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Renew Deal

(81,877 posts)
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:32 AM May 2016

Bernie would have lost West Virginia without the Trump supporters

An exit poll yesterday stated that 44% of Bernie voters in WV were mischievous Trump supporters. If you remove those 44% from the pool, Bernie loses WV by 17K votes.

Bernie vote total: 120,236
Revised vote total: 67,332
Hillary vote total: 84,181

People will say that this is the effect of semi-open primaries and there might be truth to that.

http://www.thegreenpapers.com/P16/WV-D#0510

59 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Bernie would have lost West Virginia without the Trump supporters (Original Post) Renew Deal May 2016 OP
Hillary wouldn't be anywhere without 23 years of name-recognition. pangaia May 2016 #1
23 years of name recognition AND a lifetime of prepping to run for the Presidency. merrily May 2016 #6
+1,495, 699 pangaia May 2016 #10
That assessment applies to all politicians not just Clinton. n/t asuhornets May 2016 #21
I disagree. Some are even adamant about NOT running for President. merrily May 2016 #24
No. It does not. Most, perhaps yes. But not all. pangaia May 2016 #45
Yea OK.. asuhornets May 2016 #46
Change the subjest and throuw out talking points from page 23. pangaia May 2016 #48
Where in Bernie Sander's track record that has shown he is willing asuhornets May 2016 #49
Not all got to marry a governor and President though n/t SheenaR May 2016 #51
... and a lifetime of progressive actions and some not so progressive uponit7771 May 2016 #35
The Former First Lady... NewImproved Deal May 2016 #39
exactly - and that name-recognition was achieved by serving in the Senate, serving as SoS, etc DrDan May 2016 #59
Suddenly, Hillary supporters believe exit polls for the first time in this primary I can recall. merrily May 2016 #2
Have Bernie supporters ever believed in Exit Polls or just when he's winning? Renew Deal May 2016 #4
Some of us, though not I, have cited exit polls after almost every primary in this rigged race, and merrily May 2016 #9
Let me refresh your memory Renew Deal May 2016 #13
You'll have to give me a bit more help. Which point are you supposedly refreshing my memory about? merrily May 2016 #31
Do you want the law to be changed? egalitegirl May 2016 #3
Blah blah blah whatchamacallit May 2016 #5
+1 vintx May 2016 #12
"Mischievous" Trump supporters... GummyBearz May 2016 #7
You've got it exactly right! Shemp Howard May 2016 #42
Democrats without Sanders will lose West Virginia lumberjack_jeff May 2016 #8
Do you believe Sanders will win WV in the GE? Renew Deal May 2016 #15
More people voted for democrats than for Trump. lumberjack_jeff May 2016 #18
The republicans didn't have a competitive race Renew Deal May 2016 #22
We would never win WVA Demsrule86 May 2016 #27
What percentage of Hillary voters will vote Trump in the GE? ieoeja May 2016 #11
10% of Clinton voters in WV said they would vote for Trump in November. And in a way, that's worse, thesquanderer May 2016 #44
Let's hope you're not whining the same thing in November FBaggins May 2016 #14
Hillary has not shunned anyone Renew Deal May 2016 #17
The funny thing is that you seem to think that Hillary supporters get to decide that. FBaggins May 2016 #25
Think about it. If you want Trump to win you would vote for Hill. peace13 May 2016 #16
Read what you wrote Renew Deal May 2016 #19
+1, they've stopped listening to even themselves... I'm done with em... I thought I was more uponit7771 May 2016 #37
Ahhh no. The headline is Trump supporters vote for Bernie. peace13 May 2016 #40
I am convinced that Bernie Demsrule86 May 2016 #30
Call it what you will. peace13 May 2016 #38
Kindness and Love abounds. frylock May 2016 #55
The "new McGovern" was predicted to MAYBE win one state in the primaries. frylock May 2016 #54
You noticed! nt Jitter65 May 2016 #20
It was ABBH, given what she said about putting the coal mines out of business and the Autumn May 2016 #23
Interesting point Renew Deal May 2016 #29
Yes, there is no such thing as clean coal and I am dead set against fracking. Autumn May 2016 #34
The GOP clearly wants Bernie to be their opposition, no matter who they nominate. onehandle May 2016 #26
The ads write themselves. frylock May 2016 #56
Predatory Capitalism needs a sprinkle of Socialism to keep it in check. B Calm May 2016 #58
David Brock amborin May 2016 #28
Works for me. Hope the same thing happens rateyes May 2016 #32
His net gain of 2-3 delegates is the only saving grace in this debacle. nt Sheepshank May 2016 #33
Hillary beat Obama because he is black. Bernie beat Hillary WhiteTara May 2016 #36
Of course KingFlorez May 2016 #41
And Hillary would be losing without all the money from Republican billionaires Doctor_J May 2016 #43
excuses aren't going to win this thing for Hill any faster than insults did GreatGazoo May 2016 #47
She lost West Virginia so you need to come up with some reason for that, I get that. Bluenorthwest May 2016 #50
In other words, Bernie won the WV primary big time. Thanks for reminding us. floriduck May 2016 #52
And if every primary were open Hillary would have dropped out after NY. Tax payers B Calm May 2016 #53
^^^ This^^^ -none May 2016 #57

