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Cary

(11,746 posts)
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:05 PM Apr 2016

The water is perfect, why not stop the whining and take a dip?

This is the current reality:

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/04/poll-republican-disapproval-222586

More than 60 percent of the American public has an unfavorable opinion of the Republican Party, an increase from last fall and the highest that the party’s negative rating has been since 1992.

Sixty-two percent of Americans have an unfavorable impression of the GOP compared to 33 percent who view the party favorably, according to a Pew Research Center study released Thursday. That’s a more negative image of the party than in October, when there was a split of 58 percent unfavorable to 37 percent favorable

American opinion of the Democratic Party, meanwhile, stayed about the same: 45 percent view the party favorably and 50 percent unfavorably. That leaves a quarter of the public with a negative view of both parties, an increase from past presidential election years.

Pew found that the falling image of the GOP mostly came from people who identified as Republican, 68 percent of whom had a favorable view of their own party versus 79 percent in October.

In contrast, 88 percent of Democrats have a favorable view of their own party. And more independents – 37 percent to 28 percent – have a favorable image of the Democratic Party compared to the GOP.

Women, blacks, Hispanics and white college graduates were all more likely to have a favorable view of the Democratic Party.

For the study, Pew surveyed 2,008 people by telephone between April 12 and 19. The overall margin of error is plus or minus 2.5 percentage points.



In other words, a lot of people hate the Republican establishment and a lot of people like ours. Contrary to a lot of nonsense being posted here, we're in great shape and we're poised to do some great things.

Wouldn't it be nice if people who wanted the same great things put down the discord and discontent for awhile and rolled over "conservatives" and put that dangerous ideology back into the trash heap where it belongs?

For all of the swarming and abuse, few of you disagree with me on policy. And now that Sanders isn't going to be president what's the point of the trash talk?

