion that only clinton can beat republicans.


No. I'm not.
 

DemocracyDirect

(708 posts)
42. In my particular business I'm surrounded by Republicans.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 12:45 PM
Apr 2016

They all hate Hillary.

And they are all intrigued by Bernie Sanders and ask me for more information.

I even got them to agree that education and health care are the two things that a government should provide its people.

Bubzer

(4,211 posts)
55. "if I really believe HRC will unite the republican party", I'm not here to tell you what you believe
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 04:07 PM
Apr 2016

Hillary is OVERWELMINGLY unpopular. Republicans hate her. Given the choice, most republicans would happily take Bernie over Hillary. After all... her unpopularity is second only to trump. You do the math.

Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #26)

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
40. Shrug. I like Hillary. I'll vote for her in the GE
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 12:33 PM
Apr 2016

But I'm not blind to her deep flaws and how much the Republicans hate her.

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
33. Ok, how about they've ignored his call for a 50 state strategy?
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 11:52 AM
Apr 2016
http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/266218-sanders-dems-need-50-state-strategy



Bernie Sanders said Democrats need a 50-state strategy and that the party needs to radically transform itself to broaden its appeal. 

"The Democratic Party needs major reform," the presidential contender said during Sunday night's NBC/YouTube debate in Charleston, S.C.

"To those of you in South Carolina, you know what, in Mississippi — we need a 50-state strategy so that people in South Carolina and Mississippi can get the resources they need."

Proud Liberal Dem

(24,426 posts)
45. So, Progressives will support the "Blue Dog" conservadems in red states now?
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 12:53 PM
Apr 2016

Great! I just remember how much griping (to put it mildly) there was here for so many years after Howard Dean's 50-state strategy put Democrats back in the majority but left us with several "Blue Dog" Democrats, most of whom were subsequently wiped out in 2010 and 2014 and replaced with Republican whackjobs.

 

CompanyFirstSergeant

(1,558 posts)
19. How is it clear...
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 11:12 AM
Apr 2016
...assume that Donald Trump will be the Republicans’ 2016 nominee, though it’s now clear he won’t be.

I am hoping as much as anyone that the above - in bold - is true. That he won't be.

Please substantiate the above. I have not been following the R side of the primaries.

I may have missed something, and that information would be appreciated.

Thank you.
 

djean111

(14,255 posts)
52. To appeal to Kasich's supporters, Hillary would have to move very far to the right.
Mon Apr 4, 2016, 01:50 PM
Apr 2016

Which would lose the left, the Progressives, and the liberals.
This would result in a Hillary loss, IMO, because the GOP voters hate her anyway.

Those 300,000 new voters that won't be able to vote in Wisconsin? They are not going to vote for anyone, methinks, doubties they will vote for the candidate whose campaign's reaction is Bwahahahaha! All those college students not able to vote for Berne! They will not be voting for Hillary, either, then.

One thing that occurred to me, thinking about Kasich - he is, IMO, the perfect picture of a Third Way politician.
And when people have to choose between a fake Republican, and a real one - they will go for the real one.

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