pangaia

(24,324 posts)
10. +1,495, 699
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:38 AM
May 2016

Plus the rulers of the world....

Bernie is the biggest threat to them in my lifetime, and I went to JFK's funeral.

The last one?.... FDR.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
24. I disagree. Some are even adamant about NOT running for President.
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:45 AM
May 2016

Some come to the ambition much later in life than did Hillary. Some are able to run on lifelong principles. Some say anything they think will get them votes. They are not all the same. Sorry.

pangaia

(24,324 posts)
45. No. It does not. Most, perhaps yes. But not all.
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:15 AM
May 2016

And Bernard Sanders is the very, very rare exception

In my view, Clinton is 'ambitious' in the way Julius Caesar was ambitious. She has WANTED this position for decades. It is about her first and foremost.

Sanders is not doing this because of personal ambition. He is doing it for the benefit of other human beings.

asuhornets

(2,405 posts)
46. Yea OK..
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:18 AM
May 2016

Hillary is qualified. As far as Bernie Sanders, he does not understand everything he wants to do requires hard work and money.. Speaking only to young people at rallies instead of small groups is not going to cut it. Where are all these new voters he was talking about.

pangaia

(24,324 posts)
48. Change the subjest and throuw out talking points from page 23.
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:23 AM
May 2016

Hillary may be intellectually qualified, but her decisions have, in may cases, been disastrous for human beings. The REALLY big ones, especially. She is all about positioning.....in my view.


Sanders does very well understand hard work and what it takes.. What in the WORLD are you talking about? THAT is a new one.

asuhornets

(2,405 posts)
49. Where in Bernie Sander's track record that has shown he is willing
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:27 AM
May 2016

to go to POC communities and discuss their issues-he has not. Or where has Sanders visited a woman organizations to talk about pay disparities--he has not. He gives the same speech at all his rallies..

 

NewImproved Deal

(534 posts)
39. The Former First Lady...
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:00 AM
May 2016

...is America's Imelda Marcos. She'd be a third-tier corporate lawyer had she not hitched her fortunes to William Jefferson Clinton.

[link:|

DrDan

(20,411 posts)
59. exactly - and that name-recognition was achieved by serving in the Senate, serving as SoS, etc
Thu May 12, 2016, 06:43 AM
May 2016

merrily

(45,251 posts)
2. Suddenly, Hillary supporters believe exit polls for the first time in this primary I can recall.
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:33 AM
May 2016

BTW, I believe the correct term is semi-closed, not semi-open.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
9. Some of us, though not I, have cited exit polls after almost every primary in this rigged race, and
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:38 AM
May 2016

were mocked to dismissed every time. I don't recall Hillary's supporters citing a single exit poll before this one, though. But, suddenly an exit poll is gospel. Seems transparent and, candidly, laughable.