You know what? I am sick and tired of bitching and moaning, and saying we suck and we need to be great again. We live in a great nation and we can do great things. Life is good. We can make it a lot better. We are in a great position to do that.
79 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The water is perfect, why not stop the whining and take a dip? (Original Post) Cary Apr 2016 OP
Half the people polled don't like the Dems Kelvin Mace Apr 2016 #1
88 percent of dems have a favorable view Bluerome Apr 2016 #2
Ummm, from the article Kelvin Mace Apr 2016 #6
You just corrected yourself: JaneyVee Apr 2016 #28
Bazanga! rock Apr 2016 #46
It includes people who will be voting, half a of whom don't like Dems. Kelvin Mace Apr 2016 #49
You're not reading it right Bluerome Apr 2016 #77
Half the population is Republican? Citation, please. Kelvin Mace Apr 2016 #79
As soon as Hillary is cleared by the FBI we can talk about IdaBriggs Apr 2016 #3
The FBI doesn't clear people Cary Apr 2016 #5
That's right - they investigate CRIME. IdaBriggs Apr 2016 #9
If I owned this site I wouldn't allow "conservative" disinformation to be propagated here Cary Apr 2016 #13
Good thing you don't, then. Lizzie Poppet Apr 2016 #34
So you think it's good to propagate "conservative" disinformation Cary Apr 2016 #37
Nope! Care to try again? Lizzie Poppet Apr 2016 #40
Bad News: I'm a well informed Democrat. IdaBriggs Apr 2016 #51
Well-informed Democrats don't use Fox News as the sole source of an OP. emulatorloo Apr 2016 #52
Disagree. But if you want to kick the post so more people IdaBriggs Apr 2016 #54
Sorry Ida, I have been reading you for years and respect you a lot emulatorloo Apr 2016 #58
You're wrong pinebox Apr 2016 #60
Of course you would say that. emulatorloo Apr 2016 #62
Try again pinebox Apr 2016 #63
Either of our candidates can beat Trump. Or Cruz. emulatorloo Apr 2016 #64
I agree with you partially, which is why I gave the caveats on the FOX IdaBriggs Apr 2016 #67
Thanks for the long reply emulatorloo Apr 2016 #74
FBI is a conservative controlled part of government? Gwhittey Apr 2016 #68
You are literally taking the side of Citizens United and Judicial Watch JaneyVee Apr 2016 #29
here's the problem ibegurpard Apr 2016 #4
Sorry that's not my problem Cary Apr 2016 #8
The daily struggle of the middle and working classes is not your problem. frylock Apr 2016 #11
"The only path is through us" Who exactly is "us"? angstlessk Apr 2016 #21
Us is the Democratic Party Cary Apr 2016 #38
I am a Democrat who voted for Bernie angstlessk Apr 2016 #43
It is your problem, just gullible I guess. nt Logical Apr 2016 #33
Nope. Not my problem. Cary Apr 2016 #39
i cant explain it any better. Look up gullible. nt Logical Apr 2016 #55
"then go away" Lizzie Poppet Apr 2016 #35
It's not working out for you Cary Apr 2016 #42
Okay, now you're just randomly posting insupid cliches. Lizzie Poppet Apr 2016 #45
Ummm...pretty sure Hillz is all for overturning Citizens United JaneyVee Apr 2016 #30
if you're not actually paid ibegurpard Apr 2016 #73
One more thing the American people don't like pdsimdars Apr 2016 #7
HRC has an unfavorable rating of ~60%, which is fine???!! sadoldgirl Apr 2016 #10
I'd be happy to take a dip once someone unshackles the anvil attached to my leg. n/t winter is coming Apr 2016 #12
The only one that can let go of your dead weight is you Cary Apr 2016 #16
True. I am considering changing my party affiliation. n/t winter is coming Apr 2016 #17
I see Cary Apr 2016 #19
Amazing Cary Apr 2016 #14
And they wonder why they suck at coalition building. JaneyVee Apr 2016 #32
#ComeHateWithUs (Yeah, that doesn't really have a good ring to it, does it?) NurseJackie Apr 2016 #72
I really don't think Clinton can lose to Trump. Vattel Apr 2016 #15
The primary is over Cary Apr 2016 #18
Oh please, your post was far from friendly. Vattel Apr 2016 #20
"Everyone" never agrees on anything Cary Apr 2016 #23
you have really low standards for friendliness. Vattel Apr 2016 #25
What did I do to you? Cary Apr 2016 #26
I insulted you? I said that your OP isn't friendly (which is obvious). Vattel Apr 2016 #44
You should understand it, you create much of it as your transparency page demonstrates Bluenorthwest Apr 2016 #65
Trump wasn't supposed to get this far. And he's agaisnt the TPP which Unicorn Apr 2016 #31
Fair enough, but I guess I think he has burned too many bridges to be viable in the GE. Vattel Apr 2016 #47
I hope you are right. I however don't trust him. He should have never gotten this far. Unicorn Apr 2016 #48
It was all a act anyway. He only did it to help Hillary Gwhittey Apr 2016 #69
"88 percent of Democrats have a favorable view of their own party" Unicorn Apr 2016 #22
Post removed Post removed Apr 2016 #24
I'm sorry I took you off ignore. Unicorn Apr 2016 #27
"disaffected mopes, whiners, and losers" Lizzie Poppet Apr 2016 #36
More of that friendly attitude shining through. Contrary1 Apr 2016 #41
It's what got him banned a few years ago. n/t QC Apr 2016 #61
Are we talking "policy" like DWS, who votes to send medical marijuana users to prison? Warren DeMontague Apr 2016 #50
Bullshit. Splinter Cell Apr 2016 #53
Would that water be before or after fracking? laruemtt Apr 2016 #56
You sound like the governor of Michigan talking about Flint. TheFarseer Apr 2016 #57
Us Democrats suck less and HRC supporters are happy with that. aikoaiko Apr 2016 #59
The "water" you speak of is soiled with runoff from fracking, VulgarPoet Apr 2016 #66
Wow. That is actually poetry. I read it, read it again, IdaBriggs Apr 2016 #70
You flatter me, Ida :) VulgarPoet Apr 2016 #71
Did I get the breaks right? Seriously, please post it! IdaBriggs Apr 2016 #75
The breaks all appear to be in the right places, although it's kind of funny VulgarPoet Apr 2016 #76
That's what the authorities told everyone in Flint Fumesucker Apr 2016 #78
 

Kelvin Mace

(17,469 posts)
1. Half the people polled don't like the Dems
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:15 PM
Apr 2016

and you think that's cause for celebration?

