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WI_DEM

(33,497 posts)
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 12:44 PM Oct 2012

LA Times Poll of CA: Obama up by 14...

(While this is a solid lead, it also helps explain why some polls have Romney up in the popular vote while lagging behind in the electoral vote. Romney is doing better than McCain in 'Red states' particularly in the deep south. Meanwhile President Obama is winning 'blue' states but isn't performing as well in them as he did in 2008--so this is bringing his popular vote totals down. Still, it's the electoral college that matters):

Even in vividly blue California, President Obama's luster has faded since his historic victory here in 2008, a new poll has found.

Despite his sizable lead over Mitt Romney, the president is unlikely to repeat his historic 2008 margin of victory here because of his diminished power to pull in people who don't traditionally support Democrats, according to the USC Dornsife/Los Angeles Times poll.

The drop in appeal across party and demographic lines has translated, at this point, to a 14-point edge over the Republican nominee among likely voters — well below Obama's 24-point victory in 2008, the biggest margin in modern times.

PHOTOS: President Obama's 2012 campaign

The same trends that are making the presidential contest tight in the battleground states are evident in California, particularly the decline in support for Obama among white voters and men. In 2008, Obama won male voters by 18 percentage points over Republican nominee John McCain; he currently leads Romney by 1 point among likely male voters. Among white men, Obama beat McCain by two percentage points; Romney now leads among them by 17 points.

The poll, conducted by the Democratic polling firm of Greenberg Quinlan Rosner and the Republican firm American Viewpoint, surveyed 1,504 registered voters by phone between Oct. 15 and 21. The survey has an overall margin of error of 2.9 percentage points in either direction, with a higher margin of error for subgroups.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-california-poll-20121026,0,6796325.story

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Maximumnegro

(1,134 posts)
3. Obummer is in free fall
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 12:48 PM
Oct 2012

Romney is only 14pts behind in CA? and 8pts in MN? Romney landslide is coming!!!



WI_DEM

(33,497 posts)
4. Where does it suggest that?
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 12:51 PM
Oct 2012

it's a fact that in many blue states (NY is an exception) Obama is winning but not winning as big as he did in 2008. This is why the popular vote is close. Of course the electoral vote is what counts and in the swing states Obama does have the advantage. Missouri is another example. It went very narrowly (by less than 1%) for McCain in 2008--recent polling indicates (by PPP) that Obama is down by 14 this time.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
5. CA is heavily Latino. ALL polls got it wrong in 2010 as well.
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 12:57 PM
Oct 2012

Polls showed Democratic Senator Boxer struggling against Fiorina, and Governor Brown even or behind Meg Whitman - the end result? A Democratic BLOWOUT.

We'll see how these polls hold up after the elections. My guess is, President Obama is more likely 18-20 points ahead, but pollsters don't poll Mexican-Americans who prefer to speak Spanish.

I don't see the enthusiasm gap corporate media and others see. I live here and from the information I'm getting from our 47-member strong group, everyone is highly enthusiastic about voting for President Obama - especially the Latino community. I guess the decision to halt all persecutions of Dream-children here has helped in that regard.

WI_DEM

(33,497 posts)
6. That is very true if we get 70% of the Latino vote and it's a good turnout among that group then
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 12:59 PM
Oct 2012

our statewide totals will be higher.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
10. I predict a huge turnout among that group, based on Latino pollsters.
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 01:28 PM
Oct 2012

Although Mexican-Americans are NOT monolithic when it comes to politics, and they really do dislike unauthorized immigration as much as many Anglo-Americans, they feel they're under attack by the Republican Party that doesn't see the difference between an American-born Latino and an undocumented one. They particularly hate SB1070 that Romney has been quoted as saying, "it is the blueprint for the rest of the country".

Since the SB1070 decision that President Obama has won in SCOTUS, his lead among Latinos has exploded.
http://www.latinodecisions.com/blog/2012/07/18/after-sb1070-decision-obama-widens-lead-over-romney/

From that piece, this is very important to remember:

An important note on Latino polls

As the election draws near, more and more poll results will be reported for Latino voters. We caution readers against relying on small Latino samples taken from a larger national poll. Instead, more reliable results will be found in polls that focus exclusively on Latino voters and maintain a larger sample size. For example, Latino samples taken from larger national polls are often small, between 80 – 200 and carry a margin of error between 8 – 11%. Further, because the overall target is all voters, the interviewers are not bilingual, and often try to call-back Spanish-dominant respondents who they could not communicate with in English. This results in greatly underestimating the number of immigrant and Spanish-speaking voters in polls. A recent poll from Quinnipiac reported a sample of just 143 Latinos, and 14% of interviews conducted in Spanish, an unacceptably low number. Finally, national polls are not designed to get an accurate geographic representation of Latinos because they draw a nationally proportionate sample of all Americans, and pick up Latino respondents wherever they surface. The Latino population maintains substantially different patterns of residence than the national population and as such, the Latino sample is rarely representative of the overall Latino population. For example, New Mexico has the 8th largest Latino population, but nationally it ranks 36th in size. Likewise Ohio has the 7th largest population nationally, but ranks 20th among Latino states.


This is why I feel the national polls and all the big pollsters don't reflect a true glimpse into President Obama's numbers.

As a side note, Latinos feel they're being discriminated against. Many Dream-children who have been, in essence, pardoned by President Obama can now get a CA driver's license, too, (courtesy of CA Democratic legislature and Gov. Brown not vetoing it). Because of these acts, Latinos feel they have a home in the Democratic Party.

