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kcjohn1

(751 posts)
Thu May 26, 2016, 07:35 PM May 2016

Hill Supporters: In case of recommendation of indictment by FBI, do you agree she should step aside?

If Trump/GOP is such a terrible threat, we can't possible nominate candidate who could be convicted of felony...

I'm surprised this question is not even raised in the main stream media.

63 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Hill Supporters: In case of recommendation of indictment by FBI, do you agree she should step aside? (Original Post) kcjohn1 May 2016 OP
It ain't happenin', let it go. seabeyond May 2016 #1
Really? Would you bet your house on it? kcjohn1 May 2016 #5
yup. I would. seabeyond May 2016 #9
You can get good odds here kcjohn1 May 2016 #16
You should take those odds to Vegas, seriously you could be very wealthy. LOL B Calm May 2016 #63
You want to bet YOUR house on her being indicted? Lil Missy May 2016 #12
Definitely not kcjohn1 May 2016 #19
in case aliens abduct Bernie and clone him, should his votes count double? nt geek tragedy May 2016 #2
Message auto-removed Name removed May 2016 #23
I refuse to comment on bad alternate history science fiction. Agnosticsherbet May 2016 #3
I was about to say you just did mindwalker_i May 2016 #32
If Bernie is disqualified because he didn't hand over taxes what will you do? Ohioblue22 May 2016 #4
If Bernie was indicted or facing indictment, he shouldn't be running for president. kcjohn1 May 2016 #7
That isn't what I asked Ohioblue22 May 2016 #10
I don't know what you are getting at kcjohn1 May 2016 #22
My point is that hillary is as likely to be taken out of the running for that as Bernie is for his t Ohioblue22 May 2016 #24
Your point is to compare apples and oranges. cui bono May 2016 #46
No It isn't it doesnt fit your narrative so your just trying to dimiss it by calling it Ohioblue22 May 2016 #50
So you think a candidate not releasing tax records... tex-wyo-dem May 2016 #56
I'm saying she's not getting indicated sorry but your dream is dead Ohioblue22 May 2016 #62
Message auto-removed Name removed May 2016 #26
They'll ride right off the cliff with her and Debbie berni_mccoy May 2016 #6
LOL - That looks like Susan Sarandon and Sanders! SharonClark May 2016 #11
I'm not dumb enough to fall for the Indictment Fairy meme. Lil Missy May 2016 #8
I think you got your answer, kcjohn1, unfortunately! nt Duval May 2016 #13
John.. HRC is like a rubber ball in the ocean Peacetrain May 2016 #14
The FBI is not a republican congressional committee of idiots. BillZBubb May 2016 #18
I have yet to read anything that says they are coming up with an Peacetrain May 2016 #20
She went way beyond what Powell or Rice did. Way beyond. BillZBubb May 2016 #40
She had her own server in order to keep her emails from FOIA requests and such. NO ONE ELSE DID THAT cui bono May 2016 #47
Rice and Powell didn't have unauthorized basement servers. HooptieWagon May 2016 #58
Civics lesson for all those drooling okasha May 2016 #15
Diverting away from the subject won't make this matter go away kcjohn1 May 2016 #21
Such a case would be a prosecutors nightmare. okasha May 2016 #29
That's nonsense. It would be easy to find a Grand Jury. It always is. BillZBubb May 2016 #41
Wrong on all counts. okasha May 2016 #43
Sorry, but you are wrong on all counts, especially about Hillary. She's a trainwreck. BillZBubb May 2016 #44
Meanwhile, in the real world..... okasha May 2016 #45
Oh please. Of course the FBI doesn't indict anyone. BillZBubb May 2016 #25
+1 No matter what happens, Hill's brand is damaged goods going into the GE. GreenPartyVoter May 2016 #60
Message auto-removed Name removed May 2016 #28
JUNE 14 MFM008 May 2016 #17
Party! DawgHouse May 2016 #48
It has been mentioned on Mainstream Media, although not a whole lot. n/t truedelphi May 2016 #27
Message auto-removed Name removed May 2016 #30
Considering there is no evidence any witness has been in front of a Grand Jury, pnwmom May 2016 #31
That is because investigation is not even finished kcjohn1 May 2016 #33
The only reason they would have waited is if they weren't finding anything they needed pnwmom May 2016 #34
That is not how it works kcjohn1 May 2016 #36
All that is true but it doesn't mean that a Grand Jury can't be convened to be part pnwmom May 2016 #38
Grand juries main function is subpoenaes prior to indictment kcjohn1 May 2016 #39
*CLAP*CLAP*CLAP*CLAP*CLAP*CLAP*CLAP*CLAP*CLAP* Tarc May 2016 #35
It is very sad Trenzalore May 2016 #37
Perhaps if Hillary had been honest about her server, the will of the people would've been different BillZBubb May 2016 #42
Hillary? Honest? HooptieWagon May 2016 #59
If she's convicted, they'll argue she should stay in it until all appeals are exhausted. Scuba May 2016 #49
I'm a Sanders supporter, and I think the question is unreasonable. RiverNoord May 2016 #51
Bernie supporters, what if Hillary steps aside after the nomination 6chars May 2016 #52
Message auto-removed Name removed May 2016 #53
Been registered for 30 minutes, and all you can post is 'go to Free Republic'? HooptieWagon May 2016 #54
well themonster May 2016 #55
They would have to find INTENTIONAL leaking or GROSS negligence that resulted in ACTUAL BootinUp May 2016 #57
They uniformly fail to understand that concept. In fact, most of their COLGATE4 May 2016 #61

