2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumSanders Senatorial home State win 86% Clinton's Senatorial home State win 58%
notice the difference? and oh in 2008 while she was a Senator it was about the same
comradebillyboy
(10,154 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)MadBadger
(24,089 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)brush
(53,787 posts)auntpurl
(4,311 posts)Notice the difference?
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)kinda blows that diversity thing right out of the water
Zynx
(21,328 posts)I'm assuming Sanders loses MD next week.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)Zynx
(21,328 posts)aside from caucus states.
Sanders is in far far far far far worse shape than Obama at a similar point. By late April he had an insurmountable lead.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)Barack Obama has proven himself capable of building a large and heterogeneous coalition. The Vermont independent has proven he is incapable of putting together such a coalition.
I think you should have posted this in the Bernie Sanders forum where you would have been applauded for your insight.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)and it's more fun here really it is
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)Which of the three candidates has proven incapable of assembling a heterogeneous coalition?
Barack Obama
Hillary Clinton
Bernie Sanders
Thank you in advance.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)Thank you in advance.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)Wrap your head around that. Therefore it is fair to compare Sanders' perform in his postage stamp sized state with Hillary's performance in the congressional district where she lived it and she won it 69-31. The difference isn't nearly as stark.
http://www.westchestergov.com/boe99/linkcounty.aspx
And let's not even begin to talk about the fact NY has nearly thirty times as many people as lil Vermont.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)all your race theories just took wing at least when it comes to NY
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama are both adept at building broad and heterogeneous coalitions, the Vermont independent, not so much...
All is not lost...The South Dakota caucus is coming up.
brush
(53,787 posts)A previous poster put it to succinctly, Sanders doesn't do well in diverse states.
You can't win the presidency getting mostly white votes. That was proven in 2102 with Romney. He got a huge majority of the white vote but was beaten handily.
Sorry, those days are over, and so is Bernie.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)because they do not like the optics of what those numbers say about the candidates
brush
(53,787 posts)Hillary got nearly half a million more votes in NY than Trump:
Clinton 1,054,083 votes
Trump 524,932 votes
Any questions?
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)leftynyc
(26,060 posts)supporters that whine constantly about being reminded that Bernie can't seem to win in big diverse states. If you call fighting back against abject bullshit piling on, you need a thicker skin.
brooklynite
(94,595 posts)We've long since passed the expectations game. Sanders is no longer polling at 5%; he's a serious candidate and need to perform like a serious candidate; i.e. WIN. He's not. Clinton IS winning, whether or not it's at the pace you think it should be.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)And comparing a state the size of a congressional district that is as homogeneous as a Wayne Newton Vegas act with a state as large and heterogeneous as New York is patently absurd.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)doesn't sound very diverse to me
Zynx
(21,328 posts)He doesn't have a diverse coalition. His showing in NY was far whiter than Obama's was.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)Thank you in advance.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)Adrahil
(13,340 posts)Godhumor
(6,437 posts)Notice the difference?
Codeine
(25,586 posts)And she's going to be president. I'm sure she's fine with the VT results.
MadBadger
(24,089 posts)Bad Dog
(2,025 posts)which won't affect the outcome one bit.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)more than Bernie in her Senatorial home state. That's interesting, too. Bernie got 16 more pledged delegates in VT than Hillary. In NY York, Hillary got 31 more pledged delegates than Bernie. Stuff's fascinating when you look it up.
onehandle
(51,122 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)and the replies are all but but but
Blue_Adept
(6,399 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)hack89
(39,171 posts)JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)Freddie Stubbs
(29,853 posts)onehandle
(51,122 posts)Numbers are so inconvenient.
Tarc
(10,476 posts)geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)and Hillary barely scraped out of Il with a tie less than 2% in my state we call that a recall
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)I point out that Bernie is more popular in the state he's a Senator from than Hilary was now or when she was a Senator and get a massive pile on - what's that tell about the chances of party unity?
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)in the state with the second most delegates is bad optics for her.
