2016 Postmortem

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts) Mon Apr 11, 2016, 12:37 PM Apr 2016

Closed primaries in NY: they exist to protect smaller parties from being bullied and taken over

by the big parties.

Right now all of the focus is on how awful this is for Independents. But it's precisely the smaller parties that those independents belong to that are being protected.

There are 48,000 or so members of the Working Families Party in New York.

It would be rather easy for the Democratic machine here to have, oh, 49,000 people switch their registration to WFP as part of a hostile take over, and install party leaders who would be lapdogs for the Democratic party.

Same dynamic goes for Green Party, Conservative Party, etc--to protect them from interference and gamesmanship from the big established parties.

New York has several smaller parties that have endured for a long time precisely because it protects them and makes sure that only their members participate in the governance of those parties.

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Closed primaries in NY: they exist to protect smaller parties from being bullied and taken over (Original Post) geek tragedy Apr 2016 OP

Thanks for the info! Lucinda Apr 2016 #1

But on a national scale, of which the Presidential election is, it serves to disenfranchise voters Bread and Circus Apr 2016 #2

I have no sympathy for that position. Adrahil Apr 2016 #6

So you agree then liberal independents should not vote for Clinton in the GE. Bread and Circus Apr 2016 #7

I think if they don;t want Trump or Cruz.... Adrahil Apr 2016 #8

So my original post here is exactly right....thanks for proving my point. Bread and Circus Apr 2016 #12

Anyone can vote for anyone in the GE ... this thread is about primaries n/t SFnomad Apr 2016 #11

You missed the point being made. Bread and Circus Apr 2016 #13

No, the entire thread was discussing primaries, then all of a sudden you switch to the GE SFnomad Apr 2016 #14

Like I said, you missed the point. Bread and Circus Apr 2016 #15

Lovely rationalization! sadoldgirl Apr 2016 #3

you don't think that would happen? nt geek tragedy Apr 2016 #4

Some primaries are open, some are closed. Some states have caucuses. yellowcanine Apr 2016 #5

Meh. Semi-closed is better. It protects smaller parties, but allows the independents to still vote FourScore Apr 2016 #9

Leave it to pesky old context to spoil another Sadners supporter tantrum. nt CalvinballPro Apr 2016 #10

Lucinda

(31,170 posts)

1. Thanks for the info!

Reply to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 01:34 PM

Apr 2016

Bread and Circus

(9,454 posts)

2. But on a national scale, of which the Presidential election is, it serves to disenfranchise voters

Reply to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 01:39 PM

Apr 2016

There is no viable third or independent party for the Presidential election. You and Hillary don't want there to be either.

So on one hand you tell independents..."no, you don't get a say in who we nominate" but then you instantly turn around and say "but you better fucking vote for Hillary Clinton in the General election because if you don't Trump will win and you will be morally and personally responsible".

So, to be fair, either you let independents help choose the two candidates we will have to choose from in the GE or you don't bitch if independent voters actually vote independently, even if it means you lose.

Adrahil

(13,340 posts)

6. I have no sympathy for that position.

Reply to Bread and Circus (Reply #2)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 02:08 PM

Apr 2016

I'm not really crazy about the two-party system, but I think party members ought to be able to select their candidate. If you want a say in the party nominees, join the party!

Bread and Circus

(9,454 posts)

7. So you agree then liberal independents should not vote for Clinton in the GE.

Reply to Adrahil (Reply #6)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 02:28 PM

Apr 2016

Adrahil

(13,340 posts)

8. I think if they don;t want Trump or Cruz....

Reply to Bread and Circus (Reply #7)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 02:32 PM

Apr 2016

They should vote for the Democratic nominee. If they want a say in that nominee, join the party.

Bread and Circus

(9,454 posts)

12. So my original post here is exactly right....thanks for proving my point.

Reply to Adrahil (Reply #8)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 02:54 PM

Apr 2016

SFnomad

(3,473 posts)

11. Anyone can vote for anyone in the GE ... this thread is about primaries n/t

Reply to Bread and Circus (Reply #7)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 02:38 PM

Apr 2016

Bread and Circus

(9,454 posts)

13. You missed the point being made.

Reply to SFnomad (Reply #11)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 02:54 PM

Apr 2016

SFnomad

(3,473 posts)

14. No, the entire thread was discussing primaries, then all of a sudden you switch to the GE

Reply to Bread and Circus (Reply #13)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 02:56 PM

Apr 2016

And there is no comparison.

Bread and Circus

(9,454 posts)

15. Like I said, you missed the point.

Reply to SFnomad (Reply #14)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 02:58 PM

Apr 2016

sadoldgirl

(3,431 posts)

3. Lovely rationalization!

Reply to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 01:41 PM

Apr 2016

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)

4. you don't think that would happen? nt

Reply to sadoldgirl (Reply #3)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 01:52 PM

Apr 2016

yellowcanine

(35,699 posts)

5. Some primaries are open, some are closed. Some states have caucuses.

Reply to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 02:06 PM

Apr 2016

It is a little late to try to change any of the rules. Just sayin.'

FourScore

(9,704 posts)

9. Meh. Semi-closed is better. It protects smaller parties, but allows the independents to still vote

Reply to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 02:34 PM

Apr 2016

for one of the major parties.

Also, NY is particularly harsh because you must change party affiliation about 7 months before the primary. Most people haven't decided by then. Other states allow the change within a couple of weeks of the primary, some even up to election day.

CalvinballPro

(1,019 posts)

10. Leave it to pesky old context to spoil another Sadners supporter tantrum. nt

Reply to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Apr 11, 2016, 02:35 PM

Apr 2016

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