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DonViejo

(60,536 posts)
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 06:22 PM Oct 2013

No, the “system” didn’t cause the shutdown — it was extreme GOP nuts!


We've had divided government for years, and there are usually no calamities. The GOP has changed -- and it's broken

BY JONATHAN BERNSTEIN


OK, everyone: Stop trying to figure out how to fix the system in order to prevent future government shutdowns. It’s not the system that’s the problem; it’s the broken Republican Party. If your reform isn’t about that, then good or bad, it’s just not relevant to the current situation.

Yes, I’m looking at you, Paul “get rid of the filibuster” Starr. And you, Ryan “bring back earmarks” Lizza. And a whole bunch of people who think the California top-two primary is the right ticket – Reid Wilson, Adam Nagourney, Amy Walters. Oh, and then there’s a whole bunch of people who just believe Madisonian institutions aren’t up to it. There’s more, both in those items and elsewhere. And some of the proposed reforms are great ideas (I like earmarks), even though some of them, such as changing primary election rules, not so much.

But the main thing is that none of these reforms, good or bad, have very much to do with the actual problem that caused the shutdown, which is a broken, dysfunctional Republican Party.

Is divided government the problem? Ever since 1955, we’ve had divided government more often than not. Beginning in 1981, there’s only been unified government in 1993-1994, 2003-2006 (plus a small sliver of 2001), and 2009-2010. And yet: despite all that divided government, there have only been extended government shutdowns three times, twice in 1995-1996 and then this month. Only in 2011, and again this month if we count it, has the debt limit deadline really been threatened. It’s not divided government.

more
http://www.salon.com/2013/10/19/no_the_system_didnt_cause_the_shutdown_it_was_extreme_gop_nuts/
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No, the “system” didn’t cause the shutdown — it was extreme GOP nuts! (Original Post) DonViejo Oct 2013 OP
K&R.. thanks DonViejo! Cha Oct 2013 #1
Kick~ sheshe2 Oct 2013 #2
Nice "no true scotsman" fallacy embedded there. Igel Oct 2013 #3
Exactly! Proud Liberal Dem Oct 2013 #4
Its both, the GOP is crazy, and, because of a flawed system, end up being empowered to shutdown... Humanist_Activist Oct 2013 #5

Igel

(35,317 posts)
3. Nice "no true scotsman" fallacy embedded there.
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 12:40 PM
Oct 2013

The debt limit's been threatened a few times. Once it even expired. We don't include that one because the deadline wasn't "really" threatened and that makes for cleaner, expurgated rhetoric. That demands have been included as the price of a budget or CR, or even a debt ceiling increase, is also ignored. These things happen. They happen at specific times for specific reasons, and those reasons haven't much changed over the last 40 years.

He didn't write the article he could have written. Instead he went for the low-hanging, incredibly tasty--albeit mostly irrelevant--fruit.

I prefer to think of the Republicans as "uppity" and "ungrateful." Like any minority that's disenfranchised and respected more in the rhetoric of those running them over than in what they consider important, seeing nothing in the system to defend they not only fail to defend the system but have no problem with running it into the ground. Sensitized, they start hearing dog whistles where none are intended; they also hear intended jibes that the majority fails to hear.

Nationwide public workers strikes are the same. Huge economic loss, massive inconvenience, but their goals are worth any(body else's) sacrifice. Same for teacher strikes. In some countries, healthcare workers strikes. Steel unions tried to strike during wartime because they felt oppressed, not getting their due, and even if it meant an steel supply when we were experimenting with concrete boats, that was okay.

The typical response is to point out how powerful this dog-wagging ass of a minority is, how much has been given them when they don't deserve it, point out all the times we-the-majority have been gracious and understanding and put up with their childishness (because "adult minority = child" is a deeply rooted metaphor in our culture). Finally we insist on being the parents to their infantilism, to break up the treasonous groups standing in the way of the just majority, to silence them, marginalize them, and, when we're tired, of criminalizing them. Like that works. Especially in a "democracy" that aims to represent all of the people instead of "wee-the-people".

Proud Liberal Dem

(24,414 posts)
4. Exactly!
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 03:00 PM
Oct 2013

What Boehner, Cantor, et. al used to engineer this debacle- the rule change in the House that prevented anybody but him or Cantor from bringing anything to a vote and Boehner's unwavering allegiance to a rule that wasn't really a rule ("Hastert Rule&quot - was what caused everything. Having a "debt ceiling" law doesn't help things either when some members of Congress are perfectly willing to prevent it from being raised as leverage for getting what they want but, of course, nobody seriously played around with not actually raising it until 2011 regardless of who was in charge. I wouldn't have begrudged Boehner and the House GOP a SINGLE frivolous vote to get their insanity out of their system but once the Senate stripped the defunding Obamacare language and sent it back to the House, they should've just passed it and sent it on so as to prevent the shutdown. Also, I don't really care if most Republicans vote against raising the debt ceiling as long as they allow it to finally pass in the end like it needed to be. Republicans need to win elections if they want their agenda passed just like Democrats and if we have divided government both sides need to work together to get things done in order to keep government functioning correctly. Elections come and go but the business of running the country goes on no matter who is in charge. Democrats understand this. The Republican Tea Party evidently does not.

 

Humanist_Activist

(7,670 posts)
5. Its both, the GOP is crazy, and, because of a flawed system, end up being empowered to shutdown...
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 05:32 PM
Oct 2013

the government when they don't get their way.

Honestly, when this happens, new elections should be called, immediately, so voters can vote out the obstructionists, and so it will also serve as a deterrent in future sessions.

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