2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumAm I the only one not super-excited about GropeGate?
Last edited Sat Oct 8, 2016, 04:33 PM - Edit history (1)
I hate to be a debbie downer, but I am kind of annoyed about this scandal because it means that Hillary can't win.
I don't mean that she won't be elected president. I think she will barring some earth-shattering revelation, which is unlikely but not impossible given all the leaks of private e-mails and conversations.
But the fallout from the Billy Bush audio makes it easy to frame the election as Trump losing rather than Hillary winning. It detracts from the significance of the first woman president being elected, and it makes it harder for her to claim a mandate for her leadership and agenda. She will now essentially win by default, because too many people consider Trump unacceptable. And it will mean little to no honeymoon period.
It pisses me off, because she was going to win anyway, and didn't need this to detract from her accomplishment.
book_worm
(15,951 posts)democrattotheend
(11,605 posts)But this makes it a lot worse. I am also worried about complacency if her winning is seemingly inevitable.
alcibiades_mystery
(36,437 posts)Keep telling yourself that.
So pathetic.
politicaljunkie41910
(3,335 posts)a blowout mandate. In fact he used to say that he had a mandate. i.e. The voters sent me here to cut taxes, etc. I have capital and I'm going to spend it. The voters sent me here to do xyz. He was constantly making statements like this by someone who had lost the popular vote and won the state of Florida with the help of this brother Jeb the Governor, and the Florida Sec. of State, and the SCOTUS by one vote.
democrattotheend
(11,605 posts)Bush lost the popular vote and governed like he won in a landslide.
Obama did win in a landslide but nonetheless tried to reach out & work with Republicans, and they repaid him by trying to delegitimize him at every chance.
stopbush
(24,396 posts)democrattotheend
(11,605 posts)And tell me not to contact you? What have I ever done to you?
Response to alcibiades_mystery (Reply #3)
rbrnmw This message was self-deleted by its author.
GeorgeGist
(25,321 posts)on his way down.
upaloopa
(11,417 posts)BlueMTexpat
(15,369 posts)jalan48
(13,869 posts)unblock
(52,243 posts)Hillary could win 538 electoral votes and they'd still find a way to obstruct everything she proposes and malign everything she does.
It's who they are and has nothing to do with trump's meltdown.
Codeine
(25,586 posts)of your bullshit. She's smart enough to know a winner when she sees one.
Hillary has had this in the bag for months, your concern notwithstanding.
jcgoldie
(11,631 posts)Nice try.
democrattotheend
(11,605 posts)Why does everyone think I have a hidden agenda?
UCmeNdc
(9,600 posts)The Democratic Party should lay into the GOP incompetence. See it is a matter of framing. The whole GOP is incompetent. That is why they cannot pass any judicial judges. Vote the Democratic candidates in and watch how smooth the country runs. messaging!
Wednesdays
(17,380 posts)ismnotwasm
(41,984 posts)No subsequental happening has convinced me otherwise
democrattotheend
(11,605 posts)I am not saying that she won't be elected. I am saying that it will be viewed as Trump losing because of this tape instead of her winning, which sucks because she was going to win anyway.
Moonwalk
(2,322 posts)...against some Republican powerhouse that no one thought she would win against. But that's not the game she's in. So. Yes. The media and most of the GOP faithful (who don't like Trump) and many swing voters will say, "She won because Trump was so awful everyone threw their vote at her." And? Will she be any less PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES because of this?
I know, I know, you understand that, but still can't help feeling depressed about how this looks. But I have a way for you to feel better. It's very simple and it works incredibly well. Anytime you think "but they won't see this as a real win..." or something like that, say to yourself these two magic words:
SUPREME COURT.
My point being: to me, Hillary's win is going to be the greatest and most wonderful win ever simply because...SUPREME COURT. That is how you need to see it. Next time something like this worries you, and before you post any post about it, say those two words to yourself. Like a mantra: SUPREME COURT. Because all that other stuff worrying you...it's petty. Moot. Insignificant. You need to be reminded of the big picture. That whatever people think, it doesn't change the legacy she now has a chance to leave. A long and powerful one. SUPREME COURT. Say it. Breathe it in and out a few times. Meditate on it. Remember it. It will put your mind at peace, I promise.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Still probably a longshot, but wouldn't that be something?
