2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forum"Sanders is drawing people to the party"
That's been the theme for the last couple of weeks, and why the Clinton campaign was going to be "disappointed" last night.
Well, here are the comparative numbers between 2008 and 2016:
Turnout in 2008
Hillary Clinton 1,068,496
Barack Obama 751,019
John Edwards 21,924
Dennis J. Kucinich 8,458
Bill Richardson 8,227
Joseph R. Biden Jr. 4,321
Turnout in 2016
Hillary Clinton 1,037,344
Bernie Sander 752,739
Almost IDENTICAL, in fact actually 4% lower! Sanders certainly did not draw anyone into the party - that's a myth that was debunked last night.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)mucifer
(23,550 posts)How can he draw people to the party if there are roadblocks?
You can't have it both ways.
George II
(67,782 posts)mucifer
(23,550 posts)you can't have it both ways.
Either you want to include independents in primary democratic elections and you let them vote or you are non inclusive and you don't let them vote in the primaries.
But, then don't say Bernie can't bring in independent votes. That simply doesn't make sense.
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)It's really VERY simple.
mucifer
(23,550 posts)IamMab
(1,359 posts)See: Wisconsin supreme court race.
ThePhilosopher04
(1,732 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)And it appears a number of voters who reregistered as Democrats before the Oct deadline had their affiliation changed and were forced to fill out provisional ballots not included in your #s. Open primaries and caucuses have had large turnouts. Half of those Independants won't be voting Dem tickets in Nov with Hillary on top of the ticket. They'll stay home or vote for other candidates.
George II
(67,782 posts)HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)Do you have a source for those numbers other than your behind?
George II
(67,782 posts)Lizzie Poppet
(10,164 posts)Or did you not actually comprehend the post you were replying to...?
George II
(67,782 posts)Lizzie Poppet
(10,164 posts)So you actually did mention them...because that's how demonstratives work.
pat_k
(9,313 posts)... as they are able to in CT, or if they had been able to vote in the Democratic primary, as they are able to in RI, WV, CA, NJ, you would have seen how many voters Sanders brought into the party.
Since NY "locked down" the number of people registered in the party last October, of course you don't see an increase.
George II
(67,782 posts)pat_k
(9,313 posts)...registration changes and close all their primaries to anyone except people already registered as Dems?
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)Closed primaries can only lead the party down the path towards never exceeding 29% of GE votes. If bringing fresh blood into the party is desired, including millenials needed for party future, then they have to have candidates to vote for. Expecting them to join the party just to hold their noses is stupid thinking.
pat_k
(9,313 posts)...between the closed/semi-closed/open primaries this time around.
For a change, we have a candidate that they don't have to "hold their nose" to vote for.
You're right. We can open up those closed primaries "next time around" but it will make no difference if we don't have someone like Bernie or Elizabeth Warren, or Martin O'Malley, or ??
And, unless by some miracle we get Bernie elected, we are probably looking at 8 years of whoever wins in Nov. If that's Hillary, unless she undergoes some amazing transformation in office, she won't be attracting fresh blood.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)...she will be sworn in with the lowest favorability numbers of any incoming president in modern era. And her numbers will only go down from there, as she acts out on her neoconservative fantasies and turns her back on minorities and other working class with her neoliberal free market economics. And the GOP will obstruct and work towards impeachment from day one.
George II
(67,782 posts)HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)What prevents a Republican from changing party registration and voting in a closed Dem primary now? In essence, that's what we have in Third Way.
pat_k
(9,313 posts)Allowing people to register as a Democrat up to and on Election Day, and/or allowing unaffiliated voters to vote in the Democratic Primary is not opening the door to hoards of republicans.
George II
(67,782 posts)...last April, and registration closed in NY in October. That's 6 months to decide and register.
pat_k
(9,313 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)....as they see fit.
pat_k
(9,313 posts)...which set of rules is more likely to enable more people to join the party?
George II
(67,782 posts)pat_k
(9,313 posts)Iliyah
(25,111 posts)Campaigns should educate their supporters on each states voting registrations. Each states primary and/or caucus rules are there for everyone to view. Trying to change in mid-stream laws and rule concerning elections for each particular state is not helpful, plus, Tad Devine knows the Democratic Party's process, there is no excuse.
George II
(67,782 posts)....achieve changes in the way primaries are run. But they didn't, and now they want instant rule/law changes.
pat_k
(9,313 posts)They just have to educate the voters.
Any people disenfranchised, screw them.
KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)and fight within the party for progressive change.
His angry rhetoric and empty promises are attracting people who have no stomach for the real world, hard work necessary to participate in party politics.
His unwillingness to fundraise for Down Ticket Democrats also illustrates this point. Reinforcing the "both parties are the same" illustrates this point.
Showing up to vote for some guy promising free stuff isn't growing the Democratic party.
George II
(67,782 posts)...complaining that the DNC didn't have registration tables set up at SANDERS rallies.
It doesn't work that way, campaigns register voters at their respective rallies.
SheenaR
(2,052 posts)Never mind that part of Clinton's platform mirrors Sanders'
Back on the Free Stuff kick. There is no hope for you. This has been debunked at least a hundred times here. You were my first and only ignore (which says a lot in this place) and I should have kept it that way