Your ignorance is showing.

You seem have the market cornered when it comes to ignorance.

It sure sounds like a counteracted trade deal for Walmart.

See what I did there.

Childish deflection.

Because everyone comes to the table wanting that.

digitalization and large container ships. The world has gotten smaller. No Houdini will appear to reverse that basic reality.

I'm not voting for him in the next Massachusetts Presidential primary.

He's getting uglier and uglier with his attacks on poor people -- or as he calls it, "desperate people all over the world." I suppose it does resonate with the "greedy" American, Nationalistic, America First types.

Good point, in order to be 'good' DEM one must toe the corp line eh?

I despise the hatred of poor people in foreign countries so many of Sanders' supporters exhibit. They look at them as worthless scabs and competition.

'I despise the hatred of poor people in foreign countries so many of Sanders' supporters exhibit'
Care to validate this with facts?

You do realize you're supporting a candidate that enabled corps to exploit workers within those foreign countries with these very trade agreements?

'They look at them as worthless scabs and competition.'
You do realize those foreign countries work force wouldn't be a factor without the 'benefit' of those trade agreements right?

But I get that the projection you're replying with here is 'required' as cover for the very entity that enabled this 'scenario' let alone the politicians that crafted the legislation that 'created' the entity, each time someone points this fact out corporatist enablers pivot or deflect away from these simple facts... hence this: 'Actually, I'm for taxing the hell out of corporations making profits overseas. BUT'

'But' indeed....

the countries will get out of poverty, just like the USA did 100 years or so ago. Sure, corporations should pay more, and they should be forced to. But, 30 cents an hour in a country like Vietnam is better than zero, and that income will grow. Heck, maybe some of the so-calledd "International" unions will go to those countries when it gets to a point where the people can pay enough in dues. Fact is, the folks who are so against trade don't give a flying dung about poor people in foreign countries -- it's all about here. We will all be better off as the world improves. Otherwise, we can just sit here and watch things get worse everywhere.

'But, 30 cents an hour in a country like Vietnam is better than zero, and that income will grow'

Wow... am I speaking with DEM or GOP ideology here?

Again corporatist governance in action folks... the reply you gave is rife with it and it reeks

anywhere near 30 cents an hour. I'm not talking about 30 cents forever, I'm talking about getting investment in those countries so people get a job, get some training, and do better over time. Otherwise, they won't get anywhere.

And, in case you missed it, I'm for taxing the hell out of corporate profits and offering incentives for them to pay better, improve environmental protections, etc.

Keeping everything for ourselves is what is un-democratic, and a reason we are in so many wars. We live in a big world. Time to start acting like it.

To pretend that NOT exploiting cheap overseas workers is anti-humanitarian.

It is galacticly stupid. It encourages American workers to lie down and take the shafting in solidarity with their brethren overseas.

It is evil.

fuck this argument.

our share of the world's resources and wealth, and many of those against world trade were fine with that. In fact, they want more. I suggest we get on board with helping the world grow, because it will help us too.

onward, dogs!

Yeah, fuck that argument sideways and twice on Sundays.

Can you think of any way to help workers in other countries that _doesn't_ involve fucking over our own middle class?


I'll give you a few minutes.

Last edited Fri May 6, 2016, 01:19 PM - Edit history (1)

society. It will help foreign countries and us. I also support incentives for corporations that pay better and promote environmental improvements in foreign countries (here too).

Here's a thought experiment for you. Try looking long-term, and from the perspective of the poor in foreign countries. Look at a rapidly improving world and how we would participate in that.

Finally, the middle-class here can take care of themselves. We don't need to screw the world to protect ourselves. I'm tired of folks' concern about the middle-class when they didn't give a darn about the poor for decades.

ugh. We've just been doing a 36 year experiment that proves this is untrue. The middle class in this country was put together, made possible, by a very specific set of policies. It was not an accident. And, not accidentally, when you get rid of those policies, the middle class melts away like our polar ice caps.

also " tax the hell out of corporate profits": ha ha ha ha ah ha ha hah ahaha h ahah h aha h

I know that you think that being a wage slave for a global corporation is an amazing fate for a poor foreign worker. I would say let's make it so that global corporations are not allowed to ruthlessly exploit people for their profits, no matter where those people live.