kcjohn1

(751 posts)
5. Really? Would you bet your house on it?
Thu May 26, 2016, 07:38 PM
May 2016

It is one thing to say its unlikely, but there is 0%> chance it does. Otherwise why would FBI be spending 12months investigating if there is nothing there?

kcjohn1

(751 posts)
19. Definitely not
Thu May 26, 2016, 07:46 PM
May 2016

I think non indictment is more likely outcome. But this individual thinks its 0% likely. My gut and the betting markets seem to think its 33% chance of indictment.

Response to geek tragedy (Reply #2)

kcjohn1

(751 posts)
22. I don't know what you are getting at
Thu May 26, 2016, 07:53 PM
May 2016

For example if there were wall-street transcripts that Bernie was hiding because it was too damaging, I would not think it was good idea of him to be running for president.

 

Ohioblue22

(1,430 posts)
24. My point is that hillary is as likely to be taken out of the running for that as Bernie is for his t
Thu May 26, 2016, 07:57 PM
May 2016

Taxes

 

Ohioblue22

(1,430 posts)
50. No It isn't it doesnt fit your narrative so your just trying to dimiss it by calling it
Fri May 27, 2016, 11:14 AM
May 2016

Apples and oranges

tex-wyo-dem

(3,190 posts)
56. So you think a candidate not releasing tax records...
Fri May 27, 2016, 11:40 AM
May 2016

Is at the same level as a candidate that knowingly broke security rules and may have compromised national security and lied constantly about it?

Ok

Response to kcjohn1 (Reply #22)

Lil Missy

(17,865 posts)
8. I'm not dumb enough to fall for the Indictment Fairy meme.
Thu May 26, 2016, 07:41 PM
May 2016

And, the media are smart enough to know there was no crime for which she could be indicted. That's why they haven't suggested it.

I'll sure be glad when you guys won't be able to post this delusional shit anymore. Soon ....

Peacetrain

(22,877 posts)
14. John.. HRC is like a rubber ball in the ocean
Thu May 26, 2016, 07:42 PM
May 2016

they keep trying to push her down.. and she keeps bobbing back up.. after that 11 hours of testimony and the republican inquisition fell apart.. I knew then.. if she made it all the way .. she would be unstoppable.. she was not my first choice.. but she keeps bouncing back

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
18. The FBI is not a republican congressional committee of idiots.
Thu May 26, 2016, 07:46 PM
May 2016

The FBI investigation is not an inquisition. There is prima facie evidence that Hillary committed a crime or crimes. If the FBI recommends indictment, she won't bounce back.

Peacetrain

(22,877 posts)
20. I have yet to read anything that says they are coming up with an
Thu May 26, 2016, 07:49 PM
May 2016

indictment.. yes she screwed up.. but indictable.. then they will have to go back and indict Powell.. and Rice.. not seeing it

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
40. She went way beyond what Powell or Rice did. Way beyond.
Thu May 26, 2016, 11:46 PM
May 2016

She put all of her personal and work email on a private server. Nobody had ever done that. She didn't have permission and had been warned about security, but did it anyway. In Powell's case everyone at State knew and was OK with what he was doing. It was when email was just starting to be popular and Powell was trying to get the Department to adopt the technology.