"We suck less than the Republicans!" is not a very inspiring slogan.

Bluerome

(129 posts)
2. 88 percent of dems have a favorable view
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:24 PM
Apr 2016

of their party. "half the people" you refer to are republicans.

 

Kelvin Mace

(17,469 posts)
6. Ummm, from the article
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:37 PM
Apr 2016
American opinion of the Democratic Party, meanwhile, stayed about the same: 45 percent view the party favorably and 50 percent unfavorably.

That would seem to include Right/Left/Independents.
 

Kelvin Mace

(17,469 posts)
49. It includes people who will be voting, half a of whom don't like Dems.
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:58 PM
Apr 2016

Again "We suck less!" is nothing to celebrate.

Bluerome

(129 posts)
77. You're not reading it right
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 01:18 PM
Apr 2016

Half the country is republican, so naturally when polling all Americans, half will have an unfavorable view of the dem party

 

Kelvin Mace

(17,469 posts)
79. Half the population is Republican? Citation, please.
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 02:43 PM
Apr 2016

According to Gallup:

An average 43% of Americans identified politically as independents in 2014, establishing a new high in Gallup telephone poll trends back to 1988. In terms of national identification with the two major parties, Democrats continued to hold a modest edge over Republicans, 30% to 26%.

Republicans are 26% of the population.

According to Pew Research:

The share of independents in the public, which long ago surpassed the percentages of either Democrats or Republicans, continues to increase. Based on 2014 data, 39% identify as independents, 32% as Democrats and 23% as Republicans.

Republicans are 23% of the population.

 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
3. As soon as Hillary is cleared by the FBI we can talk about
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:31 PM
Apr 2016

her lying and general untrustworthiness as a candidate. We can share our feelings about how her take on LGBT marriage ("Should New York recognize it?" "NO!&quot , flip-flopping on guns, her willingness to consider a constitutional amendment with abortion restrictions, whether she intends to take us to war with Iran, her belief in a minimum wage of $12/$15, how her secret knowledge of Walmart meant she didn't participate in screwing the working class, and whether big banks need to be disbursed before their bad decision making tanks the economy AGAIN.

Yes, there is a Hillary for EVERYBODY - how can people not see it?

Cary

(11,746 posts)
5. The FBI doesn't clear people
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:35 PM
Apr 2016

That's OK. You are invited to the Party but we will be just fine without you.

Enjoy your whine.

 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
9. That's right - they investigate CRIME.
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:39 PM
Apr 2016

And since they've spent a year with "Hillary's Server Issues" as the target....

You can join the indictment party!

Cary

(11,746 posts)
13. If I owned this site I wouldn't allow "conservative" disinformation to be propagated here
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:44 PM
Apr 2016

There are plenty of "conservative" sites where hatred of Hillary Clinton would be welcomed. I don't understand why Democrats should have to see it here.

 

Lizzie Poppet

(10,164 posts)
34. Good thing you don't, then.
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:17 PM
Apr 2016

Just having a "D" in back of her name doesn't shield Hillary Clinton from criticism or from questions about her integrity, questions that have damn good reasons to be asked.

 

Lizzie Poppet

(10,164 posts)
40. Nope! Care to try again?
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:23 PM
Apr 2016

ProTip: avoiding "straw man" fallacies will go a long way towards more accurate assessment of text.

 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
51. Bad News: I'm a well informed Democrat.
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 08:55 PM
Apr 2016

And everything I said is true, complete with video links.