Step outside the Bernie Bubble.
mythology
(9,527 posts)Took 247 delegates out of play, won by 200,000 plus votes, increased her substantial delegate lead, again showed her campaign appeals to substantial majorities of black, Hispanic and women voters and soundly beat a candidate who out spent her by a wide margin, and further closed the already exceedingly unlikely path to the nomination Sanders even theoretically had.
Sanders winning Vermont showed he could handily win a state that has a very low minority population, is substantially more liberal than even the median of the Democratic party and if Clinton didn't contest the state.
One of these can be extrapolated to winning the Democratic nomination. One can not.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)she has completely ignored middle America, what does that tell those of us who live here about what we can expect from her as POTUS
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)She campaigned hard in Iowa, won Missouri, Illinois, Ohio.
She even campaigned hard in Wisconsin despite knowing she'd lose there.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)living in Minnesota I count Ohio as the East and Illinois was pretty much a tie >2% difference
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)of less than a million people to an extremely diverse state of 19.75 million people makes perfect sense. More pathetic sore loser nonsense.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)blows that lily white thing right out of the water
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)Are you saying the President can't put together a diverse coalition? Because for all appearances, Bernie can't. I do love how you whine about how the delegate count is all that matters to Hillary supporters. What the fuck else matters in a race for delegates? You candidate took a body blow last night - suck it up.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)almost like she's saying those people just aren't important to me
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)ignoring states with low delegate counts. Where are the quotes from Hillary discounting even one state? I'll wait.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)quotes are not necessary lack of appearances speak for themselves
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)She's CLEANING UP in all minority heavy states. Let's not pretend otherwise. Maybe after Bernie gets his ass kicked again next Tuesday you'll find reality a more healthy place than the la la land where Hillary is ignoring minorities.
Dem2
(8,168 posts)I looove eggs.
SidDithers
(44,228 posts)Sid
tritsofme
(17,379 posts)I'm sure.
JustAnotherGen
(31,828 posts)Wouldn't diversity and size have something to do with that?
Vermont had a total of 134,571 votes cast among the four Democratic Candidates on the ballot:
http://www.wptz.com/politics/2016-vermont-primary-results/38148736
It's a physically small state without the broad spectrum of Americans there - and those who don't fit the 'American Dream' mold aren't large enough to make an impact.
NY (with 99% reporting) cast 1,182,552 Votes.
http://www.nytimes.com/elections/results/new-york
I lived in the Greater Rochester area for 30 years. Moved to NJ in 2006. If you look at the 'map' and how it went - it would make sense that Sanders would have picked up the 315ers (white working class high school grads) and 607 (includes Ithaca and Cornell) and up through the mountains of the eastern part of the State. But when you look at the 4 largest cities (Greater NYC, Buffalo, Rochester, Syracuse) the areas couldn't be more different.
To me, having canvassed and volunteered for campaigns for Slaughter, Clinton (first Senate run), President Clinton, Senator Kerry, my parents (local township won but county lost), state legislators and county Executive - and having done the Federal across the state -
The numbers shouldn't be compared.
In Alphabet Soup in Rochester NY - well - there isn't one in Vermont. There's one Syracuse. There's one in Buffalo. There isn't an Alphabet Soup in say -
Canadaigua or Lake Placid or Elmira. Those are mini Vermonts. But Vermont doesn't have a Rochester - they just don't. You aren't going to find that kind of diversity in 700 K people in ONE county (Monroe) in Vermont.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)hillary won by the same margin doesn't seem all too diverse to me
JustAnotherGen
(31,828 posts)In the GE - folks in Buffalo, Rochester, Syracuse could relate to him. I mean no disrespect to you - people are different. I'm one who just can't relate to Sanders at all. O'Malley I could relate to - Sanders I can't.
I've already moved on to the NJ Governor's race - Phil Murphy. He's relatable to me.
KingFlorez
(12,689 posts)In a small state like Vermont it's not really all that hard for the sitting Senator to get that much. New York is a much larger state with a clear regional divide. There is quite a difference.
zappaman
(20,606 posts)Squinch
(50,955 posts)LexVegas
(6,067 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)Response to azurnoir (Reply #75)
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