You won't read about an indictment until it happens. The FBI will not speak about the case until a determination is made. There are now too many grounds for indictment to simply dismiss this. Even the IG report, though it didn't address criminality, stated Hillary broke the law. The FBI knows that too.

cui bono

(19,926 posts)
47. She had her own server in order to keep her emails from FOIA requests and such. NO ONE ELSE DID THAT
Fri May 27, 2016, 12:30 AM
May 2016

It's not the same situation at all.

.

 

HooptieWagon

(17,064 posts)
58. Rice and Powell didn't have unauthorized basement servers.
Fri May 27, 2016, 11:43 AM
May 2016

Rice and Powell weren't exchanging classified information with an uncleared aide the POTUS forbid them to hire. And most important, Rice and Powell weren't trying to duck FOIA filings that might expose a billions of dollars quid pro quo money-laundering operation.

okasha

(11,573 posts)
15. Civics lesson for all those drooling
Thu May 26, 2016, 07:43 PM
May 2016

at the thought of an FBI "reccommendation of indictment:"

The FBI doesn't do that. Grand Juries indict.

No wonder Sanders fans have such trouble getting themselves properly registered to vote. Learn the damn process!

kcjohn1

(751 posts)
21. Diverting away from the subject won't make this matter go away
Thu May 26, 2016, 07:51 PM
May 2016

Of course only grand juries can indict.

My wording was that FBI at the end of its investigation, can take the case to the justice department for them to pursue legal avenues.

You avoided the question, if this happens (indictment), what are your thoughts on who should the dems run against Trump.

okasha

(11,573 posts)
29. Such a case would be a prosecutors nightmare.
Thu May 26, 2016, 08:04 PM
May 2016

Where would the prosecutor come up with unbiased Grand Jurors? They'd have to draft a bunch of Trappist monks. Maybe a flock of penguins.

Ain't gonna happen.

But if Hillary had to drop out for any reason, her place would be taken by the person to whom she released her delegates, most likely Biden or Kerry. It wouldn't be Sanders.

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
41. That's nonsense. It would be easy to find a Grand Jury. It always is.
Thu May 26, 2016, 11:52 PM
May 2016

Maybe you need a civics lesson?

If Hillary drops out before the nomination, Bernie Sanders will be the Democratic nominee. It won't matter who she wants it to be. If she is forced out after the nomination, the shit hits the fan and the Democratic nominee loses, no matter who it is.

okasha

(11,573 posts)
43. Wrong on all counts.
Fri May 27, 2016, 12:08 AM
May 2016

I've worked for a prosecutor and served on a federal grand jury. It's hard enough to seat a petit jury when a well-known person is the defendant. Seating a larger impartial grand jury for a candidate for President would put most of the lawyers I know under their desks in the fetal position.

I find it a little--off-balance, shall we say?--that so many who claim to be Democrats are eager to see our best hope of defeating Trump in prison or fatally ill.

It would upset me considerably more if I thought they actually were Democrats.

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
44. Sorry, but you are wrong on all counts, especially about Hillary. She's a trainwreck.
Fri May 27, 2016, 12:13 AM
May 2016

You just don't see it yet.

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
25. Oh please. Of course the FBI doesn't indict anyone.
Thu May 26, 2016, 07:57 PM
May 2016

The FBI, working with a team of prosecutors from the Department of Justice conduct the investigation. The FBI and the prosecutors determine if sufficient evidence exist to warrant an indictment. Their findings go the Attorney General who will make the decision on whether to pursue an indictment.

What we are talking about is this: If the FBI and the prosecutors working with them recommend to the AG to pursue an indictment, Hillary is finished. Period.

If the DoJ prosecutors working with the FBI split from the FBI on the merits of an indictment, someone in the FBI will make that public. Then the DoJ will be accused of a cover up. And Hillary will be badly hurt. There will be a congressional investigation and it will get very messy.

So, yeah what the FBI does is the key here. Their findings are what matters. What the DoJ decides is secondary.