And praise be the joy because the convention isn't over and we can still boot her from the ticket.

emulatorloo

(44,124 posts)
52. Well-informed Democrats don't use Fox News as the sole source of an OP.
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 09:10 PM
Apr 2016

As they understand that Fox News is a disinformation organization.

 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
54. Disagree. But if you want to kick the post so more people
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 09:37 PM
Apr 2016

can see the evidence of Hillary's lies, go for it.

I shared information that was verifiable to explain why a previously questionable source was shockingly being filled with ACTUAL NEWS. It turns out there is a change in management going on, which may be explaining the gradual shift (not talking about their commentators).

But if you can't figure out what the post was about/only ever listen to one side of the story, it's no wonder you believe in demonizing one side and sanctifying the other, which requires turning a blind eye to actual reality.

And oh by the way, I have used links from The New York Times, Washington Post, ABC, CNN, Huffington Post, Time Magazine and NPR (plus a dozen more off the top of my head) in other threads on the topic, and they all say the same thing: She's guilty.

Like I said, I'm well informed. You can be surprised. I heard Nixon's followers were, too, and they voted him in AFTER Watergate.

History does repeat itself; Hillary looks like some karmic payback because we all thought the Democrats were the good guys.

Almost Anybody can be bought.

Sigh.

emulatorloo

(44,124 posts)
58. Sorry Ida, I have been reading you for years and respect you a lot
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 08:48 AM
Apr 2016

The only ones pushing 'she will be indicted' are Fox News and other right-wing outlets.

Members of my family have been lied to for years by Fox News. My sister went a potential 2008 Obama voter to being convinced Obama was 'evil'

We know from studies that Fox viewers are fed disinformation and believe things that aren't true.

I too have heard that there is a change in management. Yet Roger Ailes is still in charge. Same old same old RNC/GOP propagandist.

"But if you can't figure out what the post was about/only ever listen to one side of the story, it's no wonder you believe in demonizing one side and sanctifying the other, which requires turning a blind eye to actual reality."

No Ida, I don't "demonize one side and sanctify another." My educational background is media analysis. Fox is not a reputable news source.

You and I both want Bernie to be President. Rightwing media is not our friend.

Have a nice day.



emulatorloo

(44,124 posts)
62. Of course you would say that.
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 09:05 AM
Apr 2016

You brought Ann Coulter to DU and claimed she was a truth-teller.

The enemy of my 'enemy' is not my friend. When Bernie gets nominated those fuckers will be all over him. Will Fox News still be a great source when they lie and shit on Bernie?

Thanks for the link to the Cenk article, will read it.

 

pinebox

(5,761 posts)
63. Try again
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 09:08 AM
Apr 2016

I said Coulter did what?
She said Bernie would be harder to beat than Hillary. Is she wrong? Straight up, yes or no.
See how that works? Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

She was correct.

emulatorloo

(44,124 posts)
64. Either of our candidates can beat Trump. Or Cruz.
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 09:13 AM
Apr 2016

I don't take advice from or promote liars like Coulter.

Of course Bernie would be the better President.

Have a nice day and again thanks for the link.

 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
67. I agree with you partially, which is why I gave the caveats on the FOX
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 09:47 AM
Apr 2016

material but I ended up convinced she is heading for indictment several weeks before I clicked on any of their links. My first visit there was for a copy of the IG letter confirming she was lying/being misleading about the "classified" information. I then checked out the two reporters who got leaked that, and discovered they had been leaked other stuff that was verifiable, too.

My father was involved in law enforcement, which believe it or not, actually makes me exceedingly cynical about it. Oddly enough, I still trust the FBI (even though I think the Martha Stewart thing was ridiculous).

At the end of the day, one of us is going to be wrong. I support Bernie - he's stunningly awesome - and believe Hillary is going to be out (with my guesstimate being before Memorial Day for a variety of reasons).