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Hoping to see NV polls in a few days, but that's my gut. We've got Harry's seat now.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)bettyellen
(47,209 posts)geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Demsrule86
(68,578 posts)Those are doctored emails first of all so yes, it is impossible. Winning is everything...think about this before being all upset and 'concerned'...this may very well hand us the Senate and the House.
democrattotheend
(11,605 posts)I actually think it could go the other way: give downballot Republicans cover to distance themselves from Trump, let them make the argument about a GOP House and Senate as a check on Hillary (as they did in 1996, effectively, when it was clear Dole was going to lose), and make Dems complacent and less likely to turn out because they assume Hillary has it in the bag.
Has it been confirmed that all of the leaked Podesta e-mails were doctored? If so, I'd be more excited about that than the Trump audio, as it would discredit anything that comes from Wikileaks over the next few weeks.
Demsrule86
(68,578 posts)ever be worth a damn again...he sold out to the Russians. Who cares what WIKI leaks at this point? If Hillary starts winning by a wide margin she could take the House with her...I have never seen you happy with Trump losing...there is always a
'but' and a concern. I just want Hillary elected as the first woman president...and don't care what the Gop says about this. She will be a great president and save the progressive movement.
smorkingapple
(827 posts)That fucking term better be coming out of every fucking Democrats mouth for the 1st 6 months of her Presidency to help combat the obstructionism of the R's.
And heaven forbid she gets less than 50%. They'll use that to try to de-legitimize her.
sarae
(3,284 posts)It would be ignoring reality to say that this is what caused it.
democrattotheend
(11,605 posts)She was going to win anyway, and I will be really pissed off if her victory is attributed to Trump's sex scandal rather than her own accomplishments.
sarae
(3,284 posts)well, if that happens, at least we'll have hard evidence we can point to that she was ahead before this happened.
The way things have been trending, however, it's a sad truth that facts mean nothing to some people.
DarthDem
(5,255 posts)Concernedly yours,
Me
LexVegas
(6,067 posts)Sounds stupid, huh?
mucifer
(23,545 posts)We might get the senate.
Means to an end.
The Polls were pretty close before the first debate.
Consider the big picture.
Music Man
(1,184 posts)It's almost like it's destiny.
Enjoy it, for crying out loud!
treestar
(82,383 posts)still_one
(92,201 posts)Jim Lane
(11,175 posts)Codeine
(25,586 posts)are people like you and your fake concern trolling.
nolabear
(41,969 posts)Things begin with her election. They don't end with them.
Moonwalk
(2,322 posts)nolabear
(41,969 posts)jalan48
(13,869 posts)"At least he/she isn't as bad as Trump".
ibegurpard
(16,685 posts)People are fucking PISSED OFF about it. As they should be.
qwlauren35
(6,148 posts)Maybe she won't get the glory on November 9th, but the inauguration will be dynamic, sensational, and memorable. For 4-8 years, people will be talking about her as the first woman president, good and bad (secret service, death threats, etc.).
As long as she wins by 1% or more, and it's uncontestable, I will be happy.
pnwmom
(108,978 posts)the wonderful pre-debate timing of the release of the audio tape.
Hillary-the-all-powerful did this!
treestar
(82,383 posts)beachbum bob
(10,437 posts)thats the way sports AND politics works
tgards79
(1,415 posts)Let's just be glad Hillary will win and name some justices. Let's not get fancy about it. She is going to have a huge margin, that will be great.
wildeyed
(11,243 posts)And it paints a vivid, beautiful portrait of the difference between the two candidates and parties, for anyone who was still confused about that.
The things Trump said are things we knew all along, at least anyone who paid attention. And the other GOOPers were his enablers, people who on some fundamental level also think women are objects who only matter in relationship to their own needs. All the faux outrage from GOP men about how they are SO offended because they have wives, daughters, and mothers? Same damn thing. Women only matter in relationship to ME.
People are finally tuning into that reality. And Clinton is looking sooooo good in comparison. This just highlights her poise and accomplishments for the ones who don't pay much attention to politics. Notice how she is just sitting back, hands off the wheel, letting the GOP run themselves into the ditch and looking so presidential doing it?