Renew Deal

(81,877 posts)
13. Let me refresh your memory
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:40 AM
May 2016
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1107116364

How do you feel about the WV exit poll now that you have been reminded that Hillary supporters cited exit polls in the past?

merrily

(45,251 posts)
31. You'll have to give me a bit more help. Which point are you supposedly refreshing my memory about?
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:51 AM
May 2016

All that OP says about an exit poll is "Pennsylvania Exit Poll - 12% of Democrats are under 30 years old!!!!!"

Was there some dispute about age of Democrats that that poll supposedly settled?

And of all the primaries to date, was the Pennsylvania exit poll the only exit poll cited by Hillary supporters before this one?

 

egalitegirl

(362 posts)
3. Do you want the law to be changed?
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:34 AM
May 2016

Do you want the change the law to disallow Trump voters from voting in elections? Answer yes or no. BTW, Hillary won with money from Goldman Sachs wherever she won.

whatchamacallit

(15,558 posts)
5. Blah blah blah
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:35 AM
May 2016

Now tell us out the other side of your mouth why it's great when Hillary goes after republican support...

 

GummyBearz

(2,931 posts)
7. "Mischievous" Trump supporters...
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:36 AM
May 2016

Maybe they were independent leaning people that want actual change instead of the status quo? That group is large and they would go for Bernie or Trump before Hillary

Shemp Howard

(889 posts)
42. You've got it exactly right!
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:10 AM
May 2016

The so-called Trump supporters who voted for Bernie are, by and large, not secret conservatives. They are working-class people who are tired of the 1% getting richer (Hillary included there) while everyone else is getting poorer.

I'm seeing that where I live. Unionized factories are closing down, and are being replaced by strip malls that offer part-time work only. Bernie is seen is the best bet to fix that. But Trump is seen as a close second. Many of my long-time liberal blue-collar friends are talking Bernie, and they are talking Trump.

There is no enthusiasm for Hillary. She is seen as more of the same.

 

lumberjack_jeff

(33,224 posts)
8. Democrats without Sanders will lose West Virginia
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:38 AM
May 2016

I think it's stunning the degree to which Clinton supporters put her interests above those of the party, the country or its citizens.

Renew Deal

(81,877 posts)
22. The republicans didn't have a competitive race
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:44 AM
May 2016

And based on your logic, Democrats lose 40 states this year because more republicans voted in them.

 

ieoeja

(9,748 posts)
11. What percentage of Hillary voters will vote Trump in the GE?
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:38 AM
May 2016

We know that a lot of them voted for McCain in 2008.

And, no, neither time was it "operation chaos". West Virginia Democrats are very Conservative. They vote in the Democratic primary to get the desired legislators, gubernatorial, etc candidates. A lot of those voters are going to vote for the Republican presidential candidate, but still voting for Democrats in the other races.


thesquanderer

(11,993 posts)
44. 10% of Clinton voters in WV said they would vote for Trump in November. And in a way, that's worse,
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:13 AM
May 2016

because Clinton will actually presumably be on the ballot in November, whereas Sanders will likely not. That is, many Sanders voters who said they would vote for Trump in November probably assumed they would not have the opportunity to vote for Sanders in November, whereas Clinton voters would not be operating under a similar assumption.

FBaggins

(26,762 posts)
14. Let's hope you're not whining the same thing in November
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:41 AM
May 2016

"Trump would have lost without the Bernie supporters that Hillary shunned"

Renew Deal

(81,877 posts)
17. Hillary has not shunned anyone
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:42 AM
May 2016

Unlike Bernie, she said she wants everyone to support her. No purity tests needed.

FBaggins

(26,762 posts)
25. The funny thing is that you seem to think that Hillary supporters get to decide that.
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:47 AM
May 2016

What matters is what the Bernie supporters believe.