TroyD

(4,551 posts)
17. The early polls showed Boxer and Brown struggling, yes
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 05:02 PM
Oct 2012

But when Fiorina and Whitman imploded, the later polls showed Boxer and Brown winning.

Anyway, I'm hoping Obama's California numbers will be higher than this because it would help the popular vote.

As I told a friend who voted for Obama in California yesterday, your vote DOES matter even if you're in a safe blue state because it all goes toward the popular vote and it's important that Obama do as well in that as possible in order to prevent a narrative after the election that Romney won the popular vote and is the real winner etc. etc.

tarheelsunc

(2,117 posts)
7. The fact that Obama is somewhat weaker in Democratic strongholds than in 2008,
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 01:12 PM
Oct 2012

plus the fact that Romney is significantly stronger in Republican strongholds than McCain was, means that Obama must be very strong in the swing states given the national polling situation.

melody

(12,365 posts)
8. Obama will have a larger win in California than this
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 01:26 PM
Oct 2012

It's impossible to find a Romney bumpersticker unless you go to rural areas (or mega-wealthy areas).

fujiyama

(15,185 posts)
11. If this is true
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 04:11 PM
Oct 2012

we're seeing some reason for the polling split between the popular vote and electoral vote for the reasons you stated. But there's one more component. It's clear that there has been erosion of support for Obama among many white voters (especially white males). This poll and several others have indicated that. But that erosion isn't equal everywhere - due to the auto bailout, for example, OH is in much better state. And the ads that Obama blanketed in the mid west showing Romney to be a nasty corporate raider were effective in defining him early on in that part of the country. And Obama's advantage with Latinos will likely have him winning NV and possibly CO. VA and NC have also seen demographic changes.

Considering the money advantage Romney has had, Obama has done remarkably well in identifying states that he has had to defend, and spending money in those states accordingly. I think a split between the PV and EC is more likely this time than even '00. But we all know the PV means nothing. And for those mentioning mandates, since when have republicans ever cared about such a thing when a Dem was in charge? They impeached Clinton over a BJ for God's sake and have refused to work with Obama in good faith on any issue of major significance, whether it was the stimulus, health care, taxes, or the budget.

Let them howl.

OldDem2012

(3,526 posts)
12. Keep in mind that the LA Times is a very conservative media outlet....
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 04:18 PM
Oct 2012

...it probably KILLED them to begrudgingly note that the President is currently leading by 14 pts.

And guess what? The President will probably win by a margin close to that of 2008.

 

Drunken Irishman

(34,857 posts)
13. Obviously Obama is doing worse than 2008 ... but this poll doesn't prove the polling gap.
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 04:22 PM
Oct 2012

Kerry won California by 9.95% in 2004. Obama is out-polling him there by four points. It's not a huge margin, but it's significant enough when you realize four points would have been 450,000 more votes added to the popular vote, while Bush would've lost 542,000 votes ... for a net gain of nearly a million votes for Kerry. The margin between Kerry & Bush in the '04 popular vote was just over 3 million people. Had Kerry won California by 14, that advantage shrinks to about 2 million. Not considerable, but if you factor in Obama's stronger numbers in Minnesota, New Mexico, Colorado, Nevada, Virginia, North Carolina, Ohio and Florida ... it shows why the gap in the national polls and the state polls makes no sense.

So, while Obama isn't out-polling his numbers in '08, he's still out-polling Kerry, who lost the popular vote by a narrow margin ... while also losing almost every swing state (and many Obama currently leads).

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
15. This is a LV poll. The previous poll by this group
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 04:23 PM
Oct 2012

was registered voters, and showed the President up by 19 points. From the OP article:

Obama and Romney both hold on to roughly four-fifths of registered voters in their political parties, although Obama does 4 percentage points better among registered Republicans than Romney does among registered Democrats. But another driving force of Obama's lead is his support among voters who decline to state a party preference. The president wins this group of registered voters 58% to 34%, a 7-point uptick from a May USC/Times poll.

The two men also win their expected geographic zones and age groups, with Obama performing best in Los Angeles County and the Bay Area, and Romney doing well in the rest of Southern California, the Central Valley and the area north of Sacramento. Among registered voters ages 18 to 49, Obama has nearly double the support of Romney, winning 63% to Romney's 32%. Among those older than 50, the men are nearly at parity, though Obama continues to lead, 48 to 45.


More good news:

Obama has earned support from women and Latino voters at roughly the same levels as he did during the 2008 presidential race, according to the USC Dornsife/Los Angeles Times Poll. The poll showed 73 percent of Latinos and 61 percent of women support Obama, compared to 19 percent of Latinos and 34 percent of women who back Romney.

Romney leads Obama among white voters in California (49 to 46), and Obama holds a slim lead over Romney among male voters (48 to 44). Black voters overwhelmingly support Obama over Romney (93 to 4).

http://dornsife.usc.edu/usc-dornsife-los-angeles-times-poll-president-senate-oct-2012/

TroyD

(4,551 posts)
16. I've noticed several polls this week showing Obama with a smaller lead in California than expected
Sat Oct 27, 2012, 04:59 PM
Oct 2012

I've seen polls showing Obama as low as (+12) in California. I would have thought Obama would be at (+20) in California.

Obama has numbers in New York right now that are comparable to 2008, so why would he be down in California?

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