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Coventina

(27,121 posts)
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 04:48 PM Apr 2016

If Bernie Sanders isn't the Democratic Nominee Don't Blame Bernie or Bust for Trump's Victory




Why would Bernie or Bust voters risk a future with Donald Trump by refusing to vote for Hillary Clinton?

It’s structural change Bernie or Bust wants; it’s the status quo that Clinton voters want to uphold. I state the case for writing-in Bernie Sanders, if he isn’t the Democratic nominee, in this YouTube segment.

As we’ve heard throughout this election, “Don’t let perfection be the enemy of the good.”

Sure, Clinton would be better than Trump, but better won’t prevent the next endless war, or devastating financial collapse. President Obama is sending even more American soldiers to Syria, imagine what Clinton would do as president.

Perfection, from the perspective of keeping the status quo, would be grudgingly voting for Clinton and upholding a flawed system.

We’ve had too many never-ending wars, and financial debacles, to stick with a system that rewards candidates under FBI investigation.

The long-term good, for the Bernie or Bust movement, is to ensure future Democratic nominees aren’t advised by Henry Kissinger, paid millions by Wall Street, or given donations from political rivals like Donald Trump.

Sorry, I’m never voting for a Democrat who accepted, alongside her husband, $153 million from Wall Street. How does this affect her value system? These millions were given so that Clinton doesn’t advocate breaking up Too Big to Fail banks or reinstate Glass-Steagall. It’s structural change that Wall Street fears, not a watered-down Dodd-Frank.

Read more:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/h-a-goodman/if-sanders-isnt-democratic-nominee-dont-blame-bernie-or-bust-trumps-victory_b_9769874.html


Interesting article......
41 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
If Bernie Sanders isn't the Democratic Nominee Don't Blame Bernie or Bust for Trump's Victory (Original Post) Coventina Apr 2016 OP
Then don't vote for her. Just stop whining already. Trust Buster Apr 2016 #1
I did not write the article and I have not decided who I am going to vote for. Coventina Apr 2016 #3
No kidding Stuckinthebush Apr 2016 #4
"I'll never vote for Shillary!" RobertEarl Apr 2016 #23
Good for you TMontoya Apr 2016 #2
Again, I did not write the article. I posted it because I found it interesting. Coventina Apr 2016 #5
Thats fine TMontoya Apr 2016 #7
Actually, the sad truth of our broken system is that, outside of a handful of swing states Coventina Apr 2016 #10
Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2016 #27
Well bless your little heart. nt COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #31
'You people' Joe the Revelator Apr 2016 #34
The 'Bernie or Bust' people will be as common as 'PUMAs.' onehandle Apr 2016 #6
OK, YMMV. Whatevs. Coventina Apr 2016 #9
Nobody will remember that there were "Bernie or Bust" cretins by the end of summer alcibiades_mystery Apr 2016 #17
I agree 100% fluffyclouds Apr 2016 #8
Odd how you'd cut your own nose off to spite your own face tonyt53 Apr 2016 #11
I suggest you address those comments to the author of the article. n/t Coventina Apr 2016 #12
Without the help of the U.S. Senate Meteor Man Apr 2016 #20
15% an hour minimum wage and universal healthcare were already shot down in the senate.... bettyellen Apr 2016 #29
A Republican majority - unfortunately. nt COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #32
Wow, Tony, utter denial from you RobertEarl Apr 2016 #24
I think most Hillary supporters are confident she'll win the GE. qdouble Apr 2016 #13
In that case, this article should not be any source of angst. Coventina Apr 2016 #14
It isn't... qdouble Apr 2016 #18
This is why primaries suck. They are played like a team sport and people get blinded by team Coventina Apr 2016 #21
Wrong question Meteor Man Apr 2016 #22
Hillary doesn't stand a chance in the GE, hopped up wishful thinking aside. Kip Humphrey Apr 2016 #15
Anyone else feel 08 de ja vu? tia uponit7771 Apr 2016 #16
You know, I was on an extended absence from DU during '08. Coventina Apr 2016 #19
kicking for the night crowd Coventina Apr 2016 #25
I'm sure nader voters felt the same in 2000 and did not mind beachbum bob Apr 2016 #26
Yeah about that. Ask Susan ...nt Jitter65 Apr 2016 #28
Nader voters did NOT give America Bush-Cheney. The 2000 election was STOLEN Coventina Apr 2016 #36
BS grass roots support has always been overstated... dubyadiprecession Apr 2016 #30
Vote or don't vote however your choose, but do get the hell out if you won't The Second Stone Apr 2016 #33
I would advise you to direct your comments to the author of the article. Coventina Apr 2016 #37
If Trump gets elected over Clinton The Second Stone Apr 2016 #38
Thank you. I appreciate the clarification. n/t Coventina Apr 2016 #39
You are certainly welcome. By the way, I'm responsible for the 2003 Iraq War The Second Stone Apr 2016 #40
Bernie has been incredibly gentle... If she is the Nominee all those skeletons are gonna come AzDar Apr 2016 #35
She is going to be the nominee and all these old lies The Second Stone Apr 2016 #41

Coventina

(27,121 posts)
3. I did not write the article and I have not decided who I am going to vote for.
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 04:54 PM
Apr 2016

I posted an article that I found had interesting points.