Having a middle class is its own benefit.

Otherwise, it's just feudalism, which seems perfect for you.

Nobody's buying the globalistic claptrap anymore.

Most Americans are the world's 1%ers when you you look at it from some poor peasants viewpoint. Yet, the greedy Americans, just want more. I'm fine with America's poor wanting/deserving more. However, I don't think most of the people pushing Nationalism, America First here, are America's poor.

Someone being poor somewhere else doesn't put a roof over anyone's head, or food on the table for their kids. That is AVOIDANCE of the issue. That won't cut it.

Maybe you can be magnanimous with your own funds. We need policies here that will help the poor here keep body and soul together.

When people here work full time and can't get by according to the cost of living here, the system has failed. And when they can't find jobs here at all, the system has failed. It is up to those who design the system to make it work for the most vulnerable.

That's what Bernie is speaking to, and I'm glad he's doing it. Global trade is one of the policies that is killing people here, and it has to stop.

No, Bernie is saying screw the rest of the world and protect our middle-class. He's not speaking very much about the poor.

We don't need to trade for much of anything because unlike many other nations, we are our own market. We are the biggest consumer market in the world. Other nations need to trade with us, not vice versa.

Hauling everything all over the world isn't a very good idea for the climate, either. In fact, it's assinine. In our grocery stores now there is almost no produce grown in the US. Many of our states, including mine, are big agricultural states (or used to be) and yet the tomatoes in our stores are from Mexico or Chile. I really look, and I rarely find anything grown in the US, let alone in our state. That is quite simply idiotic. Not to mention suicidal as far as climate change is concerned. It takes fuel to haul everything around the world for no reason. Of course that's great for fuel stocks and transportation stocks and agribusiness. But the millions of family farms started by Lincoln's homesteading are gone.

Global trade is a loser for everyone except for the 1%. Well they are fat enough. It's time for the drunken party to end.

enough for "free" health care, basic wage, increased social security, "free" education, etc. If we'd stopped urbanizing in the 1930s and 1940s, maybe we'd all be fine growing our own food. But we didn't stop, nor did the population stop growing, nor did people stop wanting a bigger house, more of this and that, etc.

I'd be fine to go back to my granddad's 1950s small farm, outhouse and all. But, I don't think most people would be.

How is it then, that we could afford free college when I went for free in 1968? Were we so rich then? Declining population? I'm part of the baby boom!

And nobody has to grow their own food, we had supermarkets before global trade, and the food in them was almost 100% grown here in the US. We have two states which have year-round growing seasons, California and Florida, which used to supply anything that wasn't in season locally, yet all of the produce in our stores now is from Mexico or South America. We had millions of family farms scattered all over in lots of states, providing a good living for those families and growing our food locally and regionally which have been foreclosed now, driven under by agribusiness which ruins the environment. We had lots of industries which are gone, God help us if we ever have to gear up for a WW2 type of effort again. It takes a lot to replace what has been so casually destroyed.

That doesn't mean that the destruction shouldn't stop. And it doesn't mean that it shouldn't be reversed. We know how to do these things, we just need to do them over again. The sooner we turn around and start in the right direction, the sooner it gets better.

Time to get used to it.

won't help people here one bit.

instead of blathering away about what everyone else should be doing.

Hes is just a natural born leader. Its what they do.

yes, committees are required to coordinate research, recommend/write policy and formulate implementation strategies and figure out costs and make financial suggestions to Congress. Get a clue.

of Sanders' work in the house and senate, for decades.

You know nothing of his work. And you keep yourself in ignorance.

that kind of annonymity is pretty sad.

I've been listening to him speak, reading his words, watching his speeches, for a long time now. His work has been highlighted by lots of actual progressives, including Thom Hartmann, Amy Goodman, Bill Moyers, the Young Turks.

You should find something out about actual progressives. you'd be surprised if you actually pay attention to what you might learn - there are people like Sanders who actually have been fighting the good fight and making actual, strong, contributions to the fight to keep this country less shitty.

That you don't know anything about him is a shame on you, not him.

sorry.

But...karma IS a bitch. And NAFTA has been catching up to the Clinton's and the republicans.

She's a corporatist through and through and will continue to push policies that hurt the American worker.

presidential strategy: become a billionaire. i don't imagine much else will be on the platform.