One of the classes I took in college was called "Popular Culture" and dealt with how propaganda is spread, so yes, I get the FAUX thing - but never forget that even big corporations are made up of people who want to do their jobs, and in this case, that means "investigative reporting". We are a two party system, and it is the job of both parties to keep the other in check.

Peace between us? I know I am a bit prickly over the FOX thing, but I still feel justified in having written it for a variety of reasons.

Also, I don't watch them (we cut the cable a few years ago), so not brainwashed by them.

emulatorloo

(44,124 posts)
74. Thanks for the long reply
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 10:08 AM
Apr 2016

Peace between us? Of course!

Bernie will be a great President! Clinton was too conservative for me in '08, continues to be too conservative for me now.

Obviously I am a bit prickly over Fox thing as well LOL.

I too trust the FBI to do a thorough job. I also believe nobody knows anything about the investigation but the FBI.

So what I don't trust is 'interpretation' of right-wing media outlets that are pushing the 'she will be indicted' theme. Basically IMHO they are talking out of their asses, and doing what they do for a living: smearing Democrats. To me the script is very obvious. I've seen this movie way too many times before.

That being said, we are both trusting our gut instincts on the 'she will be indicted' thing. Nothing wrong with that.

Take care

 

Gwhittey

(1,377 posts)
68. FBI is a conservative controlled part of government?
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 09:51 AM
Apr 2016

Or is it the DOJ? I know Obama is not a ideal liberal but he is far less conservative than Hillary is, so not fair to say he had AG start this investigation because he is conservative.

 

JaneyVee

(19,877 posts)
29. You are literally taking the side of Citizens United and Judicial Watch
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:10 PM
Apr 2016

Which is why we literally cant take anything you say seriously. Turn off the Fox news.

ibegurpard

(16,685 posts)
4. here's the problem
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:34 PM
Apr 2016

We apparently don't want the same things. Influence peddling in politics is the number one impediment to getting public policy that is of the most benefit to the middle and working classes. You support candidates who refuse to challenge that problem. Therefore you are my opponent.

Cary

(11,746 posts)
8. Sorry that's not my problem
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:38 PM
Apr 2016

If you choose to make it your problem as you have then go away, because the only path is through us.

That was always true, and will always be true. That is reality. That is the facts of life.

angstlessk

(11,862 posts)
21. "The only path is through us" Who exactly is "us"?
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:58 PM
Apr 2016

"go away" so are you saying anyone with a differing view should just "go away"...sounds fascistic to me?

 

Lizzie Poppet

(10,164 posts)
45. Okay, now you're just randomly posting insupid cliches.
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:29 PM
Apr 2016

Bored now...I was hoping for at least a vaguely plausible challenge. Silly of me, given the source. Another Brockian on Ignore.

Bye Felicia...

 

JaneyVee

(19,877 posts)
30. Ummm...pretty sure Hillz is all for overturning Citizens United
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:11 PM
Apr 2016

Especially since they are the fuckers who shes battling in court.

Cary

(11,746 posts)
14. Amazing
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:48 PM
Apr 2016

So much hate, for no real reason.

I feel sorry for haters. I am so happy I don't hate like that.

 

JaneyVee

(19,877 posts)
32. And they wonder why they suck at coalition building.
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:12 PM
Apr 2016

No one passes their purity tests and they just throw baby out with the bath water.

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
72. #ComeHateWithUs (Yeah, that doesn't really have a good ring to it, does it?)
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 10:03 AM
Apr 2016

Maybe they've learned a lesson, that they'll probably remember for exactly 3.9 years.

Cary

(11,746 posts)
18. The primary is over
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:51 PM
Apr 2016

I invited the disaffected. I was being positive and it was a friendly gesture.

But you see that they can't let go of their anxiety. I feel sorry for them.

 

Vattel

(9,289 posts)
20. Oh please, your post was far from friendly.
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 06:55 PM
Apr 2016

Bottom line: not everyone agrees with your rosy picture of the party.

Cary

(11,746 posts)
23. "Everyone" never agrees on anything
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:01 PM
Apr 2016

I don't need "everyone." "Everyone" is a dysfunctional standard.