Stuckinthebush

(10,845 posts)
4. No kidding
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 04:56 PM
Apr 2016

It's past obnoxious.

If someone is so myopic that they won't vote for Hillary based on imagined demons then God bless. Those people are few and far between. They prefer to scream and yell from the sidelines with their demands of purity. The constant posts of "I'll never vote for Shillary!" are sophomoric and short sighted.

 

RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
23. "I'll never vote for Shillary!"
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 07:27 PM
Apr 2016

I had not seen that statement in a long time. But there it is.

About your "imagined demons".... All I can tell you is that one has to be in denial to not admit that H has promised war. She did not say you can't have more war, she did say you can't have more free education or the best of health care.

It's really weird that the H camp has lost millions of votes over the last year. And I guess that has just driven so many of you into denial because, as you wrote: " "I'll (they'll) never vote for Shillary!" "

What a shame, she could have already won (2008) if not for her political stances and all those people who say "I'll never vote for Shillary!"

 

TMontoya

(369 posts)
2. Good for you
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 04:53 PM
Apr 2016

No one cares what you people do. Frankly the Democratic Party does not need nor does it want you bernie or bust types in our party.

Coventina

(27,121 posts)
5. Again, I did not write the article. I posted it because I found it interesting.
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 04:56 PM
Apr 2016

I have not decided for whom I am going to vote.

Coventina

(27,121 posts)
10. Actually, the sad truth of our broken system is that, outside of a handful of swing states
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 05:01 PM
Apr 2016

it matters little what the "minority" party does.

I live in a red state. I have yet to vote in a general election where my vote "mattered".

Only if my state somehow becomes a swing state will it matter.

Response to TMontoya (Reply #7)

onehandle

(51,122 posts)
6. The 'Bernie or Bust' people will be as common as 'PUMAs.'
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 04:56 PM
Apr 2016

In other words, virtually non-existent.

So, not an 'interesting article......'

 

alcibiades_mystery

(36,437 posts)
17. Nobody will remember that there were "Bernie or Bust" cretins by the end of summer
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 05:08 PM
Apr 2016

Non-entity invented by sore losers who will fade with the spring flowers.

 

fluffyclouds

(51 posts)
8. I agree 100%
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 04:58 PM
Apr 2016

A lot of people at my work feel this way too. We're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils.

 

tonyt53

(5,737 posts)
11. Odd how you'd cut your own nose off to spite your own face
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 05:02 PM
Apr 2016

It have let the world know that you, as with most Bernie-ites, are political novices. The Bernie or Bust movement will be gone just as soon as the school year ends at colleges, as that is where most of his followers are. Why does he have so many rallies at those sites? Because he knows he is talking to the politically naive. A better thing to be raising hell about is why Bernie has not helped a single person running for the US Senate this fall. Not the first one, and only three people running for House seats. Democrats won't take the House back until maybe 2020 and more likely 2022. Bernie appears to be so naive himself that he thinks he can get the changes he talks about without the help of the US Senate.

HRC was given that money as speaking fees. Lots of people get fees for speaking to groups. They speak about their life experiences. The most interesting, the more they are paid. The more famous, the more they are paid. Rarely do they ever speak about the business the group may be affiliated with. Rarely. Bernie just doesn't seem to fit the mold of having done anything of interest in his life.

Meteor Man

(385 posts)
20. Without the help of the U.S. Senate
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 05:11 PM
Apr 2016

What are the positions Bernie has taken that the next US. Senate would oppose?

Are you assuming a Democratic Senate majority or a Republican Senate majority?

 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
29. 15% an hour minimum wage and universal healthcare were already shot down in the senate....
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 10:45 PM
Apr 2016

Hillary said a good floor is 12$ BECAUSE IT ALREADY HAS SUPPORT IN THE SENATE.
Not always the smartest thing to pull numbers out of your ass.