Response to okasha (Reply #15)

Response to kcjohn1 (Original post)

pnwmom

(108,980 posts)
31. Considering there is no evidence any witness has been in front of a Grand Jury,
Thu May 26, 2016, 08:06 PM
May 2016

it seems more and more unlikely. This is from May 25:

http://www.wsj.com/articles/watchdog-faults-hillary-clinton-email-practices-at-state-department-1464188308

There has been no indication a grand jury has heard evidence from anyone in the matter—a necessary step before the consideration of an indictment.

kcjohn1

(751 posts)
33. That is because investigation is not even finished
Thu May 26, 2016, 08:07 PM
May 2016

They have yet to interview the person of most interest.

When that happens, we will know which direction this will go.

pnwmom

(108,980 posts)
34. The only reason they would have waited is if they weren't finding anything they needed
Thu May 26, 2016, 08:11 PM
May 2016

to bring before a Grand Jury.

And talking to Hillary is unlikely to change that.

(And a Grand Jury is part of the investigation process. It doesn't have to wait till all the interviews are over.)

kcjohn1

(751 posts)
36. That is not how it works
Thu May 26, 2016, 08:19 PM
May 2016

If you there are multiple players, and the person of target is A, you don't talk to A first, especially when A is high profiled politician with the best lawyers in the country.

You talk to everyone else first, and then with all the facts, you interview that person from position of strength as you may only get 1 chance with that individual. Here is how recent AP article described it.

That signals that agents will probably seek to interview Clinton soon, if they haven't already, former Justice Department officials told The Associated Press. The FBI's standard practice is to save questioning the person at the center of an investigation for last, once it has gathered available facts from others.

pnwmom

(108,980 posts)
38. All that is true but it doesn't mean that a Grand Jury can't be convened to be part
Thu May 26, 2016, 08:21 PM
May 2016

of the investigation -- before the "target" is interviewed.

But the FBI has never said that Hillary is a target. That was your word.

kcjohn1

(751 posts)
39. Grand juries main function is subpoenaes prior to indictment
Thu May 26, 2016, 08:23 PM
May 2016

Not sure if FBI needed any as they have had access to all the material

Trenzalore

(2,331 posts)
37. It is very sad
Thu May 26, 2016, 08:19 PM
May 2016

That your only hope is not that the will of the people is heard but that your opponent faces misfortune.

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
42. Perhaps if Hillary had been honest about her server, the will of the people would've been different
Thu May 26, 2016, 11:56 PM
May 2016

If people knew she had a good chance of being indicted, they may have had second thoughts about her electability.

The opponents misfortune has been brought on by her underhanded actions. Our misfortune is that the party's nominee will be under criminal indictment and lead to a disaster on election day. You are willing to take that risk. Many of us are not.

 

RiverNoord

(1,150 posts)
51. I'm a Sanders supporter, and I think the question is unreasonable.
Fri May 27, 2016, 11:17 AM
May 2016

The possibility exists, and we'll all have to deal with it if it does. But putting the question that way to Hillary Clinton supporters is just a provocation to piss people off.

6chars

(3,967 posts)
52. Bernie supporters, what if Hillary steps aside after the nomination
Fri May 27, 2016, 11:18 AM
May 2016

would that please you? what if she steps aside and says "In consultation with the DNC, I have decided that my good friend Debbie Wasserman Shultz will step in and continue this campaign."

Response to kcjohn1 (Original post)

 

HooptieWagon

(17,064 posts)
54. Been registered for 30 minutes, and all you can post is 'go to Free Republic'?
Fri May 27, 2016, 11:35 AM
May 2016

Are you trying to drum up business for them?

themonster

(137 posts)
55. well
Fri May 27, 2016, 11:39 AM
May 2016

I voted for Hillary in the primary and will vote for her in the Presidential election. I think the chances of the FBI recommending an indictment is very unlikely. If they did, then Hillary should step aside.

BootinUp

(47,158 posts)
57. They would have to find INTENTIONAL leaking or GROSS negligence that resulted in ACTUAL
Fri May 27, 2016, 11:43 AM
May 2016

harm. You are dreaming if you think that might happen at this point.

COLGATE4

(14,732 posts)
61. They uniformly fail to understand that concept. In fact, most of their
Fri May 27, 2016, 12:03 PM
May 2016

'expert' posters conflate gross negligence (the standard to be met) with orginary negligence, not understanding the difference between the two. All those prongs have to be met and they won't be.

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