If you don't find it friendly that's your problem not mine. All I need in a democracy is a plurality and my numbers show that I have that. Given the attitude of the losers my invitation was most generous and most friendly.

The facts of life are the facts of life. Healthy people grow up and accept them.

Cary

(11,746 posts)
26. What did I do to you?
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:06 PM
Apr 2016

You insist on insulting me for no reason and tell me I'm not friendly?

Good grief. I really don't understand the rudeness here.

 

Vattel

(9,289 posts)
44. I insulted you? I said that your OP isn't friendly (which is obvious).
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:28 PM
Apr 2016

You may be a very friendly person. I have no idea.

 

Unicorn

(424 posts)
31. Trump wasn't supposed to get this far. And he's agaisnt the TPP which
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:12 PM
Apr 2016

means I would keep my job instead of lose it to H1Bs who already take up a lot of jobs in the tech industry. While I wouldn't vote for him, others who want to keep their jobs and thus their homes, probably will.

 

Vattel

(9,289 posts)
47. Fair enough, but I guess I think he has burned too many bridges to be viable in the GE.
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:31 PM
Apr 2016

I hope I am not wrong. My opinion of this country would really sink if he were elected.

 

Unicorn

(424 posts)
48. I hope you are right. I however don't trust him. He should have never gotten this far.
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:33 PM
Apr 2016

I can't believe women are voting for him.

 

Gwhittey

(1,377 posts)
69. It was all a act anyway. He only did it to help Hillary
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 09:59 AM
Apr 2016

Trump even slipped up once at start of the primaries and said that he called Bill and asked him if he should run, and Bill said yes. Now why in hell would Bill Clinton say yes he should run when his wife was? Because either politics is just a game to distract the masses into thinking there is much difference between two parties or they want Trump running as a act.

 

Unicorn

(424 posts)
22. "88 percent of Democrats have a favorable view of their own party"
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 07:00 PM
Apr 2016

"And more independents – 37 percent to 28 percent – have a favorable image of the Democratic Party compared to the GOP. "


I'm not trusting the corporate media or the polls.

It's all rigged.

Response to Unicorn (Reply #22)

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
50. Are we talking "policy" like DWS, who votes to send medical marijuana users to prison?
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 08:04 PM
Apr 2016

Or Sen. Merkley, Rep. Blumenauer, Lt. Gov Newsom, etc. who favor legalization?

Splinter Cell

(703 posts)
53. Bullshit.
Thu Apr 28, 2016, 09:26 PM
Apr 2016

When half the country hates our party and half the country hates their party, it's going to come down to personality. That's not a battle Hillary wants to have to fight. But you keep suckin' down that Kool-Aide.

VulgarPoet

(2,872 posts)
66. The "water" you speak of is soiled with runoff from fracking,
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 09:30 AM
Apr 2016

the blood of innocents, and the powder of munitions we keep selling to Saudi Arabia-- who need I remind you, created the very same brand of Islam that ISIS worships.

The water is only perfect if you're blindfolded.

 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
70. Wow. That is actually poetry. I read it, read it again,
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 10:00 AM
Apr 2016

And then looked at your user name. It fits.

You said,
The water is perfect,
why not stop the whining
and take a dip?

The "water" you speak of
is soiled
with runoff from fracking,
the blood of innocents,
and the powder of munitions
we keep selling to Saudi Arabia--
who need I remind you,
created the very same brand of Islam
that ISIS worships.

The water is only perfect
if you're blindfolded.


-- VulgarPoet


Beautiful!!!
 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
75. Did I get the breaks right? Seriously, please post it!
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 10:09 AM
Apr 2016

I have now re-read it six times - that is some POWERFUL imagery!

VulgarPoet

(2,872 posts)
76. The breaks all appear to be in the right places, although it's kind of funny
Fri Apr 29, 2016, 10:14 AM
Apr 2016

I actually did not mean to go full poet mode there. Just kinda... Slips out.

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