 

RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
24. Wow, Tony, utter denial from you
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 07:31 PM
Apr 2016

You actually claim: "Bernie just doesn't seem to fit the mold of having done anything of interest in his life. "

Which is utter denial of the millions of dollars people have contributed to his campaign. Such nonsense as yours has me me worried about some of you.

qdouble

(891 posts)
18. It isn't...
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 05:09 PM
Apr 2016

it's just hilarious to see member's of the losing team constantly dictate how the winners must jump through hoops for their vote.

Some Bernie supporters seem to think every Democrat except Bernie is corrupt. If that's the case, either they aren't democrats or shouldn't be.

Coventina

(27,121 posts)
21. This is why primaries suck. They are played like a team sport and people get blinded by team
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 05:14 PM
Apr 2016

loyalties to the point that the issues get lost in the noise.

That's why I found this particular article interesting, as it seemed to articulate why the "Bernie or Bust" crowd feels as it does.

Most of the time, it just seems like personal attacks on one candidate or the other.

Meteor Man

(385 posts)
22. Wrong question
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 05:22 PM
Apr 2016

The question is not whether or not Bernie can dictate terms if Hillary wins the nomination.

The question is whether or not Hillary and the DNC are interested in getting the votes of Bernie supporters.

Bernie does not own anybody's vote. Without concessions on the platform Bernie's supporters will have several options available to voice their disagreement with the path the DNC has taken the party down.

The defection rate could be anywhere between 25-50%. If Hillary and DWS continue on the take it or leave it path, the percentage will be on the high end. If Bernie is allowed a role in forming the platform, the percentage will be on the low end.

Time will tell.

Coventina

(27,121 posts)
19. You know, I was on an extended absence from DU during '08.
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 05:09 PM
Apr 2016

It wasn't timed for that on my end, it was just the way my personal life and interests were at the time.

In hindsight, I'm pretty glad I wasn't around for all that.

I know I sound like a real DU geezer, but, DU was way nicer when we were fighting a common enemy, GWB.

 

beachbum bob

(10,437 posts)
26. I'm sure nader voters felt the same in 2000 and did not mind
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 10:35 PM
Apr 2016

Giving America bush-cheney....blood is on their hands as they knowing not voted for Gore because their principles were more important than caring for America...

dubyadiprecession

(5,714 posts)
30. BS grass roots support has always been overstated...
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 10:45 PM
Apr 2016

There is no path to win for a candidate that has always been trailing in the popular vote, pledged delegates and now.... in superdelegates.

Winning 1 out of 5 this late. after claiming momentum is on his side, is just plain sad.

 

The Second Stone

(2,900 posts)
33. Vote or don't vote however your choose, but do get the hell out if you won't
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 10:51 PM
Apr 2016

support the party nominee after she gets the nomination. Which is a certainty right now.

Clinton has wiped the floor with Sanders, all the while not rubbing in that he is a first class kook, which the Republicans would certainly not hesitate to do. http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2016/04/polls_say_bernie_is_more_electable_than_hillary_don_t_believe_them.html

Clinton will absolutely destroy Trump in the general. And I will personally accept responsibility if she does not. She will wipe Trump off the map, take back the Senate, and get huge leads in the house. She will attract Republicans from the Republican party to the Democratic Party. And she will appoint liberals (not socialists) to the courts.

Sanders will do none of these things. Because he isn't ever getting elected as President, nor nominated. He is toast and finished.

As you are unwilling to abide by the majority vote (overwhelming majority, but that doesn't matter), start your own little "socialist" party where the popular with the in people and losing candidates can take over. But do leave our party. Please. You are not a Democrat. You are a Socialist. Imposing the will of a small minority on the majority. Shame on you.

Coventina

(27,121 posts)
37. I would advise you to direct your comments to the author of the article.
Wed Apr 27, 2016, 12:12 PM
Apr 2016

But, just out of curiosity, what does "I will personally accept responsibility" mean, exactly?

 

The Second Stone

(2,900 posts)
38. If Trump gets elected over Clinton
Wed Apr 27, 2016, 01:07 PM
Apr 2016

I will admit that it is my fault for not doing enough to promote her. No blaming it on Sanders (or anyone else), but accepting my part as a citizen who can donate and walk precincts.

 

The Second Stone

(2,900 posts)
40. You are certainly welcome. By the way, I'm responsible for the 2003 Iraq War
Wed Apr 27, 2016, 01:12 PM
Apr 2016

and the Presidency of George W. Bush. I did not do enough to stop them.

 

AzDar

(14,023 posts)
35. Bernie has been incredibly gentle... If she is the Nominee all those skeletons are gonna come
Tue Apr 26, 2016, 10:57 PM
Apr 2016

tumbling out...and it will be ugly. She is a horribly weak candidate.

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