 

peace13

(11,076 posts)
16. Think about it. If you want Trump to win you would vote for Hill.
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:41 AM
May 2016

Trump will do better against Hill than he will against Bernie. Bernie stomped her because people don't want Hillary, they want Bernie!

uponit7771

(90,364 posts)
37. +1, they've stopped listening to even themselves... I'm done with em... I thought I was more
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:56 AM
May 2016

... patient but when people stop listening to what comes out of their own mouths they're sure not going to listen to what comes out of any one else's.

 

peace13

(11,076 posts)
40. Ahhh no. The headline is Trump supporters vote for Bernie.
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:02 AM
May 2016

That is against their best interest. Read what I wrote. Trump supporters vote for Hill....now that is a game Trump can win.

Demsrule86

(68,696 posts)
30. I am convinced that Bernie
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:50 AM
May 2016

would lose the general badly...the new McGovern...thus I will stick with Hillary. In less than a month, your delusion will end...as Hillary finishes the last primary and is ahead in the delegate count. No super will vote against the will of the voters.

 

peace13

(11,076 posts)
38. Call it what you will.
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:59 AM
May 2016

I will forgive you for your rudeness. What I won't forgive is the living hell we will be put through if she is the candidate for the GE. It is lose lose in that senario.

Autumn

(45,120 posts)
23. It was ABBH, given what she said about putting the coal mines out of business and the
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:45 AM
May 2016

coal miners out of work. She lost that one fair and square. I wouldn't vote for anyone who threatened to do away with my job either. As for her retraining idea. Retraining for what? McDonalds? You don't say something like that unless you have specifics.

onehandle

(51,122 posts)
26. The GOP clearly wants Bernie to be their opposition, no matter who they nominate.
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:48 AM
May 2016

They called Obama a Socialist, but Bernie is on camera calling himself a Socialist over and over.

The ads write themselves:

[img][/img]

KingFlorez

(12,689 posts)
41. Of course
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:04 AM
May 2016

Sanders pulled in a lot of voters who are not going to vote Democratic in the general election. That's really not impressive at all.

GreatGazoo

(3,937 posts)
47. excuses aren't going to win this thing for Hill any faster than insults did
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:23 AM
May 2016

Clinton's failure to win in WV is not Bernie's fault

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
50. She lost West Virginia so you need to come up with some reason for that, I get that.
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:45 AM
May 2016

It amazes me that in States like WV, where 30% turnout among registered voters is considered to be very high turnout anyone can buy into theories involving highly committed, organized masses of voters crossing to vote for the other Party in some contrived scheme to alter the outcome. If such things were actual electoral realities any Party or candidate could erase such possible influence simply by turning out more voters. 70% of registered voters did not even vote. The winner of both Party primaries, as always was Apathy. 70% chose silence. 70% of all registered voters left their vote on the table. That's not even talking about eligible but not registered voters of which WV has more than they have voters. Yeah.

I'd say focus on all those votes laying around, sleeping on sofas and binge watching Game of Thrones instead of casting a ballot and all these dramatic theories would become moot. Of course that takes work, in advance and in this case in WV and who the fuck wants to go organize there, eh? Apparently not the Clinton campaign.....

 

B Calm

(28,762 posts)
53. And if every primary were open Hillary would have dropped out after NY. Tax payers
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:49 AM
May 2016

fund these primaries and should have the right to vote for the candidate that inspires them!

-none

(1,884 posts)
57. ^^^ This^^^
Wed May 11, 2016, 12:24 PM
May 2016

Closed primaries and reworked voter rolls are the only way Hillary gets anything. I hesitate to call it a win when many thousands of voters are denied their chance to vote.

Open primaries - It is the people as a whole that matter. Not a Right-wing authoritarian party hack, backing a Center-Right, or a Right-Center candidate, at the expense of all other candidates running. The people deserve a choice, not a single someone picked by the party leaders.

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